Nina going off today
Nina going off today
Cross-posted from "Nina going off today" by @seahorse@midwest.social in !antifascism@midwest.social
257 comments
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I was so, so very close to directly calling jordanlund a shitlib after it was almost certainly him who mod deleted my comment, in my own thread, in .world, stating that, speaking from a historical standpoint, the only thing that stops fascists is bullets in their brains.
He of course interpreted that as 'advocating violence', because ... he is a shitlib.
But instead, I composed myself and wrote a more eloquent explanation as to why my comment had been deleted... and, so far, at least that response hasn't been deleted.
Why not post to power tripping bastards?
Because we already know the .world mod/admin team is a bunch of shit lib collaborators from how they acted when Luigi was framed for shooting some asshole who murdered tens of thousands of people by overseeing the denial of their healthcare.
Sorry to rant but goddamnit am I on the exact same wavelength as this post right now.
Jordan, if you read this, go fuck yourself and keep telling yourself Warren was a better choice than Bernie, you slimy rat fuck.
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Jordan probably is reading this, he loves scanning comments for people talking about him and then whining about it. Same for a few other common .world users.
But man, Jordan literally banned one of my favorite users from a community because they caught Jodan lying about his poitions and documenting the fact the Dems actively did not care about the lives of brown people home and abroad and queer folk.
.world is a shitlib encampment.
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The other day I suggested there is a lack of self awareness amongst the more brigadier types and they're still messaging me demanding what I meant by that. Like I posted this morning and within minutes I get a new message trying to go back into it.
Some folks are just not equipped to operate outside of communities they don't control and moderate.
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I think I vaguely remember that. I've said elsewhere it's to the point I'm beginning to wonder if that instance's mods and admins didn't have an agenda. Oddly enough, that was the first instance I tried to join and couldn't ever get approval, and I was still very much more entrenched in shitlib indoctrination.
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saying the only thing that stops fascists is bullets in their brains
So, first off, banning this as violence suggests stopping fascists is generally desirable; a position i don't think he shares.
Second: that's blatantly untrue. They're not, like, werewolves. Putting aside how that whole myth is an allegory for the abuse cycle and they kind of are. There's lots of places shooting them would work, depending on the bullet and availability of medical care. Plus, things other than bullets that worked. There's ectensive research by zukov et al suggesting it can be done with an artillery shell, and anecdotes from research in the pacific islands backing the 'sharp stick' hypothesis.
So maybe you're the real fascist.
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How do we know they aren't vampires? They cover their faces when inside and protect themselves from sunlight by wearing full military gear outside.
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I hereby repent before the supreme council of enlightened liberals for unintentionally using language which could possibly be interpreted as invoking an allegory which could possibly be interpreted as me advocating for, or suggesting the use, or evoking imagery of violence against furries, who are valid members of society that have for too long been unjustly forced out of public life.
I thus willingly submit myself to be bound inside the no holds barred yiff pit for a duration not exceeding 24 hrs, whereby my latent fascist tendencies will be expunged from me, and I shall emerge, born again, as a more tolerant member of society.
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Jordan Lund describes himself as "the whitest guy you're going to know."
And despite his politics, he struggles to find sympathy or kinship with the Black Lives Matter marchers who occasionally disrupt his commute home to protest police violence.
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This explains SO MUCH
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Here in my car,
I feel safest of all,
I can lock all my doors,
It's the only way to live!
In cars.
I wonder how many times he's commuted through Portland, via a road or highway that was built by eviscerating the historcal neighborhood of all the Black Portlanders he's never met, who don't live there any more, for some weird reason.
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I used to defend JordanLund when people called him a Zionist
After his recent actions banning anti-zionist voices on WorldNews, banning Independent media that reports on the genocide, and banning pro-palestinian emancipatory slogans, it's overwhelmingly obvious he is at the very least a Zionist Sympathizer
He's also terribly reactionary on many social issues
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Muh brotha!
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I hate being that cringe guy in the comments posting FD quotes, but this one is such a banger
Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will. Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows, or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress
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But in condemning violence it would be an act of irresponsibility not to be as strong in condemning the conditions in our society that cause people to feel so angry that they have no alternative but to engage in riots. What we must see is that a riot is the language of the unheard.
What is it that America has failed to hear? It has failed to hear that the plight of the Negro poor has worsened over the last 10 or 12 years. It's failed to hear that the promises of freedom and justice have not been met. It has failed to hear that large segments of white society are more concerned about tranquility and the status quo than about justice, equality, and humanity.
- MLK Jr
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Finally, an accurate use for the term "shitlib"
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well fucking said.
i never thought it would be so hard for libs to understand you can't vote fascism away. i never thought they would be rolling over to fascism so quickly.
what the fuck makes them not collaborators of this regime if they want to stop any sort of actual resistance.
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The lib politicians did not roll over to facism, they rolled over for money ... for loosely regulated and barely looked at Super PAC donations and withdrawals. They rolled over for legalized corruption. Fascism is just the gift wrap that they had to take those presents in.
This lady is kind of right. We are not likely to vote our way out of this.
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Their "plan" is just push back juuust enough to make you calm down and then they'll help entrench Nazism further.
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Neolibs are already super eager to work with the nazi elon. They want to follow him to the right like they did with netanyahu and manchin and lieberman.
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We can't help it, we need more theory according to one post, but critical reading and critical thinking are hard, especially when even secondary school reading comprehension has abysmal standards. I read better than most I know and struggle with it.
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theory can be packaged in an intuitive way for the masses.
thats literally the job of far right think tanks and leftist organizations alike. "you make a dime so boss can make a dollar" ain't rocket science either, its just that the fascists are currently winning.
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Fucking extremely this.
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🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
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God I love Nina, happy to see others are aware of her style.
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she just don't miss.
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Happy caik day to ye. May a brick fell a copper!
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Peaceful protest or "sitting it out" is when you have hope to last longer than the current crisis.
The current crisis, at least in the US, is not going to vanish that quickly. The real crisis is the dropping wages, and that's not gonna revert much. Socialism or barbarism!
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The moment the inconvenience of jail or ending up dying during an insurrection is better than the actual situation, shit is gonna spiral. People will riot violently, government is gonna fuck with the lives of folks who didn't, more will join, more will get fucked, and repeat until Donnie is no more.
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The moment the inconvenience of jail or ending up dying during an insurrection is better than the actual situation, shit is gonna spiral.
That is a sentiment that i kinda hear many people say these days ...
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I had this exact convo with a friend recently. Peaceful protest can work against a government with a
consciousconscience. The US gov’t has consistently shown to not have aconsciousconscience. My local organizers don’t really seem to get this, which just means they, and many of the general citizens they direct, will be underprepared for the conflict that will almost inevitably arise.-
I'm going to assume
conscious==conscience:)-
Looool yes oops ty. I butchered it and let autocorrect take over, and then it assumed I wanted that for the second time.
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Feel like they're ignoring the fact that these massive protests are a sign of contention and the point is to not devolve into complete violence. We do need to make it harder for him to convince others that we are not unruly people, but people protesting actual grievances.
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Lately people are starting to come around to ways social media makes people sick, and understanding consequences of the information age; from my experience the first casualty of this was not our attention spans, but our will to resist. Apparently just telling people your opinions on things anonymously gratifies your ego just enough without having to sign a petition, or stand outside in a line. "I'm so passionate about this subject I spend every waking moment talking about it online.; uh yeah I can't make it to the protest sorry, It's like a 30 minute drive and I have work in the morning."
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To be fair i do actually have work in the morning.
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Fight before your not able to
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Well yeah. It's possible for peaceful protests to work, but let's look at history. In reality, the pigs are going to get violent regardless of what anyone does, the national guard will be called out and they're going to use tear gas because their bosses want them to, and despite the fear of injury or death, large groups of people will keep working to make things better.
This is guaranteed to occur. For good or bad, whatever, it will happen. So let's stop worrying about certain outcomes and move our focus to the uncertain things.
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Absolutely right. Even Gavin Newsome is doing nothing but threatening to file a lawsuit. Buncha goddamn pussies. There is only ONE way to deal with Nazis and it isnt bEiNg pEaCeFuL
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What do you mean "even"? Gruesome Newsom is the shittiest lib of them all
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Fair point. Guess I was speaking to the shitlibs who will be clutching pearls while reading this thread
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What? So then how is this "absolutely right"?
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It is absolutely right to use direct action against the Nazis and stop trying to walk on eggshells to keep them from acting like Nazis. Nazis are gonna Nazi; you cannot appease them by being pacifists. The entire shitlib argument is fucking bullshit and is what gave us the fucking Nazis in the first place.
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For the few ppl advocating pacifism below, seems like a good time to read this:
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It has to get worse before it can get better. Violate.
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Educate me. I mean this with no hostility, and I'll be honest about the fact that I'm not an American and am seeing this from the outside. I'm not attacking anyone and I'm not defending any one stance, because I'd like to be educated and I'm not confident my news is giving me the whole picture.
Educate me.
Here's what I hear.
- American troops (including marines) have been deployed without the governor's consent (this sounds terrifying)
- This has been temporarily suspended because it was a hasty move and requires the governor's consent
- If this turns violent then it can be considered an insurrection (or meet whatever terms required to be considered) and the insurrection act can be invoked (this sounds terrifying) (why would you encourage violence in this circumstance?)
- I get how pacifism can be the wrong move in some circumstances, but this post sounds like it came from people wanting to stir the pot. And that's exactly what Trump would want, right?
Please spell it out for the rest of us. And how can I help?
Isn't this exactly what Trump would want? I may be missing the point here, and as an ally I don't mean to take anyone's energy away from far more important efforts.
Please educate me (if you can). Please fight for your rights!
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When people are having members of their community kidnapped at graduation ceremonies, hearing stories of secret police trying to enter elementary schools to abduct 1st graders, that affects you. Masked agents of the state who hide their identities are routinely disappearing people, and when communities respond to protect each other from abduction, or protest these monstrous actions, the police show up to disperse them so the kidnappers can do what they came to do. They routinely attack people unprovoked.
If you have never been to a protest where the cops decided to escalate, you cannot know how crystal clear the barbarity becomes. These cops have been pelting peaceful people with pepper balls, tear gas, concussion grenades, and baton rounds. According to a study, those "less lethal" rubber rounds permanently injure ~15% of the people hit by them. 3% are killed, eventually dying to injuries sustained.
Here's a video of someone being shot with one point blank for asking an officer to identify himself, who refuses to do so. Here's a police horse being used to trample a man that is already subdued and surrounded.
The other thing to understand is that while the outrageously ghoulish shit ICE and other state bodies have been getting up to, this situation with the police has been the status quo for a very long time. The same forces have been doing this shit to virtually every form of protest for ages. These are the same people that are responsible for the highest incarceration rate in the world, with a for-profit prison industry, and contracts to exploit incarcerated labour.
The point I'm trying to make here is that the situation is already incredibly violent, that violence has just been normalized, and people are literally trying to protect their neighbors from being kidnapped by the state. Communities have been experiencing relentless institutional and systemic oppression for generations. Appealing to the conscience of people brutalizing and kidnapping targeted groups on behalf of the state is a fool's errand, they clearly have none.
Asking people to remain completely peaceful is to ask them to sit back and watch their neighbors disappear. It's to ask them to passively watch as more people get subjected to greater levels of violence, to show up and be beaten themselves for daring to resist the expansion of fascism. Burnt Waymos and shattered glass can be replaced, rebuilt. Objects are not people, and it's overwhelmingly cops that have been damaging people.
I am not advocating for violence, but I think every person understands the innate urge to rebel against oppression. Whatever shape that takes, people that are not putting their bodies on the line do not get to tell those that are what to do.
There are also people who have no choice in the matter, their bodies are on the line either way because state agents have orders to take control of them in some way or other. Before you think to tell people what they should or should not do, take a moment to ask yourself how it would sound if it was you and yours in that position.
Beyond that, expecting that years of passivity will somehow pay off is absurd. If it worked, the situation would be getting better over time, not worse. This regime is going to escalate no matter what, it's already deporting dissidents and shipping innocent people off to foreign concentration camps. They're already actively trying to revoke citizenship from all sorts, unilaterally criminalizing completely law-abiding people overnight.
We know where this road leads. Whatever actions people take to shut it down, history will be on their side.
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My concern is that someone could bait violence too easily. Maybe this is not a conversation I can can be helpful in. I hope you all are safe! I hope you all take action to help you and others around you remain safe or find safety.
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Not OP but for your second bullet, the idea is that we're getting the insurrection act or martial law pretty much no matter what because trump wants it and is looking for any excuse.
So, if it's going to happen anyway, why not do it on our terms?
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That's a pretty important point, I think, thank-you.
- If Trump can enact the insurrection act if there's violence.. then he will encourage violence
- I'm worried that outside actors would easily decide to do this, and this shouldn't be a decision made by non-americans.
- I deeply hope that the united states maintains its presence (it is a beacon)
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This is a very scary place to be in. Do whatever you can to keep everyone around you as safe as you can. I can't offer anything but my hope that things will get better, I'm sorry, because that means next to nothing.
I'm watching, and the rest of the world is watching. What's happening is not right.
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Let me break it down very simply:
Did you ever get bullied in school or see a bully terrorize other kids?
Was the bully stopped by appeals for him to act nicely? Was the bully stopped by the administration? Did the bully stop beating a kid when the kid didn't fight back?
Yes the bully will beat another kid and then cry wolf when the kid defends itself. However the administration full well knows who the bully is and decides to side with him anyways.
If you fight back you might loose. If you don't fight back you will definitely loose.
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My concern is that someone could bait violence too easily. Maybe this is not a conversation I can can be helpful in. I hope you all are safe!
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- American troops (including marines) have been deployed without the governor's consent (this sounds terrifying)
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The only police reform we have seen in 15 years has been as the result of BLM violent protests.
Violent protest got you every single right you have.
It's historically the only way slaves and the poor have ever improved their lives.
Shut the fuck up
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Organize first, then fight.
Most people aren't going to risk their lives for this shithole until elections stop altogether.
Look at past examples of revolts and civil wars. Minority factions and secessionists pretty much never win and often end up operating in ways that promote war crimes.
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Something i have brought up before as an example is when i was in elementary school and high school, i was bullied very very badly. They would say horrific things and beat me up. This happened for almost 10 years. Everyone always told me "ignore them. Be the bigger person.", "if you hit them, you are just as bad.", "if you ignore them, they will stop.", "have you asked them to stop bullying you?".
Teachers would constantly make excuses and ignore the bullies. Because if they said something about it, the whole class would lie and say i did something to deserve it. I never did anything because i was terrified.
One day i got jumped again after school by one of them and i snapped. I beat the everliving fuck out of him. The last punch was straight to the throat and he struggled to breath.
Not a single person in the class bullied me ever again. Not a single word was said to me from that day on.
My point is that asking bullies and fascists nicely to stop, does not work. They are not playing according to the rules. We are currently "fighting" them with the assumption they have morals and will stop if we firmly tell them to. Did the protest annoy trump? 100%. Probably spend the entire night annoyed. Is he rethinking his fascist plans? Absolutely not.
I do think the protests are beautiful to see. So much solidarity and love. Its amazing to see with our own eyes that our side is MASSIVE. and that the right does not have nearly as much people as they pretend they do.
But i also know it won't change but. Trump is not going to leave. He will not stop advancing his fascist plans. ICE continues their gestapo bullshit. LGBT and womens rights continue to be taken away.
It's a beautiful morale boost. But sadly that is all it is.
Sorry for the rant. I do love seeing the protests and i really have so much respect for the people out on the streets. But i don't think much, if anything, will change.
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There's a much better reason to not be violent: So that you can get more people onto the streets. Figures that most people don't fancy dodging burning trash cans and you want everybody on the streets, not just your polycule. People need to feel like they're safe at the protest, the only danger there is is coming from the state.
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That's a nice argument when the cops are not yet shooting random passerbys with rubber bullets and teargas. People don't stay home because they're afraid of other protestors.
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There's a massive fucking vibe difference between a crowd taking cover behind whatever is at hand and one setting fire to shit and throwing back stones is all I'm saying. Be the former vibe. Stones aren't going to stop them. Assault rifles and tanks wouldn't stop them. Pining for escalation hands them excuses on a platter for no strategic gain whatsoever, it's pissing in the wind. The only law you should be breaking is refusing to follow a dispersal order, or at least take your sweet time with it, everything else is fedposting.
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People usually only remember part of Thomas Jefferson’s quote: “The tree of liberty must be refreshed with the blood of tyrants.”
The full thing goes “The tree of liberty must be refreshed with the blood of patriots and tyrants.”
This is class warfare. We all need to start getting used to the fact that many of us patriots are going to die fighting this fascist machine.
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I know, right? These fuvking anachronistic world war mashup re-enacters, fucking tear gassing and shooting random people as they get so mean towards the cops!
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the fact that people are still "mostly" upvoting you proves they just haven't suffered enough yet. we'll get there.
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This is like saying, "If you're going to be wrongly accused of a crime, you may as well commit it"...just to prove them right?
Not sure how this advice does anything other than give Trump exactly what he wants.
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Look if I was gonna be falsely accused of assault and knew for a fact that there was nothing I could do about it in court I might beat the shit out of the accusor. Trump is gonna get what he wants whether we like it or not. Fascism is inevitable and Trump is only a symptom of that process
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It's not inevitable.
But it will be hard to break it. People need to act, stand up, make their voices heard and make being on the MAGA side seem petty, childish and weak.
Break their fantasy of power and ideals.
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Don't do the thing you want to do to try to stop the bad thing happening, because they'll use your wanting to stop it as justification whether or not you act on it. Better to just sit back and let it happen, right?
(It's already happened though, since he's now federalising national guard against State's wishes it's basically now military dictatorship, the rope just hasn't finishing tightening yet.)
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I know this is an anarchy community, but peaceful protests have been successful before. And the thing is, if the authority literally fired and killed a civilian, the authority will immediately lose legitimacy. This is what protestors are railing on. They are like "what are you gonna do kill us?"
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Their goal is your death or pacification, there's no reason to do their job for them. If you want to see the disgusting depths pacifism goes to, look at this gandhi quote:
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Civilians have been teargassed and kettled before while peacefully protesting - recently - and the public reaction to it was largely either 'meh' or 'oh no I feel sorry for the poor people who live near those violent riots'.
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The tear gassing isn't new. What's new is deploying the national guards and marines. And what would be newer is if the national guards and the marines killed a civilian. Trump is escalating and trying to provoke Los Angelinos to justify the use of force.
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It turns out you can just kill protestors.
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Well, it did propel further the withdrawal of US from Vietnam. It further de-legitimised US involvement in Vietnam by the public.
This time is far more consequential and existential though. If the guardsmen and marines killed any of LA civilians, it could cause a civil war and perhaps the collapse of the United States as we know it. But you still would not want to be the one to fire the first shot and give Trump legitimacy.
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Does anyone think that Donnie is going to be sad if someone burns a truck? Or a Home Depot? Or an ICE officer?
Don't follow the provocateurs in pointless vandalism. Protest, and save the rocks to throw at the people who are directly responsible for this blatant fascism.
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A burnt truck cant be used to haul people away. An injured ICE goon can't kidnap people.
Not breaking random things is important. But the goons and their weapons and tools absolutely need to be broken.
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True. But they have more trucks. And if you arrest/deport/shoot the people burning the trucks, there's a chance that the trucks will eventually stop being burnt. Donnie would love to escalate this all the way to a fascist racist police state.
Grandma's blocking ICE arrests gives off real tank-man-of-Tiananmen-square energy, and it's hard to justify shooting "normal americans"without looking like the fascist goons that they are. But, shooting a guy waving a Mexican flag while looting and buring down a shoe store ... some might agree that it's justified to stop this "foreign invasion" with military force.
I can't blame people for wanting to stop ICE from kidnapping innocent people. But, we don't want to serve up justifications on a silver platter either.
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"I can't believe no one is doing anything!! I'll post on twitter where real change happens!"
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God forbid a woman kills a few fascists.
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No badjacketing
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The Russian government is a fascist one. Putin is a fascist dictator. This poster is most probably a leftist. You are not a leftist.
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Robbing stores isn't good PR. I'm working with the right to do positive PR for you guys if you ever do anything to a cop or to cop property. I'm pretty good at selling it "as long as they aren't harming peaceful citizens or local businesses. Who the fuck cares if zog has a bad day." Then you have people looting stores and I can't run PR for you on the right. And they look at the news and say, "See, getting the illegals out of here was a good idea."
When people steal stuff the whole movement, even the people not doing it, just becomes propaganda for the other side. What would be increadable PR is if crowds physically prevented looting.
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Maybe we should stop pandering to people who are going to hate us no matter what we do. This is open class warfare, we are waaayyyy past PR battles.
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fuck that. good pr is seeing a fucking police car on fire.
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Human rights are OK to mess with, but don't you dare mess with our capitalism!
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There's nothing wrong with human rights but how does harming the lives of innocent people help human rights? It makes it hard to sell to other people you are serious about human rights. Instead you just look like a problem. A problem that motivates leaning on fascism. So when stores get robbed you are making negative ground with anything you want to do.
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In a system that values profits over peoples' lives, stealing is a morally good act.
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Well you loose the political game when it ends up on TV. You are making negative progress with your political goals because the political will to get rid of what are perceived as "lawless illegals" only increases.
Is it morally right to loose? Because this is how you loose.
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Won't someone PLEASE think of the inanimate objects?!
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Then you have people looting stores and I can't run PR for you on the right. And they look at the news and say, "See, getting the illegals out of here was a good idea."
During news coverage of hurricane Helena, when marganalized people availed themselves of foodstuffs, they were called "looters," and when whites did it, they were brave who were caring for their families. I'm not talking about those who took other things, but then, why shouldn't someone have a tv or radio to listen to news?
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Put your money where your mouth is, random writer with an actor for an avatar. Pretty easy to advocate for mass violence on a blog.
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What gives you the impression that she isn't?
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Figured she'd say something if she's so passionate about being there. I looked at her website and just see a blog - which to be clear, I think is fine. We need writers. What we don't need need is an armchair warrior telling everyone they're doing it wrong in an finger-blaming rant. It's like she just wants something to write about
Now as for the actual content of the message, the dumb hyperbole in her second paragraph makes it obvious she's just ranting and doesn't actually have a plan. She's got a chip on her shoulder but if she thinks she's so smart, she should lead the charge...not grumble from the back of the room.
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