I still don't see Mozilla as a bad actor, especially in comparison with the villany that is google and microsoft. It's still a great alternative for privacy newbies and average users, although I personally made the switch to librewolf (desktop) and iceraven (mobile) a while ago. Both being forks of firefox, development for actual firefox is essential for either of these to survive, so Mozilla still has my support albeit indirectly
Librewolf / IronFox for me, Mozilla can fuck right off with their cloud services, added value and hunger for telemetry. Their 2% userbase is about to shrink even further.
Oh wow, I did that exact switch yesterday upon seeing the changes.
i have ironfox on android, and you can use alternative to google play, apparently google has secretely downloaded an app" which scans your phones and sends it to google.
I've been using Firefox since it was Netscape, and I'm 'concerned' but not going anywhere yet.
Exactly the same situation here. I'll wait for a while and see what happens.
Yeah, same here... I'm cautiously worried, but more for other things that have happened than these last changes.
I'm mainly trying to work out how to get off windows.
Nice. I've been there, and changing just a bit at a time has added up to my computing now being in a state I'm much happier with.
Librewolf. Mozilla will just keep enshittifying their browser. My biggest hope is that chrome is split off from Google and Mozilla loses their funding from google (500M/year). It's way more than they need and they refuse to actually compete with Chrome/Chromium. Instead, they are content being the excuse for Google not to be sued for being a monopoly.
Hopefully the charade will end before Trump leaves office. Either because the US courts force google to split or because the EU finally grows a pair and declares Google and their tech to be a liability. My bet is that a new browser like LadyBird will give Firefox a reason to actually improve, but it'll be too late.
After a quick look at librewolf I may absolutely join you
Librewolf is basically a autoconfig file for firefox (firefox feature). https://codeberg.org/librewolf/settings/raw/branch/master/librewolf.cfg You can use this file in normal firefox.
Nope.
Not that I don't think it's a dumb move from Mozilla, but the options right now are:
- Stay with Firefox
- Move to a Firefox-based browser
Especially since I use Mozilla's services I'm sorta in their ecosystem right now. Maybe once I've moved passwords off I can consider moving, but even then on Android the only browser that supports uBlock is Firefox afaik, which makes it my YouTube client of choice.
Not yet, they're still the best option that doesn't use Chromium (I don't count Safari), but Servo is looking pretty promising
I honestly have no clue, personally.
I know i have to jump ship, but my choices are either chromium, or a fork of firefox, that may be slow to catch up with security / may not last.
I've got my eyes on librewolf, floorp and zen.
I'm especially watching https://ladybird.org/. A completely independent browser. But the dev has gotten himself in hot water iirc, but anything to get away from google and mozilla, i guess. Also, it's not complete.
We'll see what the future has in stock for us.
Andres Kling? I haven't seen anything about him recently to suggest he's done anything suspect.
What is forcing you? Why do you have to jump ship.
This is not an endorsement to use Firefox further but I am curious about your phrasing.
I think @fxomt@lemmy.dbzer0.com hasn't yet been enlightened by the fact that one can block Mozilla's URLs and IPs to escape it. TOS for software is dumb and made to be broken, don't let anyone argue with you otherwise.
Mainly that i don't want my data being sent to mozilla. But I've decided to stick to firefox for a little more, but this action from mozilla has dropped my trust in them.
Yes.
Short term -- I'll probably be moving to LibreWolf, most likely. I'm planning to spend a good chunk of time this weekend reviewing what exactly their fork does. I've read their self-description already -- and like it -- but I want to look through the code and try to build it myself before I start depending on it.
Long term -- I'll be keeping my eye on Servo and Ladybird.
Librewolf is not exactly a fork. It is a autoconfig file for firefox (which is a firefox feature). https://codeberg.org/librewolf/settings/raw/branch/master/librewolf.cfg It's not a solution.
Thanks for the pointer. As I said, I need to spend a good chunk of time reviewing exactly what they've done before I feel confident enough to depend on it. A simple reconfiguration of stock Firefox that I am confident does not phone home is likely good enough for me in the short term.
If you have a better solution though, please let us know what it is.
I'm staying on this side, but probably switching to a fork like Librewolf
I've previously used Floorp which is feature rich but not polished, and same goes for Zen
I've heard that librewolf struggles to keep up to date with important security updates iirc? That is pretty much the only thing holding me from using it permanently.
Seeing a lot of people recommend the same three forks, though. I'll have to try them out and see what i like best :D
Librewolf is not exactly a fork. It is a autoconfig file (firefox feature). https://codeberg.org/librewolf/settings/raw/branch/master/librewolf.cfg
No, because I haven't used mainline Firefox in years.
I'm pretty happy with LibreWolf on desktop and IronFox on Android (GrapheneOS)Unfortunately it's still much less secure than Chromium, but I want and need a proper adblocker to maintain my freedom online. And I'm definitely not using Brave...
The only kinda usable Chromium browsers are Ungoogled Chromium and Trivalent. I think I might try building Trivalent on macOS at some point. Maybe also gonna apply some patches from Thorium, as long as they don't compromise security.
Any thoughts on Vivaldi?
No thoughts on privacy, but I have been using Vivaldi for many years now and it's good. Pretty customizable if that's your thing.
I've been inching towards Gnome Web (WebKit) for a while now. Every time I try using it I last a little longer than last time before I encounter some deal breaking issue and return to Firefox.
In the short term I'm considering sticking to Firefox for work, and using Gnome Web for all other kinds of distractions. I'm writing this in Gnome Web right now, and it's working great. :)
On mobile I'll probably stick to Firefox for a while. So they will still have all my data, and if I have to choose between Mozilla and Google it will still be Mozilla. But my god I wish they would stop acting like idiots.
Coincidentally, I just found out about Floorp yesterday, in no relation to this ToS change, and will take a look at it soon. Keep in mind I haven't looked at all yet, so I have no clue if they have a worse ToS or something.
If they're willing to lose their market share just to chase the AI dragon, I'm willing to be complicit. I know that Brave is pretty good on PC (aware of their crypto bollockery), and I'm taking Librewolf for a spin. As for mobile, I'm happy with Vanadium.
The real shame is Thunderbird getting caught in it. I'll have to look for a replacement both on PC and Android.
I use fair mail on Android and I really like it. Evolution comes pre installed on Debian, it got the job done for me too. The mobile client is more important to me personally.
Well, I have been using Zen, a Firefox fork for the past 6 months, and they have yet to clarify their stance on the ToS update.
Anyway, I don't think I'll change anyway, we need Gecko in the browser engine landscape and I have been so used to Firefox'S UI and flexibility that I have a hard time imagining myself not using a Firefox-based browser.
On PC, I will look into switching to a fork. Not sure what to do on my phone
Is there anything in the new ToS that's even bad? Like, there are lots of people breathlessly ranting about how privacy is dead because Mozilla mentioned the existence of third parties and gibberish like that, but when I read it myself it mostly seemed like they were just saying that if you use third party services through Firefox then the third parties will have your data. That seems kinda like a nothingburger of a controversy to me. I dunno, I'm not a lawyer, maybe I missed something, but if so I certainly haven't seen anybody else explain it properly.
They also recently removed the promise to never sell data: https://programming.dev/post/26136291
There's this comment (https://lemmy.zip/post/32886349/16923402) in this post (https://lemmy.zip/post/32886349?sort=Top) that should be interesting
You can't see it from Beehaw as beehaw defederated Lemmy.world
They removed a broadly worded promise that might theoretically be used to get them in trouble for selling anonymized data. I'm not happy about that, but it doesn't surprise me.
The rest is just people being angry at Mozilla for describing how a modern web browser works, because other companies have pointed at similar language to argue that they have the right to do whatever they want with any information they collect and no one has stopped them. That sucks, but the problem is that there are no consequences for large corporations, not that Mozilla is using the information you put into your browser to access the internet for you. Maybe Mozilla will also decide to intentionally misinterpret their own legalese to train some garbage AI, but the absolute worst case scenario is that they're the same as every other significant browser, and a more reasonable interpretation would be that the non-profit organization is probably not profit motivated and actually means the things they say.
Who knows. I can't see the future, but without Firefox forks of it are a dead-end, and any other browser is still going to collect a bunch of information and use it to navigate the web for you, because that's just how today's garbage javascript laden websites work. Yelling at Mozilla for explaining that in their ToS isn't going to fix it, and Ladybird isn't going to magically change how those websites work. If you really want to do something about it, don't use those websites. Good luck with that.
a
You're right that it's nothing big, but the kind of people super into purity tests tend to congregate on the fediverse (which I find a little ironic but am also happy to have some people around who accept no compromises).
I'm going to stick to Firefox for the time being at least for the clients where I managed to get Firefox ESR accepted. For everything else, it might be the time to switch to Librewolf. Among other advantages, they have enabled jxl support.
No, if I read that correctly the terms do not apply to me as I don't use the "Executable Code version of Firefox".
Already switched to Zen on PC and Fennec on Android.
I’ve been using gnome web for a bit
Yep, switched tot waterfox...
Switching from Android to iPhone soon, what is the best browser for the iPhone? 🤔
Very interested in responses, following.
