YSK some cities in the US are starting to build an affordable community built wifi network that goes around big telecom companies
NYC Mesh
I am old enough and geek enough to be bothered by the use of the word "WiFi" instead of the Internet or just network.
It's only WiFi if you connect the wireless router at the end.
Edit: just noticed mention of the "antenna at the roof" on the page, but I still don't think it's WiFi, "WiFi" is a name of the technology that allows wireless access by multiple devices. I think it's rather radio communication between the router and the access point. They basically use radio waves instead of the cable, it was often used in rural areas in my country, where putting cables would be too expensive.
WiFi is a specific protocol, IEEE 802.11 (with a lower case letter at the end for the version). There have long been hobbyist and commercial methods for using it with point-to-point links. There are some other wireless methods for this, like LoRa/Meshtastc, but they tend to be slower and less developed. Everyone prefers using WiFi.
So, yes, they are using WiFi in a point-to-point way. The antenna is directional to give it (potentially) several miles of range.
So a professional cantenna?
Setup some multi km Wi-Fi bridges before, that was fun.
It would seem a lot of people think Wi-Fi is internet. I've heard someone call it "Wi-Fi with exclamation mark" when without internet access.
My eldest when her internet want working confidently told me her computer couldn't connect to the globe
🤦
I'm old enough and nerd enough to be slightly peeved that "community built" isn't hyphenated ("community-built").
The hyphen is for clarity. Its use is totally optional in that context
You don't know what the word "application" is lol
I noticed the gradual shift from program to app over time since the iPhone took the world by storm, but then again it was never incorrect. Applications are synonymous with programs so an executable on your windows desktop is an app as much as it is a program.
I've never come across anyone referring to a Reddit account as an app but I can definitely see someone who interacts with Reddit exclusively using the Reddit app referring to both the platform and a means of accessing as the same thing both out of a conscious choice for convenience or ignorance and actually they'd be right either way except in the latter case only accidentally since it you say "I really love using that app Reddit to look at memes and talk to people" despite not actually knowing the app isn't the platform, your sentence would still be correct.
The activating thing, I jimmycrackcrack declare that I will allow it. Look it's a sneaky hardware manufacturer and provider term to imply the device doesn't work until you give them money but then, as a piece of language with utility, well... your phone doesn't work without a sim, at least in the common understanding of what "work" means here. Since a phone of any stripe, dumb or smart is pretty useless without a sim card, getting that message across to consumers that you have to do something to make it functional, to "activate" it is necessary. You could choose to frame it as unlocking but then again if you're selling these things you probably don't want people thinking you locked them up and then sold them the keys and in fact, the manufacturers kinda didn't, it's the service provider that doesn't provide service to a functioning device until they're given money, who are doing that and given they're a business, that's sorta how they have to operate.
For a municipal wireless network, I'm not too bothered with how OP describes it if it's accessed through Wi-Fi.
But.. It is P2P WiFi...
Thank you, because it's vitally important to devote half the content in these threads to arguing about the terminology in the headline.
I hope they are aware of https://freifunk.net/ and don't start from scratch completely. They've been doing that kinda stuff for over a decade and have developed a modified OpenWRT version and maintain lists of compatible routers
NYC Mesh has been around for more than a decade. I assume they talked to other similar projects when building it.
Ah nice! :D Yeeeah just thought it'd be a shame to not utilize existing work that has been done on OpenWRT. But then again, it's highly unlikely that actors from similar groups haven't met at hacker conferences, GitHub repos, etc.
I see freifunk networks more rarely nowadays. They also are notoriously slow. Usually the mobile phone network is faster, even in Germany.
Yeeah it kind of fizzled out, that's true. In larger cities it used to be useful sometimes because of abysmal cell coverage and shady public WiFi. That has improved a lot since then, so yeah nowadays it can't hold a candle to 4G/5G mobile data.
Cue lawsuits from ISPs in 3, 2, 1...
Time to go cyberpunk. Hidden routers using stolen electricity.
There’s a bunch of LoRaWAN and Meshtastic out here too. Join the movement!
Does anyone know what other cities are building similar networks? Or how to get started doing it in your city?
KPUD in Kitsap County, WA does something similar: https://www.kpud.org/fiber-internet/free-public-wi-fi/
They also have very affordable public fiber.
I think European has a head start on this. Not sure which US cities are doing it
I reached out to the NYC mesh folks and they are going to walk me through it. It seems like a lot of work. But the more people who can get to help. The stronger it becomes.
Can they start building affordable housing and go around the manipulated housing market?
That only part of the issue. An affordable home today can quickly raise in value, gentrification, the secondary real estate market, tax appraisal, these are all still problems.
"I am the CLT Commander!"
Okay, going off the title to start with you're building a WiFi network, that's very cool (I'm guessing it's a mesh network), but will you connect it to the Internet too?
That'd be more of a headline if so, then just building a WiFi network.
My friend has been using NYCmesh for a couple years now. He has nothing. It positive things to say about it.
Website literally has mesh in the name, no need to guess. Then would you believe it, but if you open the site it tells you more information and mentions the internet several times.
This is fucking awesome
Right?
Ditto
I’m shocked this is going through. I gotta imagine at least Tennessee will block it. They’re super pro-big isp.
Getting ready to drop some raspberry pi OpenWRT WiFi 7 with WiFi HaLow around westchester to downtown. Let me know needed areas!
This sounds cool but what exactly will it do and what's the purpose? What will these devices be connected to for internet? Local stores wifi and then extending it for others to use?
Okay I read the explanation on their faq page but I’m still kinda confused on how this works. Don’t they need like satellites for internet access? What exactly is this in simple terms? Like it seems good, I just want to understand it
You don't need satellites, just some connection on a datacenter (like but internet in bulk, maybe they have some special deal and is free or very cheap). But this is the boring part, the fun part is that you can connect to the hubs (light blue dots in the map) with a router with an antenna or you can connect to another router (red dots). The network is like a living being that keeps expanding. Then to go out to the Internet, the packets are jumping as they can between neighbors (they have a way to know the path) until they reach the datacenter. It looks like you only have to pay for the initial equipment (plus some donations to maintain the network), but it will probably end up costing you some of your time maintaining the network, learning and helping other people in the network.
I think I get it now! Thank you for explaining!
How long until the cities' PDs start busting down peoples doors for this?
Why would they? This is a legitimate business
Reminds me of the time I shared my Internet with my friend who was in another apartment. We just created a Wi-Fi bridge with dd-wrt. That was 15 years ago.
I wish I had that near me, but unfortunately I don't live in New York (United States), I live in New York (United States).
ARGH PLACENAMES
The domain has a c in it
I hadn't gotten the idea from the domain name but admittedly the comment wasn't very good regardless
in reality though I did get excited seeing this only to be disappointed that it's only in new york city and I live in upstate new york
Way way long ago I remember when I lived in Portland that they tried this, it was a pilot program. Idk if it's true or propaganda but it didn't work out because it was slow down because of how much porn people where downloading, so they didn't expand it and just stoped doing it.
Packet shaping.
wow that's alotta porn to slow down a 10Gb connection
That is for sharing! I'm up to see what I can do on the UWS (signed up) but maybe that's too far
Anyone remember ricochet wireless? That was awesome. It can happen again! Why not?
I was just thinking about ricochet while perusing the thread. Ricochet was new when I was starting in IT and I can still remember connecting a ricochet modem to a company laptop and then pulling up our novell netware file share over our vpn. It was jaw dropping to see it at the time. Amazing how far we've come since then.
Reminds me of Wireless Seattle, that must be what, 25 years ago?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle_Wireless almost had it right.
This is what I thought of. I remember they beamed a signal across a lake successfully. I also got into making a cantenna because of them. Used it a lot working security in places that didn't have wifi.
Now if we could just talk to some EU internet satellites...
inb4 they sell it to a telecom and the politicians get a top manager or consultant job at that company
This seems like a bad idea.
What sort of protections are in place against nefarious actors that gain access to this network? Do they do anything to isolate each connected device from each other so that two devices on the network cannot connect to each other, such as making use of subnets? Are users connections throttled, and if so, to what degree? Are certain websites blocked to prevent potential malicious actors from intercepting sensitive data more easily, such as bank sites?
I mean, the idea is a well intentioned one, but I can easily see this going very wrong very quickly.
Me: Expresses concern about potential cybersecurity issues with a free publicly joinable network
Lemmy: Furiously downvoting
Honestly, I am not sure what I was expecting, but it was clearly too much.
If your bank credentials can be intercepted that way, then the bank had poor security. They're not responsible for that anymore than any other ISP.
Yet somehow ISPs are expected to police piracy.
You really think this would even have live long enough to write an article about it if it wasnt built properly?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NYC_Mesh
This is not a new concept, its been around since 2014 so they will just have copied a lot from existing projects like the german freifunk which i participate in (exists since 2003).