1y ago

Tesla's value plunged nearly $200 billion since mid-July – and the EV maker faces a bumpy road ahead

finance.yahoo.com Tesla's value plunged nearly $200 billion since mid-July – and Elon Musk's EV maker faces a bumpy road ahead

Tesla shares closed Tuesday at just over $233, well down on their 2023 peak of $291.

Tesla's value plunged nearly $200 billion since mid-July – and the EV maker faces a bumpy road ahead::Tesla shares closed Tuesday at just over $233, well down on their 2023 peak of $291.

248 comments

maybe they should focus on making a decent product
- Well Musk is spending most of his time breaking Xitter lately so maybe the Tesla guys can get some good stuff done while he's distracted.
  
  Probably not. Tesla is very dysfunctional as an org. He flattened it so much, and hasn’t appointed a real leader, while he’s distracted I bet they’re basically in a holding pattern.
  He motivated them by setting insane goals then driving them insanely hard and sleeping in the office and shit.
  If he’s not doing that, the company is, pardon the pun, on autopilot. Watch out for stopped emergency vehicles.
  
  he’s been at it for a while, and Tesla hasn’t improved any, so don’t know...
- The products are decent. Just that there are a lot more competitions that make much better cars.
  
  Teslas are the most recalled vehicles on the market.
  
  A friend of mine rented a 2023 Tesla recently. He said there was a visible air gap between the trunk lid and the body of the car. That's decent to you?

Setting aside anything related to Musk, Tesla really doesn’t seem to be staying competitive.
Cybertruck (and the “indestructible” window press conference) is probably the easiest example. Years of attempted hype that haven’t paid off in a meaningful manner, while rivals have been releasing in-class competition. Anyone can see that’s a problem.
Tesla cars used to be pretty revolutionary, now they’re in an entirely different era that’s filling with exciting EV alternatives around every corner. Yet Tesla style still looks the same. The shoddy construction is still around and becoming more widespread knowledge. They’re failing to attract their target audience due to a long series of missteps. More problems.
Not to mention that Tesla was downright overpriced at its height. It’s a fraction of the volume yet made other automaker valuations look minuscule. The logic for that was never there.
- Besides Musk…it’s the fact they are still using the same design from 10+ years ago. When I see a tesla, I can’t tell the difference between the S & 3 or the X & Y. They made one car and scaled it in their software. All 4 cars are due for a redesign and they don’t need to all look identical. And they need to figure out how to actually assemble them without being shit.
  
  Model S3xy? Why Elon, just why...
  The model X looks like an inflated model 3 IMO, the first time I saw one IRL it looked kinda hideous
  
  Nothing wrong with that if it’s successful. VW used the same design language for the Beetle/Van/Truck for ages.
- Cybertruck is a symptom of poor leadership. Maybe after it flops, Tesla will clean house.
  
  Musk only owns about 14% of Tesla. The other stockholders should clean house of the board and CEO.
- While I agree Cybertruck may have jumped the shark, I recently noticed …. After years of GM saying cylindrical batteries are not practical and pouch batteries are the only way to go, and Ultium is more advanced than anything Tesla has …. They’re redesigning EV models early to switch to cylindrical batteries like Tesla
  
  The only reason GM (and others) tried to tout pouch cells is because there was a complete lack of cylindrical production capacity available. Tesla was using it all.
  What are you going to do, say we'd rather use these other batteries but we can't, so here you go?
  I am ecstatic that most of the major manufactures have finally decided to transition to prismatic and/or cylindrical.
  I wouldn't even be surprised if regulations one day prevent use of pouch cells for automotive purposes.
- Give it 5 - 10 years. Tesla will be a company that makes and maintains a charging station network and sells batteries to the other auto makers.
  It's becoming increasingly obvious that they can't hack it in an automotive sales industry. Which is fine, frankly. I think battery manufacturing and charging network are pretty complimentary industries and provide a decent revenue stream into the future, License the charging tech to other automakers early and get some vendor lock-in going, and the company could be in it for the long haul.
  They might even be able to keep making a couple EVs, to prove new charging or battery tech, much like how Google keeps making Pixel phones to essentially prove and market new Android features.
  
  and sells batteries to the other auto makers.
  My limited understanding of the matter is that their batteries are overpriced and nothing special compared to alternatives.
  The real game changer that seems to be coming down the pipeline is the solid state battery Toyota has been teasing. If they manage to bring that to market while holding important patents on the technology it's basically game over for other kinds of battery for EVs.
- Who else has hands free driving on local roads?
  
  Not Tesla, FSD requires hands on at all times while stuff like Supercruise does not.
  
  Mercedes for example - and it works better than Tesla's on shitty roads.
  
  Exactly. So many of the naysayers haven't used fsd first hand, so they don't know how close they are to solving a huge problem. And no one else is really even trying anymore. Ask a graduating senior in IT or robotics where they dream of working and it's Tesla.

Such a remarkably overvalued company. I'd be surprised if it's still around in a few decades. Feels like they're the MySpace of today - they're big and have first mover advantage but have nothing interesting down the line and newer companies will and are supplanting it.
- I don't disagree with those statements but I'd wait to see what they put out from the Mexican factory considering the labor cost advantage and manufacturing experience they've gained. Beyond that I agree that Korean and Chinese EVs seem more put together and well see if we get more when the us subsidies end.
- Nothing interesting? They've got the Cybertruck!
  Not good. But interesting.

Good, the MAGA car company should lose value.
- The market is finally correcting itself.
  
  This must be the go woke go broke I hear so much about.
  Laughs in the biggest, most profitable media empire in the universe
- this is a dumb comment. most maga dicks would never drive an EV they're too busy rolling coal. yes the spokesperson for Tesla is a piece of human garbage, but the company is more than him. Tesla has been hugely responsible for the much needed transition to EVs. So hate musk, but i think hating Tesla is a mistake.
  
  I can hate tesla too you know. The car is terrible quality. Just because it is an EV doesn't excuse it from being shitty
  
  A lot of the problem with Tesla is Musk though, especially when it comes to the whole FSD and Autopilot thing. Tesla is spreading misleading data and releasing software to the public that they really shouldn't be, and it's Musk that is pushing for that to happen.
  
  much needed transition to EVs
  You mean for the car industry?
  
  sounds like someone wasted 70k on the MAGA car.
  
  This is a very reasonable comment, and yet it's downvoted heavily.
  What Tesla achieved is good, and will have a place in the history of EVs. Musk being a fucking idiot doesn't change that, it just makes it more obvious that none of the success is due to him he just happens to own the company.

Teslas are boring. There are only 4 of them and they all look the same. (And the cybertruck is an abomination, sorry if you’re going to buy one; good luck surviving all the steel balls people will be throwing at you)
- Nobody is going to buy a cyber truck because they will never be mass produced
  
  Or legal to sell in many US states of Europe.
  
  Saving your comment so I can get a good laugh when it is released.
- What a stupid take, but par for the r/technology course.
  EDIT: The steel ball thing was terrible optics, granted, but that was also, like, the 5th time that ball was thrown at the window. Bullet-proof glass still spiderwebs when hit. Get over it.
  
  No, they dropped steel balls onto separate glass pulled to the side, which didn’t break, then they decided to hurl steel balls at the prototype they had on stage. It broke the glass, twice. It’s on video, y’know?
  but par doe the r/technology course.
  Do you even know where you are?
- Don't worry Tesla owners, this guy's better than you and all along knew that he should be buying hummers.
  This smugness from basement dwellers is flat out embarassing.
  
  "If you don't spend tens of thousands of dollars on a luxury car, you're a smug basement dweller."
  
  Swing and a miss, sparky. I’ve been driving electric for the last 7 years but have no interest in Tesla for a wide variety of reasons.
  Also I literally told you why I don’t like them — there are only 4 of them and they all look the same; do you think maybe the fact that they’ve become so ubiquitous over the last few years and so samey could contribute to changed perceptions of them? What’s new in 2017 is old in 2023.
  Just try and be a better person/contributor around here. Smarten up.

It was never worth the stupid value it was pumped up to. Why do you think Elon has been dumping so much of it.
- Cause he has less business skills than what he lets to believe.
- Elon is in the dump part of a pump and dump scheme.

The moment those Chinese EV startups enter the US market, Tesla will be in real trouble if they don't have their product quality image problem fixed by then.
It'll be like Detroit's Big 3 automakers tanking when small fuel efficient Japanese cars landed in the 70s oil crisis.
Assuming those Chinese EV companies don't have their own quality problems...
- Chinese EVs absolutely have quality problems, but they are half the price. Tesla's are sold at luxury prices with third rate QA.
  
  Chinese quality has gone up in the last 20 or so years since they transitioned from poor to industrial country. You can't cling to the cheap knockoffs you buy on Aliexpress either.
  
  So Tesla's have quality issues I agree with, Elon is an asshole I also agree with. But not all Tesla's are a Plaid. They start at $35k, the Y at 40k. They are most assuredly not luxury vehicles and I'm not sure why people keep thinking this.
- Tesla is already in trouble.
  Hyundai Ioniq 5/6, Kia Ev6.
  VW ID line.
  Ford F150 Lightning.
  Those are the things that will absolutely decimate Tesla's market share. Known brands that can actually put together cars without basic issues like Panel gaps and paint issues.
  Ones that reject the absolutely dangerous and moronic UX of putting everything onto a big screen instead of having physical buttons.
- They’re already in the states. Example: Volvo / Polestar
  
  Big difference there. Volvo may be owned by a Chinese company but they're made in the US and Europe (except the S90) and are designed by Swedish engineers. That's like called Jaguars and Land Rovers Indian since they're owned by Tata.
  The cars that GP are referring to are entirely designed and built in China.
- china sucks worse then Tesla. Everything they build is cheap crap that falls apart. Last thing I’d ever do is buy some pos from china

Elon Musk financed about $20bn into the Twitter purchase by selling Tesla stock.
- despite the 200b drop in tesla, those 20bn probably still would be worth more than the Twitter stocks he owns now.
  
  Twitter is a money pit circling the drain.

I dont get how this is news. Teslas market cap was already higher than all the other car makers combined while only producing a fraction of the vehicles. Everyone knew that this stock wasnt a value stock. Where is the news
- ELON BAD
  
  Yes, but not sarcastically.

thoughts and prayers
- I SAID THOUGHS..... AND.... PRAYERSSSSS!!
- Amen 🙏
  
  Ramen you mean? Gotta be what you ment...yep def ramen
  Ramen

I'm surprised this isn't just because of there being more competitors to Tesla like rivian. Tbh though I dislike cars, I just have to use them sadly.
- I love cars, and I know that goes against what I’m supposed to say here.
  
  It's okay to love cars, people have an issue with the Car being the only viable option in many places.
  When I lived in Brno, which is at around 450K population in Czechia, I was going there by car, as in I drove from Slovakia to Brno, parked my car and haven't used it until I was visiting Slovakia again, I only used it when I went for a big shopping to the hypermarket that was at the outskirts of the city.
  
  Did you ever see James May's OG Top Gear piece on Honda's hydrogen car? I think about it a lot. That alternatives to ICE cars is the way to save ICE cars for enthusiasts.
- There aren't any. By volume Tesla is still the biggest EV maker by far. The competition is nowhere close to catching up. If they screw up the launch of the Cybertruck, they'll really be in trouble, though. Also, the valuation is to a large degree based on the promise of full self driving. That seems to be an increasingly distant prospect, though.
  
  But Telsa’s market share has dropped from 79% to 62.4% in 2 years.
  Things are changing fast.
  
  Yeah, but the silly Tech Startup kind of market valuation with the associated crazy P/Es (justified by "we will take over the whole industry" kind of justification) that made them more valueable than all US automakers combined (not just the EV auto-segment, everything) is dissapearing.
  Their valuation reflecting the size of their market share (in the entire auto-market, not just EVs which are still a minority of sales) and growth direction (growing mainly due to the EV segment growing and don't seem to be in line to dominate the whole auto-market as EVs take over) means a massive fall from the fantasy "we'll take over the world" valuations.
  Mind you, it's happenning more generally in the whole Tech segment as the end of free money which was used in leveraged stock investment is wiping out all the investment strategies based on wild and fantastical claims of "future prospects" and on finding greater suckers.
  It's probably not even a fall due any worst numbers or concrete prospects for Tesla: the collapse of the massive stock price premiums (judging by the P/Es in Tech vs those in the wider market) for "future prospects" in the whole of the Tech industry, would definitelly pull Tesla's stock price down hard because Elon's main business "strategy" has always been to frame his ventures as Edgy Tech in order to reap such premiums and he definitelly went hard on it with Tesla.
  
  Hasn't the F-150 has already preemptively destroyed the Cybertruck? I suppose most people driving pickups don't actually need a pickup's functionality. They're just told they need a pickup so that's what they buy.
  
  lol as if that hideous pos truck is going to save them.
  
  There are, plenty of Chinese EV companies. One in particular sells by volume way more cars than Tesla worldwide. It just doesn't sell to the US yet.

Maybe anecdotal but I bought a Kia EV6 over a Tesla because of Musk and CarPlay support. I know I can’t be the only one that took that into consideration.
- There was a time when I wanted a Tesla, before Musk went altright...

They went to the stock chart, picked the latest peak, and wrote the article of doom. It's down 20% a year ago, but up 20% for the last 6 months, and up 119% YTD.
Not that Tesla doesn't have its ills or seems to be stagnating, but picking points in a chart is a feeble argument.
- That 119% is based on the lower peak you cherry picked, you just did exactly what you complained the article did.
  
  No… TSLA was at 108.10 on 1/3. TSLA closed today at 236.86.
  So from the beginning of the year to today (meaning year to date), the stock price is up by 119%. That’s not an arbitrary measurement. YTD is used all the time.
  
  YTD is a pretty common way to look at stocks and isn’t really cherry picking

Maybe the investors should all vote on kicking Elon out of the company.
- It would require 89.5% of outside investors to vote against him.
  Only congress has an approval rating of 9.5 or lower.
  
  How did you come up with that number? Seems high.
  
  With how their stock is losing value due to Elon and the reputation he puts on Tesla's products, that wouldn't be very hard I would think.

To put this in perspective, Tesla's stock price has still more than doubled since the beginning of the year. They're doing just fine.
The past few weeks have been rough across the market. I suspect the reemergence of COVID has played a factor.
- How about since their ATH?
  Oh... It's at a 43% bargain.
  52 weeks high? Yep, still a bargain!
  Nah, they're not doing fine.
- Anyone who actually follows the market knows it doesn’t follow logic and doesn’t actually represent the health of the company or the economy.
- Apparently not since the big investors are getting out/reducing investment.

I see so much hate toward Tesla in this post and I assume it's mostly because of Musk.
But at the end of the day they are still the ones selling the most EV which I still believe is a good thing.
I'd rather people buy an asshole's EV than another polluting pick-up truck tbh. (I know EV are also creating pollution, no need to point this out ty).
The vast majority of EVs I see in the street of my french city are Tesla's. And I see a bit more everyday. And no matter how much I despise Musk, I still appreciate the fact that tesla is helping us move forward from combustion engines.
I don't really care if someone buys a Tesla just to show off. It's one less combustion engine on the road.
- So? Left pollutes the air, right doesn't, hence right is undeniably better and completely unrelated to the fact that public transport could be much improved almost everywhere in the word. EV buses are also better than diesel ones, you know...
- But at the end of the day they are still the ones selling the most EV which I still believe is a good thing.
  "Over 10 Percent of Tesla Model S EVs Fail Germany’s Strict Inspection After 3 Years. It’s actual hard data on Tesla’s quality issues as seen in the wild." https://www.thedrive.com/news/44068/over-10-percent-of-tesla-model-s-evs-fail-germanys-strict-inspection-after-3-years
  Tesla deserves credit for opening the door on EVs, but these days something like a Hyundai Ionic / Kia EV just makes more sense when you don't want to buy expensive trash.
- Teslas just aren't great EVs compared to other brands. The reason they are popular is because of marketing.
  Give me a Renault EV any day.
  
  Aren't great how? They have some of the most efficient cars, with high charging speeds, and easily the best charging network.
  As far as EVs go, they're fantastic. Said as someone who has owned multiple EVs from different brands.
- They need to ditch Musk.. he's toxic to the brand now.
  
  And fix their quality, and upgrade their interior to have buttons, as well as be somewhat nicer than a Toyota for the price they're asking.
  
  The board is composed of close family and friends. They are not going to ditch Musk.
- tesla's are shit cars and cars are fuckn awful for the environment so its the creme dela creme of a shit stain. some people actually think they're doing the environment a good thing buying a new car instead of demanding public transportation/or at least buy something used to literally stop killing the earth.
  like seriously you think you're doing something to help the environment by buying a new car from a elon fucken musk? like you do realise tesla lobbys against public transporation? You know something that would actually help the environment.
  like he's literally a car salesman and you dupes were suckered into it like a fucken simpsons monorail
  
  Where I live, no amount of anything is going to get me away from a car. Even if I had a billion dollars to invest, I couldn't get rid of the need for a car, for at least 10 years. It's a nice position to take, but completely devoid from reality.
  
  I agree in regards to public transport in cities of a resonable size and between them. Outside bigger cities, it simply isn't a workable solution. Fact is that a lot of our modern society is built around cars. It's not easy to change that.
  BEV's will certainly not save the world from climate change, but they are a lot better than ICE vehicles and since we aren't getting rid of vehicles, it's a lot better if they are BEV's. Hate Elon Musk as much as you like (I likely wouldn't disagree with you), but you can't ignore that Tesla arguably has pushed forward the transition to BEV's.

It might face a bumpy road but the reality is the core reason for the drop is the amount of stock musk has sold to cover his idiotic decisions recently

Who would have thought your brand would tank if you go full send on being a absolute douche bag. Almost like there is consequences for you actions... Something these ultra rich assholes never face.

Still up 1,000% over 5 years...plenty of room to fall

200 b-b-b-b-billion…!

Where's my cybertruck already?!?!

When are they going to kick Elon out? How much money do they have to lose before this happens?

Tesla gets more popular each time the name gets mentioned, their market is now people who buy the cars because they are popular and see them around. Remove their ads, stop giving them visibility, stop fueling the brand
- Tesla gets less popular each time Elon Musk opens his dumb, reactionary mouth.
  I'm frustrated to constantly see that walking insult to the very concept of meritocracy so often, but my suffering is eased by the knowledge that he's the greatest argument against himself, so I figure that the more of a voice he has, the more people he'll drive away, and the faster he'll be relegated to irrelevancy.
  
  No, each time Tesla makes the front news they become more popular not less popular
- Tesla gets more popular each time the name gets mentioned
  Huh? This article is an example of exactly the opposite thing happening.
  
  Popularity doesn't mean that they are good just that they are popular. Could you name 2 other brands that make EV cars? I guess not and even if you could the average person couldn't because Tesla gets all the popularity

248 comments