1y ago

Hey, we should all really stop using racist slang to refer to customozation

Meta post I've decided to make. I enjoyed the unixporn subreddit a lot when I used reddit more. I enjoy customizing my linux de as much as the next nerd.

But you definitely shouldn't use racist slang to refer to the process.

To be clear, I didn't know the origin of the term 'ricing' until fairly recently. I was chattimg with my friend and used it to describe my de setup. They informed me that apparently it's from car customization, and is a pejorative against generally asian men who customize their car to look like a racecar.

After learning this I was sad to realize just how engrained it is in linux de customization culture. I personally have stopped using the term, and I would ask everyone here stop as well.

568 comments

It's a stupid term that is based on an antiquated mindset where Asian people are not creative and cannot invent anything of substance; we are only able to poorly imitate what the West develops. It needs to die.
Also, I've been using and customizing the X Window-based desktop for 25 years and I'm not sure that the term "ricing" was ever used anywhere before Reddit and even then only within the past decade or so. Let it die with that culture.
- I’m with you especially on that last part. My most insane privately racist lug-mate called it modding or customization. Even in the windows shell hacking scene no one described it like that.
  I do like using “tuning” though, fond memories of import tuner magazine and my dearly departed first car and first computer.
  
  If you cant put a set of rays on your pc can you even call it done? 😤
- Now they need to just find an Asian person saying it's not a big deal so they can dismiss your comment.
- It's a stupid term that is based on an antiquated mindset where Asian people are not creative and cannot invent anything of substance; we are only able to poorly imitate what the West develops. It needs to die.
  The term at least since the 90s means to modify stuff to your heart's content and literally creating something new, unique and personal.
  Idk where you went to get that "can't invent anything of substance" thing, but you might want to check your internalized racism.

Thank you for making this post. The number of times I've seen the term used here lately has been bothering me.

I agree, it's another example of racism being burned into the English language. You should always make an effort to change and adapt your vocabulary, to not do so is to endorse the very racist history that the term is based on.
Also the term just doesn't make sense? I have no idea what "rice" is supposed to evoke outside of its history in the car industry/communities. "Cooking" seems to be the better term because people on Unixporn "cook up" their desktop to make it as appealing as possible (to their tastes or to the tastes of the group). So a submission would be someone's "cook/dish." The whole "let them cook" remark is also a relevant catchphrase.
We can do better, and why disregard that opportunity? "Rice" is a two-faced compliment with racist roots. It deserves the bucket.
- I have no idea what “rice” is supposed to evoke outside of its history in the car industry/communities.
  Whoops, your virtue signal is showing.
  
  Don't go deleting it now.
  
  Ouch
  
  wdym, you think people can't change? Most everyone here has used rice before because it was the dominant term in this comm. Now that this post is here, there's no excuse for it. This is not the clever own you think it is.
  What a loser, get an actual argument instead of digging up my old comments that aren't relevant to the current discussion, or just go back to reddit, they'd love you.
- Yeah, "cooking" is superior

The arguments being made here are the same ones that were used for fggot, trp, nword, gpsy, rdskins, etc etc etc.
It's the same damn thing every single time, a bunch of reactionaries will piss and whine and piss and whine and piss and whine because they have to make the most minimal amount of effort to adopt a new word in their vocabulary instead of the problem one. They will piss and whine forever until eventually accepting it, like all the others historically.
They join a long long line of pissy whiney losers for making the same tired old arguments we've seen for so many things before.
- This is an example of the American cultural imperialism someone else was whining about above. In the UK a f@ggot is a type of food. There are adverts on the telly for it. A removed is a cigarette. Gypsy is not necessarily perjorative (it appears as a category on the census). Not sure what tr*p is, but if it's tramp, that's a homeless person. Also, a fanny is ladybits.
  
  tr*p
  This is generally a censor of the word "trap". While it obviously has several non-slur meanings, it is also used as an extremely visceral anti-trans (and in particular, anti-transfem) slur :/
  The implication is that transfem people are "secretly gay men trapping straight men into being attracted to them". It is associated with simultaneous sexualisation, homophobia, and transphobia >.<. If someone called me that IRL I would be seriously worried for my safety, as that's often the kind of thing people would say before either raping or killing or injuring a transfem person for """threatening""" their fragile sexuality, then using the trans panic defense.
  The term got it's start on 4chan, and people used it for femboy characters in anime (who are often poorly translated and may actually be trans in a lot of cases), but the kind of dehumanisation aspect of it means it very very quickly became a viscious anti-trans slur :/
  
  Is f____t not used as a ~~pejorative~~slur for gay men in the UK?
- new world vocabulary.
  lmao
  
  Not sure I understand the joke?

100% agree!!
I've never used the term and the first time I've heard about it even without knowing the origins/meaning it already was clear to be a pejorative term.
The excuse the mods in the old r/unixporn subreddit was that the term was broadly accepted by the community.
Well guess what we are not reddit and one of the reasons I left reddit was because I was tired of being in communities like that. We can do better, let's shape our communities with the right values and not just carry on a legacy that should've died with reddit itself.

I wasn't aware of this, thank you for posting

Asian here and rice eater here.
Language doesn't work in absolute way, it could change its meaning all the time.
It's better to regain is neutral meaning instead of letting the racist weaponize neutral word.
Also, this mindset is also Western centric, go to Asia and people in Linux and car community simply use the word without any negative connotation.
Edit: By doing this, you're no different from imperial government who tries to make one standard of morality, which in fact further hurts Asian living in Asia. And as Indonesian, I'm hurt with your statement. Let me regain the neutral meaning. Don't speak for us.
- Ok, Asian here and rice eater here also and I think the right way to respond to racist cliches is with hostility, same way we ought to respond to Nazism and other forms of fascism. if you want to reclaim the word, fine whatever. But you're drawing a false equivalence between westerners trying to self-criticize their use of chauvinistic language, and the imperial governments that enforce that chauvinism in the first place (wtf?)
  
  westerners trying to self-criticize their use of chauvinistic language
  That's the problem.
  Westerner often force this rules towards everyone.
  Like that one time someone got banned for using "nasi goreng" as their username with reasoning "it has similarity with Nazism" despite it's on international group.
  Or when Asian English group that usually co-exist within recognition of different culture suddenly has Westerner that policing everything about language. "Oh this is so offensive towards Asian", while no one in group never know or even used the word in negative connotation.
  While in reality because SEAsian are multi-language speaker, we just self moderate in case of potential language conflict, like budak in Malay is children, but in Indonesian means slave.
- Asian here and rice eater here.
  Ah yes, you need all your ethos cred for this one. No pick-me behavior for the crackers here. Not like there are billions of others with the same description as you (including a bangladeshi immigrant like me). I didn't bring my own race into this until the "Im asian and this is okay" posts happened.
  It's better to regain is neutral meaning instead of letting the racist weaponize neutral word.
  Racists love "neutral words." It's called dog whistling. Racists get their plausible deniability while they get to signal and exchange with other racists on public forums like this one. It doesn't matter if you didn't intend for this to happen, it's still facilitated here. There's always the possibility of new words, or are you too personally attached to "rice" for that to happen?
  Also, this mindset is also Western centric, go to Asia and people in Linux and car community simply use the word without any negative connotation.
  We are in a international, primarily english speaking lemmy instance by the developers of the project. Stop moving the goalposts here. We are not in your rhetorical places in "Asia" where there's no negative connotation. Of course it will seem "western centric."
  For your last edit, fuck right off. People can see through your crocodile tears and self tokenization. This type of shit only works with white people who will accept your opinions more than others because it means they get to keep their status quo. Nice bringing up imperialism, you'd be great as a lapdog.
  
  Unfortunately not surprised to see some unironic /r/asablackman going on here.
- Absolutely. Do not claim it's racist when language made its meaning neutral.
- Sorry friend, but reasoning with these people is always changing.
  If you think it's ok and you're not from the affected demography, you can't have a voice and "you're probably white".
  If you think it's ok and you're actually from the affected demography, you're just too dumb to understand your condition and have to let the white saviors and the "right" people from your demography explain to you why you should be angry and offended at everything.

ITT:
- The "pick-me"s are almost as bad

Yes please, I agree.

Sry I've been an absent mod here. Would anyone like to help mod this community?
I've also added a no-racist terms rule to the sidebar.
- I've sent you a private message before, about these discussions, and I offer again, if you need help I'd like to offer myself for the position, you can already see what my opinions are on this subject in previous posts. Feel free to send me a message if you wanna chat before. Cheers.
- Me 🖐️
  
  Done.
- Sure, I'd be more than happy to become mod and enforce the rules here.
- Happy to mod.

TIL thanks for the heads up o7

I got called out for saying this once. At first I was like "what's racist about rice" but when I googled it everything that came up was an explicitly anti-asian meme.
So yeah the word is being used in the west as a racist term so non Asians should reconsider whether using the term helps or hurts their relationships with others within the communities we frequent. I think vigilance is better than ambivalence.

In general I don't agree with the sort of broad language policing some people seem to be advocating for here, but this word does seem pretty inseparable from a racist joke. What could rice have to do with computer customization? Even if it's distanced from the original meaning the word itself implies that racist joke. So yeah probably better avoided and replaced.
- What could rice have to do with computer customization?
  Nothing, its a completely different meaning of the word rice.
  Even if it's distanced from the original meaning the word itself implies that racist joke.
  Me and everyone I know didn't know the history of the word at all until now. We didn't think it implied anything, we just assumed it was another stupid nonsensical English word.
  
  Nothing, its a completely different meaning of the word rice.
  Apparently it isn't though, or at least wasn't.
  We didn’t think it implied anything, we just assumed it was another stupid nonsensical English word.
  I guess it would be hard to know what people who don't know might conclude if they think about it. But don't most slang terms have some kind of near-surface etymology? Maybe someone could mistake it for being related to the practice of putting damp electronics in rice somehow. Idk, do you think the people who are opposed to its use are just muckraking?

Linguist here. Totally agree the term should stop being used. As a practical concern, it would be easier to get people to stop using it if there were another term that was a drop-in replacement.
Yeah, we can say "customize" as the verb, but what about the noun? Sharing "customizations" doesn't really refer to the same kind of DE-specific customization as the other term.
Is there any such word in usage? If not, can we coin one and just start dropping it on forums?
- Spokes. Via "bespoke"
  I'm bad at naming things.
  
  I don't dislike it!
  Ultimately as a practical matter, people are just way more likely to leave the other term if there's alternatives floating around.
  
  sounds too forced
- "pimping out", so there's that...
- i nominate baste/basting/basted
  i'll start using it if you start using it.
- Hi Linguist, which side of the linguist camp you are?; the one that thinks the meaning of the language is fix and people should be following it or the one that let people decides how the language works and let it change overtime?
  
  There aren't really two sides of the linguist camp. That language changes naturally over time is well documented.
  And new coinages are part of that process. ;)

How the fresh fuck is this even a thing still? Even back in the 90's I heard dudes making gags about "Uncle Ben Hot Rods". You know. RICE IT UP!
GET IT? They're shitty race cars made by a shitty race who only makes cheap stuff!
🤮
- Yeah I'm actually amazed people are still using this term. Figures it's about computers though lol, of course the antisocial nerds are stronger holdouts than car enthusiasts.
- put japanese parts on a hot rod?

I'm not bothered by it, but it is tacky.
When I was growing up, the term wasn't necessarily directed specifically towards Asian people, but Asian manufactured cars themselves. IE a Honda with a body kit and a loud muffler would be referred to as a "Rice Grinder" by some. It doesn't register in this context to me as racist, but definitely culturally insensitive and stupid.
I'm okay with the move to not use it.
- Ok, but read what you just wrote again. "Asian manufactured cars" is only slightly abstracted from what you just tacitly acknowledged is racist.
  I'm not saying the users of the term for Linux are intentionally being racist, but singling out Asian-manufactured cars is, or at least has been historically. Also, people put aesthetic mods on low quality American car models just as frequently.
  
  I dont agree, and reserve the right to differentiate racism from insensitivity depending on context. But that doesn't mean we can't be on the same page, that the term shouldn't be used.
  
  Ok why is there a shit storm about this word now? Linux modding isn't new. Ricing has been used to describe it for a long time. In many ways... isn't it good to pave over bad meanings with inclusive meanings?

I was going to make this post myself, thank you 😍

As an east Asian that eats rice every day, I must say that I don't consider this term racist at all. The meanings of words shift over time. For example, nice used to mean "foolish, ignorant, frivolous, senseless," but now it means "kind, thoughtful." Gay used to mean "lighthearted, joyous," then a slang for homosexuals, and ultimately became the term with which many homosexuals choose to describe themselves. Rice may have been a racist term, but now what it means is "to extensively customize one's desktop system to one's liking, especially Linux systems." It no longer is racist.
source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semantic_change
- As an Asian American, I assure you this is offensive to me. This is not a word that has shifted in the common vernacular here to mean anything that doesn't still have a strong base in its racist roots. For example, ricing your car still has derogatory undertones.
  
  I respect your freedom to choose which terms to consider offensive, and I do not plan to talk you into accepting terms offensive to you. Nevertheless, I want to say that while "ricing your car" does have derogatory undertones, "ricing my Linux system" just does not have the same undertone. Ricing cars, as in the racist context, means customizing cars so heavily that it becomes an abomination. Ricing a Linux system, on the other hand, is the act of making a Linux desktop system as aesthetically pleasing as possible.

Oh, shit, I never thought of that. Thanks for pointing it out

I disagree.
Ricers, in the 80s, as a term that referred to Japanese cars (Honda, Toyota) who burned rice instead of gas. This is bad. Full stop.
From there, rice, in the 90s-00s, referred to the Race Inspired Cosmetic Enhancement: typically bolted onto Honda and Toyota, it moved from that to any cosmetic car customization 10s.
Now we are in 20s, and rice refers to customizations that represent one’s personal choices regarding cosmetic enhancements.
Is that a bad thing?
Why should a word be locked in on a definition from 40 yrs ago? Why should it be stuck in the past?
Why not reclaim a word? Customizing a desktop is a labor of love. It takes a decent amount of time, and is deeply personal, representing one’s own taste.
- are you white by any chance
  
  You're not disregarding someone opinion based on race per chance.
- it started as something racist
  but then—
  We can stop right there
  
  You want to be close minded? That’s on you.
  
  That's an incredibly narrow minded view.
- Why not reclaim a word? Customizing a desktop is a labor of love. It takes a decent amount of time, and is deeply personal, representing one’s own taste.
  Or why not find our own words? Words aren't "locked" in on a single definition, but rather carry their whole host of definitions and history with them. You have to judge diction on all its fronts. Reclaiming a word means being part of the group that the term has actively disparaged (ex: reclaiming words like "queer") . Using "rice" is not an act of reclaiming in this context and we shouldn't view it that way.
  
  That is actual bs. Rice doesn’t bother me - I don’t read rice with a racial connection, at all. Just doesn’t exist for me. It is food and something that’s been customized.
  I say fuck it. Shatter the limitations of fraudulent history; don’t just go punk, go full cyberpunk.
  The major culture is hung up in non issues; and why not? So go counter to the culture:
  rice your desktop.
  You do you however. I am not here to say how you should think and do.
  
  If a word changes it’s general meaning in normal day use… from something so bad to something that’s no longer associated with said bad thing… is it really bad? What about gay then? That term has be co-opted by homosexual men. Do you suggest we stop using the word gay?
  Why don't you like that words are being declawed from their original poisonous nature?
- Are you fucking stupid, you think Japanese cars used to run on rice?
  
  😠
  
  No one thinks any cars actually burned rice to run, they were saying that's how the term originated (from a racist joke). But let's just jump straight to cussing people out and personal attacks.
- From there, rice, in the 90s-00s, referred to the Race Inspired Cosmetic Enhancement: typically bolted onto Honda and Toyota, it moved from that to any cosmetic car customization 10s.
  [Citation Needed]
  Any acronym other than the name of an organization can be presumed a retronym until proven otherwise

Not saying that this is a bad thing, but it's kind of amazing how opinions of the public can shift so drastically within a month: https://lemmy.ml/post/2080934. Last month another user posted in the very same !unixporn@lemmy.ml asking whether people consider the term "rice" racist. The majority opinion back then was "if you get offended over a term like this you should take a break from the Internet."
- It’s because the ratio of liberals to communists/ actual leftists who give a shit about not being racist has changed quite a bit since then
  
  It is interesting that many of those people are conservative bigoted fascists, not because of the words used but how.
  It is the language of hate that drives the mindset of gestapo and goosestep:
  your new opinion does not matter if it doesn’t match my old one (conservative)
  if you are different you are the presumed enemy (bigotry)
  an overwhelming desire to integrate personal ideology with state control (mussolini era fascism)
- Lol, it's a pretty good example of how hexbear federating with the rest of lemmy has functioned to push back on a lot of the casual bigotry that got imported from Reddit
  
  This term has been around a lot longer than reddit
- That's still the prevailing opinion in this thread lol.

I live in an obscure asian country and I rice while I eat rice.

TIL the origin of the word.
But I am confused. Anyone offended for using the word?
When repos changed to main from master, I got problems.
People are hypersensitive over these words now.
- But I am confused. Anyone offended for using the word?
  When repos changed to main from master, I got problems.
  People are hypersensitive over these words now.
  Well that's easy to say when you are not part of the affected group.
  
  But ...
  I am an Asian living in Asia. And I wouldn't know the racism encountered by someone over other continents. Hence the question.
  Peter Russell makes fun of India people.
  Jo Koy makes fun of Phillipine people.
  Jing Yang makes fun of Chinese people.
  Fluffy makes fun of Mexican people.
  Colored people can call each other N words.
  Even white comedians joke that the people most sensitive are the people who are not in the affected groups.
- When repos changed to main from master, I got problems.
  People are hypersensitive over these words now.
  Yeah, I don't understand why people would start malding when repos changed from master to main. They're just words after all.
- When repos changed to main from master, I got problems.
  No you just harbor already racist attitudes. There are a non-trivial amount of people who dislike arbitrary, antiquated terminology used in computer science like "master/slave" "male/female" and of course "master branch." Simply getting out your bullhorn and asking "who's actually offended by this?" is demeaning to the issue at hand which goes much farther than just a historical analysis of racism.
  
  Yeah, I remember thinking all of these terms were strange and creepy back when I first learnt them as a kid for goodness' sake. They've always been bad and I'm very glad they're finally going away.
- People have every right to be offended. Your point?
  
  Not OP, but.. Looking for things to be outraged about is not good for a healthy community.
- I grew up with a racist uncle that rode a Harley, so hearing rice used like that is eyebrow raising for me. Everyone will have a different perspective though.
- I'm Asian American. I'm offended by this word. In my experience, it has always been a racist perjorative every time it's been used.
  Like you mentioned in your other comment, you don't have the American racial experiences with how this is used to understand why this hurts me, so I'd like to clarify that it does.
- No Asians are.
  This is more about power and control than racism.
  
  One of the top-rated replies so far is an Asian who expresses they are offended, so that can't be right.
  What power and control does this even give someone?
  
  bravely commenting your garbage opinion on a burner~<3
  
  the refuge of every bigot: "the people I'm being bigoted towards want power and control over me. it's pure projection.
  
  Hi. Asian American here. I'm honestly offended by this term, and deeply offended by you assuming you can speak for me on this topic.

I honestly don't know what's the problem here and I'm speaking from a person coming from ASEAN which is the one of the most discriminated group of people in the Asian. You have to place the term into the context to determine whether it is racist or not. If you're describing an Asian product a ricer with the point that it is load, this is racist. Otherwise, ricing shouldn't be a problem here. But then again, if you find it offended despite not being an Asian, just use other terms that suit your taste. The "master" shouldn't and must not be used with "slave" in the same text to refer to anything that implies subjugation. But then again, how about the master who is highly skilled in their own field? What do we have to refer such people? And interestingly, not a lot of people have any feeling over the words "monkey". This term is generally used in a pejorative way to describe people from ASEAN, implying that we haven't evolved. Should we stop using the term "monkey"? A lot of these are depended on the context, if you have any little sense and basic on linguistic. In the end, I'll be still using ricing to describe my extensive customisation and you will be using other terms. If your proposed term becomes the dominant term, then for the sake of making people easier to understand what I'm saying, I will use that term too.
- The origin of the word "monkey" is for the animal and "master" for skilled person or hierarchical boss while the origin of the word "ricer/ricing/riced" is explicitly and only a racist insult
  If your proposed term becomes the dominant term, then for the sake of making people easier to understand what I'm saying, I will use that term too
  You would've went wild in the USA during slavery times
  
  "ricing" means customisation, that's it. That's the context. It's not about the origin of the word, otherwise the "f"-word that ends with "t" should be used in your own logic. "gay" was used pejoratively during medieval time, does it mean when we're calling homosexual people that proudly label themselves as that is being homophobic here? It's about the meaning of the word in the context where it's being used. If "ricing" is being used in the context of de, then I don't see a problem here. If you use "ricing" to describe anything that appears loud to you, then for sure you're being racist.

til about this, but like, I doubt anyone uses this in a racist way though, far from it.
- Asian American here who's into car culture (where the term originated). It has always been a racist term from its inception, and is still used as a racist term today, from my experience.
- It's still racist to use racist terms without deliberate or malicious intent.
  
  that sounds so funny ngl
  
  It is racist to use the word intent. It is cultural appropriation

The hexbear squad is really brigading the fuck out of this thread.
- This thread has 400 comments. It's on everyone's feed who federated with lemmy.ml
- thread appears on our feeds. we comment on it.
  i understand it feels bad to have your beliefs questioned, but that's not brigading, it's simply how these websites work
- there is no such thing as "brigading" in federation. it is just people commenting you don't agree with
- Noooooo don't comment on our public post on social media that we purposely allowed you to comment on
- Instance has comparatively high and active userbase with a very high percentage of Linux users
  Is this brigading?
  
  Instance has comparatively high and active userbase with a very high percentage of Linux users
  That may be true, but your instance doesn't have a very high percentage of engagement in this community outside of this post. Copying from an older comment of mine:
  These are the top 3 instances commenting in this specific post at the time of writing (2023-08-25 08:02 UTC):
  undefined
  
  instance | count -------------+------- hexbear.net | 205 lemmy.ml | 106 lemm.ee | 61
  These are the top 3 instances and their comment counts on any post in lemmy.ml/c/unixporn this month at the time of writing:
  undefined
  
  domain | count -------------+------- lemmy.ml | 210 hexbear.net | 210 lemm.ee | 100
  You're reading that right, hexbear has a whopping FIVE comments in this community that are not part of this post.
  One of those 5 is a user participating in the hexbear brigade in this thread that commented previously said rices were inspiring. But go ahead and tell me all those users are pillars of the linux community. Which bad faith argument will you use next?
  Inb4 bRIgaDIng HAs To be ORGaniZed And we're NoT; even though an acceptable use of the term is also when a particular group floods another community's space that they don't normally participate in. I know you lot have trouble grasping a term can have multiple definitions, so don't hurt yourself champ.
- It’s brigaiding when people you don’t like comment on posts that everyone can see on the website we all use
  Big brain take right here
- rent free
- Brigading the fuck out of our comrade's thread...?
  We can't defend ourselves when called out or support each other outside of hexbear.net without being called out for brigrading.
  Ya all losing your minds.
- 400 comments total is rookie numbers. You should check out the news posts involving either Russia, China, or Taiwan. Or check out this post where the admins of lemm.ee asked for the users' opinions of whether to defederate from hexbear.net. There are 1884 comments. (There was once more than 1900 comments, but I guess the mods removed some.)
  
  Lemmy user when they complain about people commenting on their social media site
  
  too much discussion on your discussion platform?
  
  China, or Taiwan
  
  cry harder comprador

Im asian. I eat and like rice, even on my setups. I'm gonna keep using rice cause its not my fault yall western imperialists fuck shit up and dont wanna be reminded of it. also very western centric debate. Good job debate perverts.
- Asian here and rice eater here also and I think the right way to respond to racist cliches is with hostility, same way we ought to respond to Nazism and other forms of fascism. if you want to reclaim the word, fine whatever. But you're drawing a false equivalence between westerners trying to self-criticize their use of chauvinistic language, and the imperial governments that enforce that chauvinism in the first place (what the fuck dude)
  Funny you're calling anyone a debate pervert
  
  I think the right way to respond to racist cliches is with hostility
  true.
  But you’re drawing a false equivalence between westerners trying to self-criticize their use of chauvinistic language, and the imperial governments that enforce that chauvinism in the first place (what the fuck dude)
  true, i fucked up with that. my issue with this (the way i see it) is white people do racist shit, and the rest of us have to move to their tune, including however they feel things need to be fixed and to absolve them of their guilt. id much rather have the racist term and the history all in front and center. this is the history of the term, this is how it was used, and this is how we use it. I see it like the word "queer", was a pejorative at a point that's now been reclaimed.
  Funny you’re calling anyone a debate pervert
  takes one (me) to know one. lol.
- I'm sorry, I didn't know an (generic) Asian heritage absolves you of all guilt and self crit. I'm south asian desi so I should know better right?
  Also what is your mental gymnastics. "Imma show those western imperialists that I'm not a crybaby and continue to use their racist slang they invented/popularized for people like me in this tiny niche community."
  Pick-me attitudes don't make you any more respectable, you just disengaged from this topic due to your own personal feelings. You've become the token Asian that the same western imperialists use to silence this discussion.
  
  Its more if youre embarrassed by that word thats your problem. I coopted the word and am using it how i see fit. i see this as white guilt trying to sanitize something white imperialists created. And in trying to do so exert ''righteous'' force on everyone else in order to absolve you of your guilt.
  ps. Ive been made the token asian by enough crackers out there. They can all fuck off.

It is not racist and have nothing to do with asian men. But white men who riced asian cars.
- I think it was really in reference to any modified Japanese car back in the 00's. Haven't heard that term in a while, though.
- I thought it was Racing Inspired Cosmetic Enhancement, that is putting shitty race decals and spoilers onto some piece of shit car. Its probably a reverse acronym though to fit the unital racist term.
  Unlike calling an Asian car a rice burner, which is just straright perjorative.
  
  you can make fuel out of rice
  https://www.livescience.com/4930-rice-byproduct-biofuel.html

That's a good point. What do you use instead?
- "Polished," "tweaked," or if we want to reclaim a term from the crafters, "bedazzled."
  
  No, it has to work as a adjective, verb and a noun. (Check out my rice, Look how riced my setup looks, How do I rice my Linux Mint Cinnamon desktop the same way as this other rice?, etc)
- Probably mayo or some shit like that.
  
  oh look, it's a whiny little cracker! that puts your racism elsewhere in the thread in context
  
  okay

Nah, I like the term.
It refers to early 00s car culture, a race car had all go no show, a ricer had all show no go. It's just the next iteration of the term. And it's pejorative to anyone who does that shit, not asian men. I have no idea where y'all got that idea from.
- It's also racist in car culture.
  
  Okay, how? How does it discriminate based on race or ethnicity?
- It also can refer to people using rice as a pejorative catch-all term for east Asian people. The next iteration of the term still continues its racist connotations. "Not just Asian men" is a deflection from its racist roots.
  
  Have you ever heard it as a blanket for Asian people? Never in my life. It's always been about cars
- Its not a TexMex taco, its a Beaner taco... Its not a race car, its a beaner car.... Substitute with any other racist name or description and its easy to see why its not ok.
- The term is definitely for cars that have had all the money spent on bling, that are as you say, not capable. All show, no go.
  A mate of mine had a sleeper. The only thing you could see that gave it away was a small sticker that said "eats rice".
  It was a call to any rice to give him a try.
  
  You can't say sleeper, because it's a pejorative for those with narcolepsy.
- Actually it's from the 1970s. And yes you are right, it's pejorative, and implies a particular ethnicity. Which is why it's racist. You could say it's a clunker for example, no ethnicity implied.
  Imagine that you are blue. And we start associating blueberries, they happen to be the national dish of the blue ethnic group, with shit. And people start calling things they think are shit or not good "blueberries", do you not think you would feel targeted? No one said "blue is shit", but the coding is obvious to anyone with more than a half neuron.
  
  Clunker really doesn't come close to the cars it referenced though. Not trying to defend it's use, I understand what everyone is talking about here. There really is no good replacement word though, which is frustrating. Like, that entire era of car culture came and went before many of us involved knew the word was racist (or at least before we were mature enough to care).

I kinda thought this conversation would eventually happen. I have mixed feelings on the subject but am generally inclined not to use the term myself as I find it distasteful. But I think there's an important consideration for those who'd like to discontinue the term rice in this community: what language would we like to use instead? Specifically a good noun for referring to a given setup we've made. In therapy they teach you that stopping a behavior is a very hard thing to accomplish, and that instead you should always try to replace a behavior- I believe that idea is very relevant here
I'd be curious to hear people's thoughts on what they'd like to use instead
- You can also use "cooking" or a "dish" to describe a user submission. Then people can use food-related diction to comment on each other's works. It's just a suggestion, but it proves that there are solutions.
- I'm not active in the community these days but I might as well through some suggestions in the mix:
  splash (like a splash of paint)
  face
  tweek
  dec (like decorate, or decked out) or deq
  
  I like the sound of decking, makes me think of the people who do cool mods on their steam deck!
  
  I think we should call it "syrup"
  "That's some sweet sway syrup", or "that gnome syrup is stallman af"
  
  None of it is as cool as rice
- What about just "Dots" or "Dotfiles", after all these are the main components that we share or seek in these posts.
  Or "Toast", not gonna expand on that I just like how it sounds funny.
  
  I like toast honestly
  
  +1 for Toast
- Since Linus is Finnish, I'd propose we use "bread/bakers/baking" instead.
  
  Actually in Finland we use "tuunaaminen"
  
  We've got toasters, and now bread boxes? I'm in!
- I like:
  fryup + frying
  dish + cooking

Leaning into the "porn" part of unixporn, we could say we"fluffed" our setup. Because like fluffers, we're making things bigger an more attractive to show off.
- yeah just one big circlejerk

I am disheartened but not surprised by the “obvious ethnicity based insult is not racist” comments here.

Interesting question.
!pcmasterrace@lemmy.world had a kind of similar conversation, with a poll.
Maybe that's something that should happen here too?
- I was also very disappointed that the users there voted against the change. The name has a bad history, and there's no better time to change a community name than when you make a move to a new platform.
  This isn't neatly as big of a change, though. I don't think a poll should be needed. The mods should just take a stance against racism and enforce that the term not be used.
  
  Why is there huge pushback in this thread from reclaiming a word by changing it's meaning from a racist one to something cool and inclusive?
- I'd hope the moderators here will take a clear and firm stance on the matter instead of making a poll. Polls in this context would only shift blame away from the mods of this comm and onto the community at large. The comm description references the term, so it goes all the way to the top.
  
  I agree with you, but I'm not that confident as the moderation had a few questionable actions in the past (pushing this community to LW, not moderating it for a while)

lmao like moths to a flame
@dessalines@lemmy.ml there's a lot of cryptofash in here begging the question that need to be banned, not merely have their comments removed
- Small question for you, is Dessalines still expected to moderate this community? I assumed they would have bigger fish to fry
  
  Further down the thread they were calling for mods. I'm calling for admin action.
- You are also begging to be banned. Your comment calling someone a "comprador" is to be removed too.
  
  someone
  also strong gusano is a slur energy

Huh, I was under the impression it was an acronym for Racing Inspired Cosmetic Enhancement or something along the lines of that. Parts that make the car look like a racecar but don't actually help it perform any different.
It could totally be a backronym that was generated after it's initial use though.
- no it definitely comes from the fact that a lot of modded cars that get called that are Honda, Toyota and other car companies from Asia. I've never heard someone call a dude's suped up Mustang that even if they added stuff to make it look more like a race car.
  
  Google riced mustang and you will see plenty.
- def a backronym

Whoops..... First "rice" I saw I thought to myself.... Damn, that looks really nice.
undefined

Really
N I
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C E
Thought I had it all figured out. FML.
- I thought it was from the "better with rice" thing

Yeah, I had absolutely no idea what "ricing" was even supposed to mean, like it doesn't look like it's short for anything, doesn't seem like an acronym for anything, it's not analogous or synonymous with anything, I can't see how "rice" is supposed to be metaphorical at all to cool looking linux desktops, and it's not an entirely new word like "rizz" or "yeet"
So by all accounts it's an absolutely unfitting word for what it's describing
Knowing the racist history of the term now, yeah that makes sense and yeah I vote we move to an objectively better term
Idk what tho, maybe "decore" cuz it actually describes that the focus is the look, that the DE is the Core of the setup, and sounds cooler than "rice"
"Decore" and "Decorizing" is probably the terms I'm personally gonna use atleast
Edit: unless I find a better term, I came up with this one on the stop
- The term rice comes from Japanese culture of modding cars aesthetically. Basically getting a basic normal car and making it look cool.
  And if we go even further back, not many people know this but rice is actually food.

It has a new meaning now. No one cares and few would bother looking up where it comes from. Languages are dynamic and change all the time. The word removed meant a stick of wood but now it means something else and few would use it to refer to someone else. This doesn't mean we should change literature that was written before this change. tl;dr: the meaning has changed and no one cares.
- tl;dr: the meaning has changed and no one cares.
  Nobody is asking to change "literature" all were asking is that we develop new and better terminology for this niche that doesn't also come with racist baggage.
  The word removed meant a stick of wood but now it means something else and few would use it to refer to someone else
  Ooo can you tell the class what that word means now? And what it's used for? Your example falls flat because this situation and the historical pattern you're referring to aren't as comparable as you think they are.
  PSA: racists love words with multiple meanings because it gives them plausible deniability. This is happening right now in this thread. Changing the word "rice" would deal a huge blow to racists as it would show that the unixporn comm will not be beholden to the status quo.
- The words F-g and F----t are used in UK parlance daily as slag for a cigarette and a pork offel meatball respectively. The word "f-g" falls out my gob so naturally when refering to a cigarette I always have to check myself on American run sites.
  
  You can write it out this is not reddit
  
  You can write it out, no need to censor yourself. You're not calling someone a removed, are you ? you're being descriptive about the usage of that word. Censorship creates stigma, we have to recognize when to do it (= when usage is intended harm)
- The word has not changed that much in common use (as far as it gets common at all). Ricing your car still has derogatory undertones, and even if you aren't aware, it still has racist undertones as well if you think about it at all. Just because you aren't aware if it doesn't mean the affected people aren't. If you said ricing in this context around me, I'd assume you're ignorant at best, and deliberately racist and trying to offend me at worst

Kinda curious as to what actual Asian folks, whether currently in Asia or of Asian descent, think.
I don't use the term anyway because I'm an old grognard and couldn't grok the lingo, but it seems to me that they're the ones other folks should be listening to on this.
- You can start with reading the top comments here.
- Asian American. It's offensive. I probably won't say anything, but I will look at you funny and assume you're ignorant at best.
- East Asian here. I think the term is fine.

Sheesh, there sure are a lot of hexbear users here piling onto anybody with a different opinion
Edit: I went ahead and queried the lemmy database from a federated instance I have access to.
These are the top 3 instances commenting in this specific post at the time of writing (2023-08-25 08:02 UTC):
undefined

instance | count -------------+------- hexbear.net | 205 lemmy.ml | 106 lemm.ee | 61
These are the top 3 instances and their comment counts on any post in lemmy.ml/c/unixporn this month at the time of writing:
undefined

domain | count -------------+------- lemmy.ml | 210 hexbear.net | 210 lemm.ee | 100
You're reading that right, hexbear has a whopping FIVE comments in this community that are not part of this post.
For the curious, those 5 comments at the time of writing are:
https://hexbear.net/comment/3722672
https://hexbear.net/comment/3749006
https://hexbear.net/comment/3722165
https://hexbear.net/comment/3722091
https://hexbear.net/comment/3790117
One of which is especially hilarious as we see a hexbear user that's been railing on people in this post using the very term they're condemning here. Strong convictions? Perhaps bandwagoning the hexbear teet? Who knows. Definitely not suspicious 🙄
- Those different opinions being... using racist terms? Just to get that straightened up
  
  Look ma, another one! Do you all take shifts on duty watching this thread?
  Different opinions being challenging your collective definition of the word being inherently racist. You can hem and haw all you want but meanings can change over time. If it can start being used racially at one point it can surely stop at another.

So you are saying, all this time, we have been ricists!?

I've always thought it's something to do with how you can customize fried rice to your heart's content, and the overall versatility of rice in general.
But given that it is offensive, what is the closest alternative that gives a similar, if not the same nuance without the offense? What do we mean when we say ‘rice’/‘ricing’ in desktop environment customization anyway?
- Cook/Dish was my example, using other food related terms are also acceptable since the main conflict is that "rice" has a double meaning as you've shown. Plus, wouldn't it be cooler if everyone had their own personal food related title to their submissions? Or if the literal comm description didn't reference the term "rice" thereby setting it as the de-facto vocabulary?
  
  The example you've given is really appealing, though my concern is more about finding something that's already in fairly wide circulation (wide relative to the niche we're taking about here).
  Don't get me wrong, coming up with a new sense of an existing word like in your example is certainly doable, but I suppose that it's a lot harder than adopting a synonymous term
  If there's none close enough in meaning and nuance already in use, then yeah, personally, I'm okay with cook/dish.
- I’ve always thought it’s something to do with how you can customize fried rice to your heart’s content, and the overall versatility of rice in general.
  Wholesome, and grain-accurate.

A lot of you need your blood pressure checked
- For sure. Whatever your position is on this topic, it's a good thing we talk about it and the discussion should be more civilized.
- I don't care one way or another, but this thread really makes me hungry

I don't understand where the problem arises exactly, there is no racist intent in its usage here, it's just a word, it's an empty container and we fill it with meaning. In this context it just means "customization", sure it's not a completely made up term and its origin is lowkey racist, but, as you stated yourself, not many know at all of that connotation, they go on to use it despite never meaning to use bad language on purpose, because it has simply acquired a different meaning, it was just the lingo they happened to find in the community.
There's plenty of words that had historically been bad and then became good, same the other way around. I believe that's the case here as well.
Even so, if an alternative word is proposed and favored, even just plain "customization" (which I feel would be better than replacing it with a lingo word, as it would make it easier for newcomers to understand what is being talked about more easily), I wouldn't be opposed, the main thing is to be able to convey the meaning, that's what that matters most in the end
- Asian American. As you mentioned, the roots of this weird are racist, and I'd argue that it was not "lowkey" either. If you said this around me in real life, I'd probably give you a funny look and assume you're ignorant. But that doesn't mean I'm not offended. Racism has caused honest trauma to me, and despite your innocent intentions, you are causing me pain.
  
  I respect that, I honestly might not be very informed on the thing, so if it does still hurt then, by all means, let's get rid of it

For the sake of the American asian diaspora minorities again?
This reminds me of attacking those girls for wearing a kimono or cheongsam to a prom. The Japanese and Chinese living in Japan and China certainly don't have an issue. It's the Japanese/Chinese American minority community who has built their identity around it, and feels threatened by the use of their traditional clothing. Fine, the prom is in America, it's an American problem in an American space, the local diaspora have a say there.
Unixporn on lemmy.ml isn't American(or any one country) though, clearly there are a variety of people from every corner of the globe here. This place is positively cosmopolitan. I don't see a reason why the "rice" term still has to be protected despite being a global platform. Just like it's fine for any tourist to rent a kimono in Japan, it should be fine to use rice as a term here. Unless this platform were to officially become Amerian(or any other country like Fedd.it etc), this problem shouldn't exist. I'm an rice eating asian myself, I'll be glad if people were to associate rice with customization.
The Asian American community should keep in mind that the internet isn't always an American space by default. I don't think they should be gatekeeping everything Asian on a global platform.
- this is anglophone forum and the origins of the word are rooted in racism
  but by all means keep outing yourself
  
  As what, an Asian who can read and write English? Just India alone has a significant chunk of the human population, speaking English outside of the typical English speaking countries. It's not that odd anymore.
- you're talking as if asian americans even care, this kind of stuff has always been white Americans practicing self-flagellation to apologize about their slave owning ancestors

I think the racists connotation came first, but I also heard it explained as an acronym - "Race Inspired Cosmetic Enhancement"
- I think that's just like the whole FORD "Found On Road Dead" thing. Wordplay after the fact.
  
  Yeah, they're both backronyms. (Yes, I only replied to use that word).
  
  Fix It Again, Tony
  
  or the english teacher who tried to tell my class that "rap" was "rhythm associated poetry" 😆

Discussions like this always bring me back to one thing...can a word itself be racist? Is it racist to use a word if it's not being said with racist intent? It's reminiscent of the gimp debacle...if a words use isn't intended to offend it's honestly beyond me how anyone could find it offensive. Are we supposed to ban every single word that has the slightest history of being used in an offensive fashion? Feel like we'd have a really long list if we did that.

It's not a pejorative toward asian men at all. Not everyone is as racist as you.
- Asian American here. It has always been a racist perjorative from it's starting days in car culture. It still offends me.

This is the same shit as with r/animemes and the word trap back on reddit.

I first heard the term "ricer" from some Asian kids I knew in high school so I've never really considered it racist. But then... The N word is also mostly used by black guys (in my experience; don't run into too many super racist non-black people who use it) and it is racist so... 🤷🏻‍♂️

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