Imagine being forced to spend 20% of your income on a depreciating asset and then calling it "freedom".

More like “I hate my job, but social safety nets are nonexistent and I need to eat food. On top of that I’m forced to spend my precious income on a machine that requires fossil fuels which are destroying the environment” but yes
- Yeah but that doesn't let you blame the people for having a car
  
  Public transportation is non existent in a lot of the US and the cost of taking a cab is higher than a car payment. We have sprawling cities where if you don't want to work a commute that would be 3+ hours each way you are precluded from most jobs and you better have 3-6 months of money saved to job search in your area at that point.
  Millions of people are stuck in places where if you don't have a car you're going not going to finding much work or working a living wage.

I realized recently that the reason Americans are so poor is because they need cars. Every other nation has at least adequate public transportation. Think about how much richer Americans would be if they didn't have to constantly maintain a car. That maintenance easily takes out $1000 a month with fuel, loan, tax and insurance. And most places in the US your going to need 2 cars for the family. $2000, that's a months worth of food for a family of four. Yeah, not great.
And the one city in America that you don't need cars, NYC, a drink costs $30.
- That maintenance easily takes out $1000 a month with fuel, loan, tax and insurance.
  For new cars, sure. Used cars are a lot less than that, but even a couple hundred a month is significant for someone on minimum wage, and even worse when it is the month that something breaks....
  
  As someone who put $2500 and dozens of hours and sweat and blood into a used car in the last three months: They’re not always cheaper.
  
  Or if they have a single health issue they need medication for.
  
  That’s the main problem, you either spend a lot up front or a lot in random, unpredictable intervals.
  I’m really fortunate to be able to rely on public transit despite living in LA, because I can’t imagine paying for everything associated with a car on top of rent.
  
  So when I said $1000 a month I'm including that your going to have to repair. You can't really escape it unless you really understand cars. Sure the used car is cheaper up front, but those hidden repair costs can add up right quick if you don't know how to deal with a lot of them on your own. And that time to understand cars is also taking away from your self development. So even with cheap used cars, my estimate of $1000 a month is pretty spot on.
  Edit. I forgot to add all the opportunity costs from travel instead of studying on a train. $1000 is really probably low balling even with a cheap used car.
- And the one city in America that you don’t need cars, NYC, a drink costs $30.
  The cheapest beers at my local bar are like $4. A basic cocktail is like $8. I know you were doing a hyperbole but not everywhere is Times Square :(
  Shit's still too expensive generally everywhere, but I feel like here I'm getting something for my money (eg: a subway system, sidewalks, free musuems, etc)
  
  I am being hyperbolic, but $8? That's crazy cheap. That's like prices in the areas I do live. I don't live in NYC but I visit all the time. I think the cheapest I found was $18. Now, don't give your location away, but which section of NYC can be that low? I'd like to visit sometime!
- Australians also need cars, but are less poor than Americans

Rent: am I a joke to you?
I live inna shit hole and renting saps people likely 50% of the median income
- Absolutely. A $5k 1998 Toyota Corolla will be bulletproof for another twenty years yet. Fuel and oil every now and then is all it will ask for, and as long as you don't need to compensate for your lack of manhood, there's no reason that won't take you anywhere you need to go. I don't understand why Americans feels the need to take a loan out on a six figure "truck". Sure as shit it's not to "haul" the milk and cookies home from the grocery store.
  However, you do have to compensate for the lack of a roof over your head, and that will take a lot more of your income on a monthly basis.
  
  $5000 for a 27 year old car is a lot of money though. Though being a Toyota you are probably not losing much if you ever need to sell it.
- Ive paid as much as 90% of my rent on rent+utils
  Edit: fuck i think if income as 'rent'.

I‘m sure there is a „Metric“ song about this…
Found it. Handshakes by Metric:
Buy this car to drive to work Drive to work to pay for this car Bah bah bah-da la
Say you wanna get in And you're gonna get out But you won't 'Cause it's a trap
- Also the Over the Hedge version of Rockin' the Suburbs by Ben Folds Five:
  We drive our cars every day
  To and from work both ways
  So we make just enough to pay
  To drive our cars to work each day
  Hey hey

At least he’s carpooling

Eat to work/work to eat
- Eat just to shit. Shit just to eat. What is this life

Imagine being forced to spend 20% of your income on a depreciating asset
FuckJapaneseHomes apparently also needs to be a community.

I'm the person in the bottom right of this comic.

Metric made a song (partially) about this catch 22.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fYbrb2YYqdo

I absolutely hate it but I don’t have a choice which is why I find the cheapest car that I can pay for in cash. I have some cash saved up and found a new car for the equivalent of $15300 which is 25% of my income, but wish I didn’t have to buy it.

It is freedom. Freedom to go where you went, when you want. Freedom to explore, freedom to experience things you couldn't otherwise.
I buy all of my cars outright, but have never been forced. Owning cars, driving cars, working on cars, and selling cars are all joys to be had.
If you don't like driving, then don't. Take a bus, a train, or bike. But just because you cannot afford it, or because driving is scary for you, don't presume that the majority is going to agree.
- If you don’t like driving, then don’t. Take a bus, a train, or bike
  That's exactly the problem: I can't, my city has shitty bus routes with 1 hour frequency, trains are non existent, bike infrastructure only on dreams. That's the freedom we want, but with car centric infrastructure, we don't have the freedom to choose how to move and function on this society
  
  I'm lucky to live walking distance to work. 99.995% of my city doesn't have that option and must rely on a car. My city spends almost nothing in public transit but spends a lot on roads and other car subsidies.
- It's freedom to go where you want so long as you
  register with the government
  insure it
  get a license
  maintain it (likely by paying someone else to do it, since it's a complicated skill set )
  figure out fuel and oil sources
  probably other stuff I'm forgetting
  persoally, I think being able to walk or bike somewhere is more free. Public transit that's just always there, running every couple minutes, is also good.
  As to "take a bus", part of the problem, and part of why communities like "fuck cars" gain traction, is that most places are car-first, and thus taking a bus isn't a viable option. These modes of transit aren't equal. Where my parents live in the suburbs it would be a long dangerous walk to a bus stop, and then the buses don't run often, or go many places.
  People aren't mad at cars out of spite. They're mad because car-first culture is bad ecologically, socially, and economically.
- I buy all of my cars outright, but have never been forced. Owning cars, driving cars, working on cars, and selling cars are all joys to be had.
  You're a person after my own heart. Cars deserve better than to be used for commuting.
  The more people we can get to not use cars for things the better cars will be. They wouldn't design ugly drab eggs in three colors if cars weren't treated like appliances.
  
  I think the opposite is true. If cars weren't treated like they are a necessary part of the personality and instead just like a thing, the owners may stop valueing them less than other people's lives. Like 'I am in a hurry, I will just overtake that cyclist in front of me with an inch if distance, because I am so much more important.'
- I'd love to walk, bike, or take the bus, but there are no busses where I live, sparse sidewalks, and no bike lanes. You do the math.
- Have you tried taking public transport yourself to commute to work? In most cities in the US, it’s unreliable, inefficient, or straight up not even there. For many commuters, driving is the only option.

Who's forcing you?
Were you held at gunpoint to buy a car?
- Nope, just can't live close enough to my job to walk, there's no public transit, and the job requires you have transport ready to go upon being hired.
  Not all coercion is at the end of a barrel, bruv
- "Is your husband held you at gunpoint before forcing himself on you? No? Then it's not marital rape. Case close"
- They are forced by their housing being too far from the city centre to walk, and there are no viable alternatives to driving. No public transport, cycling is unsafe