The New York Times ever being perceived as progressive is the biggest scam ever.
The New York Times ever being perceived as progressive is the biggest scam ever.
253 comments
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Here's the article summary:
"One time, Brian worked in a field. Luigi on the other hand, had rich parents, just like Osama Bin Laden."
I fucking wish I was joking.
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I laughed out loud at this.
An alternate opinion column could be: "One time, Adolf was an aspiring artist. Winston on the other hand, had rich parents, just like Osama Bin Laden."
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Winston Churchill was a genuinely awful human being and a war criminal prior to WWII.
He lucked out by also being a moderately competent wartime leader, who gets to be juxtaposed against Hitler for eternity.
Also, Brett Stephens is a bed bug and has a terrible track record of properly handling public backlash to his writing. I hope dark days are ahead for him.
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"Oh God, the poor are uniting! Quick, we need to stir up some division"
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"He ate steaks like Trump, not like that despicable vegetarian, Hitler"
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You do realize this is an opinion column? You can tell by the big letters at the top that spell out OPINION
EDIT: here's my "both sides" take on this, you all are as dumb as Fox News viewers. IMO (notice the O stands for opinion, please do not hold Lemmy accountable for what I say) schools need to implement a class on the media. Kids need to learn the difference between news and opinion. Also learn how to identify the source of the news. Also don't post your nudes on the internet. Things are about to get a lot worse with AI and deep fakes
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Yeah and? Doesn't make his opinion any less garbage
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You do realize, even for an opinion piece, this is astoundingly poor quality and taste? You can tell by having two brain cells to rub together.
I expect this sort of shit from a tabloid, not from any organization claiming journalistic integrity. A shitty piece is still a shitty piece, even if it's hiding behind the opinion column banner.
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Do you see NYT publishing any opinion pieces to the effect of "The healthcare CEO socially murdered thousands every year and the fact that we don't have a legal mechanism to deal with them is infinitely more important than a guy who only killed one person"
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An opinion The NY Times chose to share with their readers.
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The great thing about opinions? They typically spur opinions from other people. And those opinions spur more opinions.
What I’m trying to say is that the article being an opinion does not in any way negate the comment you’re being dismissive of, which in itself is an opinion too. That’s kind of how conversations happen.
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Your point? The Editor still has control over what is allowed to be printed/released and associated with their name.
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Nobody responding to you was unaware this was an opinion piece.
Reread the responses and try again.
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Opinions should be here to stay!
I liked the preprint of their opinion column publishing tomorrow, headline:
Some of those kids in Palestine were asking for it
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NYT doesn't decide if its news or opinion alone, so does their audience.
Therefore they are responsible for the ideas they give a platform too.
Do you remember why are they avoiding face shots of Luigi?
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In a comment full of shit takes, i just wanna point out that you think the government teaching media literacy in school is the solution?
I hope you wear a helmet regularly.
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So edgey, dear
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Here's the article, for anyone interested.
It basically boils down to: Brian Thompson grew up in a working class family in Iowa, while Luigi Mangione came from wealth and went to private schools. He compares Mangione to Osama bin Laden, and other "Angry rich kids jacked up on radical, nihilistic philosophies," who "cause a lot of harm, not least to the working-class folks whose interests they pretend to champion."
The author then mentions some polling that says people like their health insurance provider, actually. And then finally he says this:
Thompson’s life may have been cut brutally short, but it will remain a model for how a talented and determined man from humble roots can still rise to the top of corporate life without the benefit of rich parents and an Ivy League degree.
Without a stitch of irony. Thompson may have come from working class roots, but that ain't where he ended up. So if it's ok to become rich, but it's not ok to be born rich, then I guess this author supports a 100% inherence tax? Yeah, somehow I doubt it.
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The fact that he came from working class roots and chose to become a massive piece of shit makes him even worse than someone who was born into privilege.
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Likewise, Luigi Mangione came from a background of privilege, yet gave it all up in the fight for the rights of all Americans.
Turns out you can be born into the working class and still be a piece of shit, and you can be born well off and still be a decent person.
The people writing these opinion pieces should be thrilled to hear that there is still hope for their children.
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Yes! Brian Thompson and Luigi were both class traitors for completely different reasons. Thompson betrayed the working class for his own selfishess while Luigi was like Engels in that he walked away from extreme privilege because he was disgusted by what his class was doing to us.
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People aren't responsible for how they're born. Being born into a family that's benefitted from human suffering is out of their control.
Choosing to harm people in order to join a class of societal leeches is different.
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Came from working class roots...and then decided that those same people get to die so he can make a buck.
Insurance companies are run by sociopaths
I don't give a fuck where someone came from, only where they CHOSE to end up.
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Siddartha Gautama (better know as the Buddha) was literally born a prince and gave up his life of privilege in order to live as a beggar. Sure, he never killed anyone (except his own future life as a king), but he still became a saint. Meanwhile, Jesus may have come from more humble roots but he could have become a king had he chosen to do so.
All I'm saying is Reuters clearly knows where their bread is buttered.
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I feel like these ghouls at the NYTrash are far more "nihilistic" than Luigi.
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Just cancelled my subscription, absolutely disgusting seeing this on the front page. Is there any publication left not bought and paid for by our corporate overlords?
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I can't vouch for their opinions, because I haven't read it enough, but The Guardian doesn't have shareholders and has editorial freedom
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The Guardian is decent. Articles can definitely be opinionated and not all columnists are equally good, but I haven't read anything particularly egregious yet. And their investigative journalism is quite good compared to other media outlets imo.
They also clearly mark articles that are old as being old (warning you to check more recent sources), which I quite like.
It's one of the few outlets that seems to have an opinion rather than an agenda, if that makes sense. Their viewpoint is left of center, but they make this fairly clear and they're pretty factual and offer nuanced alternative viewpoints most of the time. They don't seem like they're sneakily trying to convince you of stuff, it's just a "Here's what we think about what happened".
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I subscribe to the Guardian. They're not always perfect - nothing is. But they're good.
First ones I saw to give an actual explanation of what happened in Amsterdam, for example.
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As a person who actually lived in the UK and read The Guardian for maybe a decade, in my opinion it's a neoliberal propaganda outlet and it's definitely (not just opinion, actual fact) pretty much just maned (last I checked all journalists but 2) by people from a high upper middle class and upper class background (what in the UK is called "Public School Educated", which curiously doesn't mean a State School, it means an expensive private school).
All you have to do is look back at the Snowden Leaks - The Guardian did leak the Snowden information but not soon after the Newspaper Editor there who was part of it got kicked out and the coverage of it changed 180 degrees, to the point that whilst the UK Government was busy retroactively making legal all that eavesdropping (unlike the US, were some of it was rolled back) The Guardian was mute about it.
(Whilst I believe The Guardian had genuine Leftwing and pro-Democracy journalists - and last I checked, it still has two of them - they're the exception rather than the rule as the natural tendency of both its Board and most of its staff is Neoliberalism in very much the same vein as the NYT as well as massivelly pro-System - with their coverage of The Royals being fawning to the point of servilism - which is why the Editor who published Snowden got kicked out as soon as the focus on it moved out)
It also has had some real extreme Fashion-following Upper Class Identity Warrior articles over the years, like the one from a self-proclaimed Feminist criticizing men who use sex dolls (I! Kid! You! Not!) totally oblivious to how her article was in exactly the same pattern as used a decade or two earlier to criticize homosexuality.
Last but not least (I have material here to go all day, but lets not) don't get me started on how they were a massive part of the campaign to slander Corbyn (a leftwinger who some years ago got elected leader of the Labour party, taking it of the hands of the Neoliberals who led it for 2 decades), a campaign which overwhelmingly relied on anti-semitism accusations, done together with UK based Israeli-linked Jewish groups and which was so ridiculous that they literally accused a Jewish Holocaust Survivor of being anti-semite for comparing some of the actions of Israel with those of the Nazis (this was some years ago) and thus taint Corbyn by association as they were both on the same panel in a conference.
(The present day Zionist Genocide and the use of such anti-semitism accusations to slander critics of their mass murder, really gives us some perspective on the true nature of such slander and those who use it. The anti-Corbyn campaign on which The Guardian so eagerly participated was very much an early trial run of the use by Israel - with again The Guardian eagerly participating, though they've stopped it after a while - of such Identity Politics to shore up support for and deflect criticism of their Genocide)
They're slippery posh twats at The Guardian who don't just straightforward lie like populists do and instead use cherry-picking, half-truths and other deceit techniques in their "opinion making" (some of their journalists have openly admitted that their work is making opinion), basically like the New York Times but with the benefits of a more elegant style of dialectics, argument building and word usage that comes for having had a posh education at so-called Public Schools.
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What about ProPublica? They still do pretty hard hitting investigative journalism. They're the ones that wrote some of the more recent in depth articles about an insurer's (might have been UHC's) automated denial system.
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Is there any publication left not bought and paid for by our corporate overlords?
Really good question. I think the answer, at least in terms of newspapers, is a big NO. I had realized years ago that the "newspapers of record", i.e., New York Times and Washington Post, were compromised after seeing how they covered Bernie Sanders' campaign. In reality, they likely always were compromised. Don't forget that NYT had a large role in pushing the Iraq invasion that led to hundreds of thousands of deaths. I've heard that they were also involved in the US getting into Vietnam too, but don't have much detail of that.
I have decided to subscribe to my local metro area newspaper instead, just to get some coverage of local news and events in addition to basic national and international coverage.
Now, magazines should be a different story, if you look at leftist ones like Jacobin, Monthly Review, etc.
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I tried last op-ed and they sucked me in with like ten years for thirty cents.
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Bret Stephens, the author, is not telling the whole story and using the omissions to spin a story of 'most Americans are happy with the system.' This [expletive] says the below to defend against the united anger at the health insurance industry
As for the suggestion that Thompson’s murder should be an occasion to discuss America’s supposed rage at private health insurers, it’s worth pointing out that a 2023 survey from the nonpartisan health policy research institute KFF found that 81 percent of insured adults gave their health insurance plans a rating of “excellent” or “good.” Even a majority of those who say their health is “fair” or “poor” still broadly like their health insurance. No industry is perfect — nor is any health care model — and insurance companies make terrible calls all the time in the interest of cost savings. But the idea that those companies represent a unique evil in American life is divorced from the experience of most of their customers.
This [expletive] looked at the report's top and only positive point and ignored the rest. The next very next point is
- Despite rating their insurance positively, most insured adults report experiencing problems using their health coverage; people in poorer health are more likely to report problems. A majority of insured adults (58%) say they have experienced a problem using their health insurance in the past 12 months – such as denied claims, provider network problems, and pre-authorization problems.
Here are the other points on the report:
- Nearly half of insured adults who had insurance problems were unable to satisfactorily resolve them, with some reporting serious consequences. Half of consumers with insurance problems say their problem was resolved to their satisfaction.
- Affordability of premiums and out-of-pocket costs are a concern, particularly for those with private health coverage, and for some, contributed to not getting care. About half of adults with Marketplace plans (55%) or ESI (46%) rate their insurance negatively when it comes to premiums, compared to 27% of people with Medicare and 10% of Medicaid enrollees. Four-in-ten insured adults say they skipped or delayed some type of care in the past year due to cost. One in six insured adults (16%), including larger shares of those at lower income levels, say they had problems paying medical bills in the past year.
- Insured adults overwhelmingly support public policies to make insurance simpler to understand and to help them avoid or resolve insurance problems. About nine in ten say they support requirements on insurers to maintain accurate and up-to-date provider directories, provide simpler, easier-to read EOBs, disclose their claims denial rates to regulators and the public, and provide in advance, upon request, information about whether care is covered and their out-of-pocket cost liability.
[Expletive] this disingenuously written story, [expletive] Bret Stephen for not telling the whole story, and [expletive] the New York Times for time after time publishing BS and propaganda that sets us all back.
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Your nanny state instance admins redact naughty words to "[expletive]" before it federates out. It's pretty funny when you use it a bunch of times to help get your anger across.
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I wanted to vomit, this morning when I read that piece of tp.
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I'm sure many are happy with their plans given that they have no real choice.
I'd be happier with a plan that punches me in the face twice a year rather than one that punches me monthly.
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Yeah, people rating their insurance as "excellent" obviously comes with the implied "compared to other US healthcare insurance options," if you read the rest of it or spend even 5 seconds thinking about it.
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I assure you this poll was biased against the dead.
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Luigi murdered one person.
Brian murdered thousands.
That's all you need to know to compare the two.
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Luigi murdered one
person.mass murderer.
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So what you're saying is that we need a CEO hunter who gets a higher score?
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I would LOVE to hear what bootlicking bullshit argument this dude crafted.
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Don't give them the clicks.
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Someone made a synopsis: https://lemmy.world/comment/13939443
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AI
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"Luigi had never heard such bullshit before."
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If he’s such a hero, why is everyone happy he’s dead?
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you should feel bad because he's a dead hero.
/S
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Because he's the hero we deserve, but not the one we need right now.
So, we'll hunt him, because he can take it. Because he's not our hero: He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector.
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Angry rich kids jacked up on radical, nihilistic philosophies can cause a lot of harm, not least to the working-class folks whose interests they pretend to champion.
Or angry, greedy rich people jacked up on conservatism.
I was hoping it was going to be a satire OpEd, but nope. Mangione is just a disaffected radical rich kid he compares to Bin Laden and other terrorists who came from well-off families. The writer stops at Thompson’s early normal life and completely disregards the health insurance industry’s problems, which Thompson’s company was a major contributor, claims people are mostly happy with their insurance while the study has no “would you prefer to pay less and get the same service for single-payer care” option. It’s basically “do you like your expensive care you have little/no choice about?”
Dude wrote an anti-populist article to be inflammatory and told people to shut up because they like their insurance overlords.
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told people to shut up because they like their insurance overlords.
Idiots keep answering these surveys like bootlickers than wonder why owners change nothing.
So they are able to use sample 20k to justify police for 300m people.
If you ever answer surveys like these, don't be a dumb ass. This is a class war, act like it.
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When the only questions to surveys are:
Do you prefer:
- A horse kick to the nuts
- Stabbed in the eye with a hot poker
You can say: 72% of people prefer being kicked in the nuts by a horse.
There is no “I’d rather have chicken” option.
So a few answering or not will make no difference when the options are restricted to funneling the answer they want to the top.
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Why does he speak so quietly.
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Never going to happen.
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If both are class traitors than I support the one who didn't betray my class. But also engineers and tech workers are still working class and nowhere near CEO level.
I'm an engineer who went to private schools and came from a family of engineers. Doesn't mean I've never been homeless, doesn't mean my family wasn't financially fucked by health insurance. The middle class aren't ceo level even when we're a shrinking class
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Apologies in advance, I may have just discovered my personal inner schizo.
Don't forget that there is a massive, coordinated campaign to get us to eat our own by overemphasizing life differences in the range of poverty to upper middle class while shrouding the realities of life in the 1% amd underemphasizing the difference between "can send my kid to private school" and "could build a private school for my kid".
On its face it sounds absolutely absurd to lump in Ivy League Greg with Trailer Park Steve, but they both have far more in common with each other than they do with multi-millionaires. The knee jerk almost primal rejection of that idea that comes quickly to most people is fucking intentionally taught into us.
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Congratulations on taking the red pill, that's what the concept of the middle class always has been. And it's a tactic the powerful have always used. They want the middle class thinking of ourselves as fundamentally different from and better than the poor and they want the poor resenting us for it
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It seems that narrative that has been fed to us about wealth classes is breaking down.
Their worst fear is the day all the classes below the wealthy elites team up and work together. They'll do and say anything to stop it, including trying the fuel envy or jealousy from the poor people towards the upper middle class.
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The New York Times has been pure shit since the W years when they pushed Iraq war propaganda.
Trump is an evil moron, but he's right about one thing, our media is full of shills and liars.
The crazy part is they are lying and shilling for the right, while being called "leftist", it's a fantastic lie that has been propagated.
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The newspapers used to publish whatever the government said was true when it came to war and foreign policy. That changed slightly when news reporters in Vietnam repeatedly witnessed the reality and reported it back regardless of what their editors and government officials wanted to be published.
It was why Vietnam vets returning home were called baby killers. Because they were killing babies. Now the press have realigned themselves to return to being under the hegemony of the government in hopes of staying in business.
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It's been shit for longer than that.
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If they call it Leftist, they can pretend to be the lovable underdog
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This ought to have been apparent 20 years ago. Anybody else remember Judith Miller and her little pas de deux with Dick Cheney, where his office would "leak" phony intelligence about Iraq's WMD program to her, she'd publish it in her New York Times column, and then the Bushies could cite it as evidence? Pepperidge Farm also remembers the non-apology apology the editor published (buried well off the front page) that conspicuously missed anything about not letting the paper be used as a mouthpiece for the state in the future.
The only reason that it ever had a progressive reputation is because the GOP/Tea Party kept shrieking about "liberal media" to move the Overton Window to the far right.
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I remember. Judith Miller and the New York Times were essentially involved in causing hundreds of thousands of deaths in Iraq.
I understand that they were also involved in pushing the US into getting into Vietnam too, but know less about the details of that one.
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It also does a lot of arts and literary work so that adds to that perception.
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NYT is the fake news of record always has been
Also notorious genocide enablers
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NYT hasn’t been progressive for a long time. It’s just taken a while for everyone to notice.
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Has the NYT ever been progressive? At times they've brought some very good journalism, but I have the impression that they've always been firmly on the side of big business.
A few years ago I had seen a very old (about 1920 I think) NYT article posted on Reddit in which they completely misrepresented what had happened when the powers that be attacked strikers. A straight up hit piece against the strikers & it was not an opinion article. So back then they were firmly on the side of big business, but without any of the journalistic integrity that the paper is now known for.
The only way that I can think of that someone might consider the NYT as a progressive paper, is if factual reporting is considered leftwing/progressive, which is only a relatively recent development in the USA.
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Right now they have an article for the case against vigilantism. Fucking hell qualified immunity is state based vigilantism.
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Bret Stevens is, surprise, a sniveling neocon.
He can get fucked.
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I noted it in another thread, but this is the tale of two class traitors. These guys are extremely threatened and confused as to why one of the good class traitors (the CEO that went from working class to killing workers for profit) is reviled while the bad class traitor (a rich kid murdering that CEO) is lauded. Obviously from their perspective it should be the opposite.
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These dumbfucks are too high on their own self righteousness to see the lasting damage they are causing not only to their own institutions, but the country. Absolutely GLAZING the CEO whilst completely omitting the insider trading charges leveled at him, and ignoring any and all context of UHC’s denial rates whilst pumping ’consumer satisfaction’ surveys as if health insurance is fine and dandy.
When the fourth branch flips over for belly rubs from the state, people see the base corruption and abandon mainstream media - and turn to alternatives. Twitter, Facebook, Telegram, etc where foreign influence propaganda and misinformation has no gatekeepers.
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When the fourth branch flips over for belly rubs from the state, people see the base corruption and abandon mainstream media - and turn to alternatives. Twitter, Facebook, Telegram, etc where foreign influence propaganda and misinformation has no gatekeepers.
One I've been reading is: https://www.kenklippenstein.com/
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Bret Stephens is a bed bug.
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After reading that article, this feels like an insult to bed bugs.
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The first step to writing an article like this is to bend your spine backwards until your head is inside your asshole.
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LOL it says all it needs to say that this guy felt that this article needed to be written, in order to spin reality into something it's not
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Bret Stephens is an absolute clown.
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The one time the headline on a Bret Stephens piece convinced me he might not always be insane the first three sentences of the article relieved me of that thought as quickly as it had formed.
I don't think that man is ever in full possession of his faculties.
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Stockholm syndrome
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It's a Bret Stephens opinion piece. He's the token conservative of the column. He is literally 1 out of 18 other columnists. He doesn't even remotely represent The Times as a whole. This declaration is almost as dumb as Bret...almost.
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The NYT has been garbage for a very long time.
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I'm so tired of opening Lemmy and seeing this stupid article.
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What are you going to do about it?
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Downvote generally. We don't need to be directing our attention to troll garbage.
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His name is Bret Stephens, and apparently he is a complete joke of a man.
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A man? Hardly.
A man puts on boots to start the day.
This thing licks them instead.
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The opinion section of any paper is a disaster not worth your time.
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I’m convinced Lemmy doesn’t know what that is.
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A short while back I saw a comment on Lemmy mention something along the lines of how opinion pieces are the best/only place that they go for their info... And it had a ton of upvotes.
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If you want a more interesting less ragebait take this is probably better:
The Rage and Glee That Followed a C.E.O.’s Killing Should Ring All Alarms https://www.nytimes.com/2024/12/06/opinion/united-health-care-ceo-shooting.html?unlocked_article_code=1.hE4.ezbM.fXx90r8IG_iu
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Zeynep be like "Murder is terrible and he really should have used a drone".
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Haha. He really do be like that.
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TBH the phony "healthcare" system should ring alarms but those alarms don't exist.
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I just threw up in my mouth a little.
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I mean, it's not a scam, it's just right wing propaganda. The whole "main stream media" deal is just an attempt to pull outlets to the right. They can't argue the facts of climate change or voter fraud or immigration, so instead they appeal to "bias" to push outlets to not challenge them. I'm not saying the Times was ever a progressive bastion but at one point it might have at least been centrist before everyone bought what Fox News was selling.
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Jeezus Kristos, this guy is such a sh*tbird.
…When you effortlessly drift to sky-high levels of self-parody….
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One capitalist parasite down, plenty more to go.
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He died for his sins
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So when you search for this the top result is r/neoliberal. TIL there's a neoliberal subreddit.
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"Sheriff of Nottingham real hero. People refusing to pay justified taxes."
Who's bread they eat, who's song they sing, I guess.
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It sounds like Bret really idolizes that CEO. I hope he guys the same treatment
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Progressive.. ly stupid.
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NYT can blow me.
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It's hilarious when people post the NYTrash as if it weren't complete imperial garbage.
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Wow, I’m sure the masses disagree with this opinion.
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Asshole is also a defender of "USA should police the whole world", so he can go fuck himself with pineapple leaves.
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"The proles are finally getting fed up with the parasitic CEO's... quick, better try some (weak ass) propaganda to turn the tide!"
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Based
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253 comments