Memes @lemmy.ml

10mo ago

Nintendo doing the smarting

170 comments

Wait what, there is a Nintendo switch emulator out there called Yuzu? Thanks Nintendo!
- It'd be pretty great if an entire generation referred to this phenomenon as the Nintendo Yuzu Effect instead of the Streisand Effect. Or maybe the YouTube Adblock Effect? These companies keep accidentally telling everybody about shit that is relatively unknown yet universally desired in order to not have to pay exploitative prices. Even early Switch games are still fucking impossible to find for less than their launch price. And actually, now that I think about it, the MSRP of the Switch itself still hasn't dropped either. It costs just as much today as it did 7 goddamn years ago to legally buy a Switch, BotW, and Mario Odyssey. Nintendo's greed is the reason Switch piracy was ever big enough to be worth chasing, and now chasing it will cause an even bigger boom in it. Well, that and their shitty controllers. I don't blame anybody for wanting to play BotW with an Xbox controller on their last-gen PC.
  
  Nah keep it Streisand effect, as that's where the term originated, if we changed phrases every single time a company did this, we'd be changing it every hour.
  
  If gameboy games are anything to go by, prices almost never drop. I remember getting a GBA game for 20 euros back when the Nintendo SD was already ending its end of life.
- There is a copy/fork of it already called nuzu
  
  And if they kill that, it's miizu. Then wezu. Then nouzu.
  
  Turns out it was just a 14 year old who cloned everything and hadn't commited any code to GitHub in the past year. Suyu is the new wave now.
  
  It's not the distribution that they wanted to stop. It was future updates
- It’s getting pulled down basically everywhere so you’re going to have to find some smaller communities or individuals to get your hands on it now. That’s the real annoying part here lol
  
  Yeah, there's totally not Mirrors around with the original source code that got pulled, and the entire internet having collectively archived it before Yuzu itself pulled the plug
  Also it was the only Switch emulator in existence, there totally isn't another emulator going around
  Also you totally should not follow what I said here, y'know, emulation is wrong after all according to Nintendo
  
  The code itself is not illegal, so hosting it is fine.
  Just dont encourage piracy, like at all. No linking, no support, and certainly not patching for games which didnt come out yet and offering these fixes early for payment.
  
  That's my Nintendo, always forcing me out of my comfort zone to discover cool, niche new communities to enhance my piracy know-how! Thanks, Nintendo!
- Not anymore
  
  Looks like it's still available through a mirror.

If there's one thing I know about the situation, a LOT of people who otherwise haven't bothered are scrambling to download yuzu, if for any other reason to say fuck Nintendo.
It's me, I'm people.
- Me too. I've never cared for Switch games, I don't even have a console, but now I'm discovering many gems on my computer.
  
  Both of my roommates own a switch and I'm welcome to use them. If I'm gonna play, I'll just use those. Still, I'm people.
- Streisand effect for me. Never heard of this project until Nintendo caused a fuss.
- same

Open source projects do not grow by themselves. It requires serious effort from dedicated developers to develop and maintain applications as complicated as an emulator. Yuzu's developers are banned from doing so and I don't see how this incident could help bringing more developers.
- I'm sure there will be developers capable enough to keep it working on new operating systems. Games that worked with it until now will keep on working, and that's what matters to most people anyways. No need for major changes to the codebase.
  
  I truly admire the optimism but I think it's also important to understand the hard work and dedication that the Yuzu developers put in.
  You're correct that someone probably will fork it and development will continue but it is not simple and it requires a very specialized skill set.
  I just think it's important to never take for granted the people who take time out of their lives to give the community something so wonderful.
  
  to keep it working on new operating systems
  That's really easier said than done
- What do you mean with they are banned? Who's gonna stop them from contributing to one of the many Yuzu forks? What are they gonna do about it?
  
  A permanent injunction is entered against Defendant enjoining it and its members, agents, servants, employees, independent contractors, successors, assigns, and all those acting in privity or under its control from:
  a. Offering to the public, providing, marketing, advertising, promoting, selling, testing, hosting, cloning, distributing, or otherwise trafficking in Yuzu or any source code or features of Yuzu
  IANAL but that sounds like the court is banning those developers from working on Yuzu. I mean, you can still try to work on project that is 90% Yuzu but with another name but I feel like your lawyer would advise against that.
  
  Who’s gonna stop them from contributing to one of the many Yuzu forks? What are they gonna do about it?
  The answers are "the court system" and "have the police arrest them for defying a court order" respectively.
  
  Nintendo would stop them. If yuzu devs want to go to court, they can continue development.
  Yuzu devs could do it anonymously, but that's gl on not doxxing yourself, at risk of lawsuit.
  
  it's most likely part of the cease and desist order
  
  I mean, I guess it can happen through private web communities of course. It would just enter the region of game cracks.
  Also marginally possible someone reverse engineers, and puts up something unrecognizable compared to the original.
- this doesn't apply to hundreds of their contributors tho right
  
  What if I told you that throwing more developers at a problem != that problem getting solved faster?

Switch 2s architecture will probably be very similar, so Nintendo might have done it to protect the next gen.
- Yeah like that is going to work. There are forks left and right.
  
  Forks are meaningless.
  Unless a team steps up to continue development, the project is as good as dead.
  
  Are there any that actually have a new team behind them that would presumably add Switch 2 support?
  
  It is working. It buys them enough time to sell enough new hardware and games. It will take a really long time until development picks up again, since basically every developer associated (not necessarily every one who has contributed to the project) with the yuzu group can no longer legally work on that project. So basically a lot of expertise is lost.
  
  Of course it’s not gonna work. But that’s just how lawyers think I suppose.

It's a shame about Yuzu. Have you heard about this new emulator called Nuzu?
- https://gitlab.com/suyu2/suyu
  
  "Sue you" lmao
- This aged like milk.

Jokes on Nintendo, my next handheld is most likely still going to be a steam deck (clone?). The only difference now is I won't buy a physical game and emulate their games on it by (downloading) a backup.
I'm not proud of it but I've pirated games when I was a kid, but I bought every game I pirated if I could get it on modern hardware. Even the mediocre games like Minecraft.
It's tempting as a kid when your parents gets you an Xbox but never got any games for it, eventually you wanna play more than demos. They got duke nukem forever with the xbox and as a kid I preferred the pack in game of Kinect adventures over it.
- Definitely get a Deck, it's shocking how powerful the hardware is. If price is an issue you can wait until the refurbished ones go on sale again and pick up the cheapest model for $280.
  
  One day when I don't feel as poor. I got more important things like going into debt for a piece of paper.

Nintendo basically sent out a press release saying "Its super easy to pirate our games!". This is really only positive for them if no other projects show up.

This time it won't be based in Jersey either good luck closing down a project hosted in China or San Marino. The Yuzu team has done a great service closing the case as quickly as possible
- I don't understand why people who work on these things don't protect their identity and location any better...
  Host in a random country, accept crypto donations and make them untraceable by switching them to monero, always use a VPN...
  
  Right? It seems the official discord also had links to where to get ROMs, as in pirated ROMs. I can't believe they got complacent knowing Nintendo could come after them at any second.
  
  This made me wonder if blockchain tech could, hypothetically, be used as a sort of distributed SCM platform, where each commit is stored as data appended to a transaction, not unlike git. Blockchain's polycentric structure would solve the issue of resilience and integrity, and Monero's technology could be used to anonymize the commits.
  This would of course come with all of the disadvantages of blockchain, and the project would still need a central authority to accept or reject commits, to manage branches, and to define which transactions represent the HEAD of each branch. I think it's at least an interesting concept.
- Yes but they are debt slaves to Nintendo for life
  
  Nah they Incorporated specifically to protect themselves. The company will go bankrupt, but the people will be protected.
  
  Not necessarily. The LLC will pay out as much as it can and then filler for bankruptcy. The individuals will likely get off scott free since they've not actually been convicted of any wrongdoing.
  I imagine that developing Yuzu and Citra would be a huge item on their CVs, too. Honestly, if Nintendo were smart, they would have tried to buy the project somehow and hire the developers to work on backwards compatibility for whatever the console that comes after the Switch 2 is..

While it's weird that they waited so long, emulating Nintendo systems is nothing new. We used to emulate SNES in the late 90s. Nintendo has generally always been the first and last name in quality single player gaming experiences, and their games are always in high demand. There will always be a contingent of people dedicated to emulating Nintendo systems, no matter what Barbara Streisand has to say about the matter.
- While it's weird that they waited so long,
  I think they are afraid emulation on steam deck gains traction.
  Since it runs Linux, you could install and run Nintendo games on a competitor portable console that has a lot more games and a more powerful hardware
  
  People are playing Zelda at high frame rates?! NOT ON MY WATCH - Nintendo
  
  That's not the reason, you have been able to do so for a while. Even longer if you count Breath of the Wild (which ran with the Wii U emulator). The only reason they got their shit kicked in by Nintendo is greed. Patreon + extra money for early access + wanting to create their own paid copy of Nintendo's online service + timing their press releases with Nintendo releases..
  Emulators are legal. Fully intending to profit from creating a competing product isn't. That's why they also gave in so quickly when the lawyers showed up, despite having plenty of money to afford defense.
- "while it's weird that they waited so long"
  My conspiracy theory is that the Switch 2 is going to operate on the same architecture, but have better hardware. My guess is for backwards compatabiliy. This means that on launch day, Yuzu was likely still going to be the best way to play Switch 2 games. Basically it's a threat to a console that isn't even out yet. Just a theory.
  
  I figure there's enough differences that they want to scare protentional devs from making the changes needed for it to work on Switch 2. They knew that getting rid of an existing open source emulator wasn't really possible, but is a new one is not made, then its not just a matter of sharing copies.
  But given that consoles are becoming more and more PC-like, I wonder how hard it will be to make an emulator anyways.
- We used to emulate SNES in the late 90s
  And NES as well. Thanks Shitman!
  
  Ah yes. I remember. 1997, I was 12, I had my own computer, and I’d be in my room all day just playing with my NESticle. And then, a little later, pNES.
- It wasn’t so much a “wait” as that the reliability of emulation has now caught up with products they’re currently selling. But now I’m curious if this ever happened with the GBA or other handheld consoles that were a bit easier to emulate.
  
  The GBA was emulated before the console was even out in North America.
- Is that last line a Duck sauce reference?
  
  No, it’s referring to the Streisand Effect.
  
  Please elaborate while I find some popcorn.
  
  That song slaps tho.

So, if I was to download this, I could play all the Switch games? Sounds fun. I definitly wouldnt do it, I have too much respect for Nintendo, but if I had do it, what games do people would recommend, for example? I just want to bring awarNES on this.
- I've heard Super Mario Wonder is fantastic and may just run great on Steam Deck.
  
  That sounds like something I would like to play. If only.....
- Copied from another post I made
  Mario + rabbids, pokemon legends, zelda:BOTW/TOTK (pick one they're both pretty similar and have their pros/cons), Mario Wonder, Mario Odyssey, Pikmin 4, Cadence of Hyrule (zelda spin-off of crypt of the necrodancer), zelda:links awakening remake, Mario rpg remake, and Bayonetta 2 (can also play on wii u emulator, 3 isn't as good)
  
  Would you believe that 2 days ago I didn't know this was a thing, and now, I have the software and a list of great games to play? Now I know, and I'm gonna have to make sure as many people as possible are aware of this. I think I'll make a document with simple download links, so people can make sure to block this content.
- I really like breath of the wild and tears of the kingdom.
  
  Thanks. So, someone with a Steamdeck who would like to hurt Nintendo could play it just like that... Kind of crazy when you think about it.
- I’m playing the Super Mario RPG remake now.
  I never played it, or really any JRPG before (at least not very much). I gotta say I’m really enjoying it.

How do I hack the shit out of my oled switch
- With a cleaver and buy a steam deck instead
  
  I wish, my pc is no longer capable of running games and I still need it for utilities and such (porn). The switch was a gift but I would probably have bought one anyway to be honest, but now I see the light
- You get a steamdeck.
- Alas, the only easily hackable Switch's were made until about a year after release. To hack modern ones requires a special mod chip that isn't easily soldered on.
  Nintendo unfortunately did a good job on hack proofing the Switch.
  
  But you say its still possible?
- Get a hammer and smash the fuck out of it.

And even their worst accusations are 'It cost five percent of our biggest game's revenue! It was only a record-breaking success!'

What stops the yuzu devs from working on ryujinx?
- If I were Ryujinx I would immediately not let encrypted games play with future updates.
  But....a random program online not affiliated with Ryujinx would crop up online and would... mysteriously decrypt games
  .. Huh how coincidental
- Fear. The settlement agreement included promising to never do anything related to violating Nintendo's IP rights again.
  If any of the developers want to grab a VPN and new username, they absolutely could. Whether they want to risk getting sued for multiple millions as an individual is another story, however.
- Yuzu is written in c++ and can run on android, which seems like a major advantage over ryujinx.

My speculation is that their main goal was to thwart the teams potential efforts emulating the next Nintendo console. It is likely going to be close enough to the switch that the same team will have an easy time emulating it. Not anymore.

So they'll stop giving frequent updates to the software huh? That'll make it easier to pirate.

Fuck Nintendo, first year I won't be celebrating March 10th #FreeBowser

Tbh, is it really pirating if I bought the game and wanted to play it on a different unofficial platform?
I understand the main thing was Yuzu was apparently offering builds that work with unreleased games (which how tf does that work) via Patreon, but if the game’s been released and I bought it, I don’t see why I shouldn’t be able to download a ROM or even dump my own and play it on an emulator that offers better performance.
- The formal answer - it is against the law and the terms and conditions of their released software. The moral answer - no problem.
- I understand the main thing was Yuzu was apparently offering builds that work with unreleased games (which how tf does that work)
  Leaks and breaking release date is how it works.

Yeah, fighting open source emulators is kind of like fighting a hydra. People will fork the project and one of those will probably emerge as the alternative to Ryujinx. At the same time Nintendo did manage to get an entire team of developers to exit the Switch emulation scene under penalty of breaching the settlement. It's not going to kill Switch emulation, but they did manage to take down one of the most popular ones.

That right let’s teach them a lesson by enjoying their hard work and artistic expression without paying them because that makes them the assholes!
- Nintendo refuses to fix the joycon drift issue and still charges full price for a 7 years old device. We will call it a moral draw.
  
  Funny how people use that term moral victory when what they mean is that they have no “moral” qualms with stealing. Especially if they can convince themselves the company deserves it. Thats what you’ve said. Rules and laws don’t apply as long as you have your “moral victory” Congrats, winner!
- Oh no, one faceless corporation won't pay another faceless corporation for a sale they wouldn't have made anyway.
  
  Gunpei Yokoi, Shigeru Miyamoto, Satora Iwata, and Reggie Fils-Aimé…Faceless? Of all the gaming companies Nintendo is literally the least “faceless”.
- Seriously, when did the entire emulator scene turn into a bunch of whiny simps crying foul every time Nintendo, a company of hard working and creative artists ,tries to protect its art. Seriously, at what point of success are you allowed to labor without being exploited by shitty people who refuse to pay for art. Video games are art, the makers are artist, and people who emulate for the purpose of piracy are shit. You’re not kewl and edgy because you refuse to pay for something. It makes you a useless freeloader. Your actions ensure the continued enshitification of gaming. You’re the reason everything is a live service hell of micro transactions and $20 horse skins. Buy the games, support the artist, quit trying to justify your actions, and if you like me enjoy emulation legally, stop standing up for and supporting the useless freeloaders.
  
  Do.. do you think the people who actually make the game get royalties or something? Bc once the game is made that's it for them lol
  
  You've got a little shoe polish on your teeth, boot licker.
  
  The very beginning. The emulator scene has existed since the 80s. The emulator scene has fought against Nintendo since literally the NES. And they have frequently won.
  
  I'm pretty sure that people pirating games have little to do with the current surge micro transaction filled games. It's the opposite, the people who buy all that shit and let companies get away with it are to blame.
  
  Is that a copypasta

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