Apparently, due process is unrelated to an illegal deportation without due process case.

This is also blatant misinformation. No judge ever made a finding that he was associated with MS-13. The government asserted it in court but it's never been proven. The immigration proceedings largely revolved around his asylum application, interview, and testimony.
So they're lying in an attempt to make it sensational enough to bust past due process. For an example of how that looks long term, check Duterte's regime in the Philippines. Many people were killed extrajudicially and written off as drug dealers.
- Pretty much, yeah. It looks like they’re going on this as “evidence”
  The Justice Department shared records, not previously made public, detailing how police officers in Maryland assessed Abrego Garcia was a member of the MS-13 gang during an arrest in 2019. He had no criminal history at the time, which the documents also state, and his attorneys have denied that he is a gang member.
  We all know a police officer’s “assessment” doesn’t mean shit, but it seems this is what they’re working from.
- Here's the full story.
  The allegations that he is a member of MS-13 are completely from an unnamed confidential informer who is their sole source. The gang of cops involved in grabbing him up in the past includes a cop who was fired for misconduct.
  The alleged "human trafficking" accusation comes from being pulled over while driving a van full of construction workers to a job site.
  The entire case against him is built on lies and unproven allegations that would NEVER stand up in court, and I suspect that is true for nearly all the rest of them, too.
  A reminder to MAGA Nazi Traitors that this issue isn't about the character of this person, its about the abject dismissal of Due Process. If they can do it to this person, based on phoney and exagerrated allegations, then they can do the same thing to American citizens, and they eventually will. This is just practice, as well as wearing people down, so they get tired of hearing about it, and won't get so personally invested the next time it happens.

Hilariouschaos seems to pop up a lot here lately
- There’s a good reason for that.
  
  Hilariouschaos and Lemmy.today tend to be known to be the conservative instances.
- Idk when chuckles became a mod or admin but they’re eleventy times worse than Alice.
  It’s certainly chaos but there’s a distinct lack of hilarity.
  
  Alice is okay, just a bit overenthusiastic with niche communities.
  Chuckles seems to be a completely different level

"He's MS-13!" Prove it in court then. Fuck me I'm tired of Americans being 100% wrong about everything and then trying to sound adult by having lengthy 'debates' about it.
- Already proven in court. Twice.
  
  Sure it has. Go on, do tell. Which court? What case? Who was the Judge?
  
  On the off-chance that you don't actually know that what you've said is incorrect, here's a link to wikipedia. Skip on down to the section, "2019 detention and bond hearings." You'll see that whatever dumbass told you that a court "proved" that Mr. Garcia was related to MS-13 was saying that ICE found that he couldn't prove he wasn't, once, and they upheld that he couldn't prove he wasn't, on an appeal. Neither of which is proving anything in court once, let alone twice.
  Further, an immigration judge granted him "withholding of removal" status. This is notable because it's much harder to get a "withholding of removal" than getting granted asylum, because you have to prove that if you're sent to the country in question, the government will either persecute you, or choose not to protect you from prosecution.
  So, to recap, it's not only not been proved that this guy has any relation to MS-13, but it's been proven to an actual court that if he gets sent to El Salvador, the Barrio 18 gang will kill him. Because the only evidence he has any connection to a gang, is that there's a gang that wants to kill him.

Oh yeah, that guy is a real dipshit.
- Yeah. And what’s sad is that he seems to revel in it. How fucking pathetic must one’s life be to find joy in being a massive pile of shit?
  
  Some people are so poor that all they have in life is money.

I mean, a concerted effort to lie about known facts in a massive disinformation campaign, is unironically a reason why he is in office now. Though no way they see that context.

This is my now daily(?) suggestion for admins to defed from HC and for users to block it
- I definitely think LW needs to defederate from them. There’s little they offer that doesn’t have a better alternative elsewhere.
- somewhat new to Lemmy, how can a user block an instance? so far all I’ve been able to figure out is blocking individual communities
  
  If you’re on desktop, click on the arrow by your username in the top right. Then click Settings. On the next page, click on Blocks and scroll all the way down to Block Instance to type in an instance name.
  If you’re on the Voyager app, go to Settings, then Filters & Blocks and scroll all the way down to Blocked Instances to type in an instance name.
  Methods may vary for other browsers/apps.
  Blocking an instance (unfortunately) does not stop users from that instance from replying to you or from you seeing their comments. You’d have to block the individual accounts as you see them.
  
  Depends on what app you use.
  For Voyager you go to settings > filters & blocks > add instance
- If they were willing to defederate Exploding-heads for being a hate filled extreme right wing instance they should defederate HC for the same or similar reasons.
  
  That they preventivly defederated from hexbear.net but haven't done shit with HC or threads says everything about lw.

Nazi instance supporting Nazis, not a shock.
PTB, clear and simple. Someday they will be mass defederated. I don't think my instance gets them, but I haven't been looking for more digital self harm by reading Nazis advocating for my kind to be removed.
- PTB, clear and simple.
  Agreed wholeheartedly.
  Someday they will be mass defederated.
  One can dream.
- I don’t think my instance gets them
  We do. 👍
  
  Damn. Well, still glad I didn't go looking for them.

If they have all this evidence it should have been really easy to follow due process.
The thing is they don't have enough for a conviction, if they had they would have used it.
- I have questions and I don't know the facts. Was he a non-citizen? Was he sentenced to prison by the US or El Salvador? My understanding is the Constitutional bar for deportation of non-citizens is pretty low, but sentencing someone to prison requires due process. Unless he wasn't sentenced here, but there.
  
  He was a non-citizen, but had protected status. Specifically, a judge had ruled that he could not be deported to El Salvador, which is where Trump et al. deported him to (e.g., in direct violation of a federal judicial order). The deportation proceedings had no due process at all, which is to say, he was never given a hearing after being arrested, never given a chance to speak to an attorney, etc. All of which is illegal.
- It's the same reason they couldn't prove the election was stolen. Because they had no evidence.
- A conviction for what? They don’t need to convict him of anything. He was in the country illegally, self admittedly so. He was found to be a MS-13 gang member, in the country illegally, so they deported him to his home country.
  
  Due process applies to even non-citizens. 14th Amendment applies to all people within the borders.
  
  He is still allowed due process. Otherwise what is stopping power from deporting people on the basis of being an “illegal”, or any other reason they conjure up? Due process is literally the method for gathering objective information about the situation to determine next steps, while allowing for a defense. It is in the constitution. And it is the only way to objectively determine truth rather than “he said she said” nonsense. We’re better than this, c’mon now.
  
  Just think about it. Out of the couple-hundred-odd people that Trump deported to El Salvador, why are the Democrats focusing on this one guy? Because the Trump admin themselves admitted that they fucked up and shouldn't have deported him. Now they're trying to do damage control.

The Judge that so heavily rebuked Trump is a Reagan appointee

Yeah he's one of ours? Is that implying that the Ecuadorian president is a member of MS-13? Also they don't seem to understand that Ecuador in Venezuela are two different countries, although yeah that one doesn't surprise me at all really
- Maybe the Ecuadorian president has killed more people than ms13 and feels like an honorary member?

We have our very own r/conservative (degrogatory) now.
- Why can't they stay on their shit and be miserable there, they always follow us around and try and wreck whatever we make like the petulant whiny brats they are. I don't go into their shitholes, why can't they just stay out of our house
  
  Because conservative idiots aren't content talking to each other in their own spaces, they seek to force their ideas onto other people, even those who wish not to listen to them. It's why they shut exploding-heads down, they were widely defederated and couldn't force their ideas onto other people easily.
  
  Because they can’t stand being around other people like themselves.
  
  Because they're utterly devoid of original thought and creativity and crave the attention.
  They're every annoying prepubescent sibling you've ever had, but in the guise of a fully grown voting adult.
  
  Not even they like each other. They want a constant supply of docile victims.
  
  this is the million dollar question

The absolute bonked-zonkers thing about this is that they've fully memory-holed that even if this guy was undeniably part of MS-13, the group they were going after and who they had authorized this extra-judicial violence against was tren de aragua. Members of MS-13 should still, under their initial claims, not be able to be deported without trial like this.

- Don't give them so much credit. He won because of voter suppression laws targeting groups who typically vote democrat, and general laziness from democrats resulting in low voter turnout like usual.
  
  Both can be true
  
  So you think the ninety one million people are lazy democrats? Not a single lazy “I refuse to vote in protest” socialist among them?
- Is there evidence for this?
  
  No, there isn't.
- Wasn’t there also the slight issue of many not bothering to vote at all or not willing to vote for the more democratic candidate over Israel or something? So much drama in the states…
  
  38% of registered voters didn't bother to vote. I think many of them couldn't stomach either candidate in the fake two-party system and didn't think a third party or independent could win so they didn't bother. If that 38% had gotten behind a candidate like Jill Stein or a write in campaign for Bernie Sanders, they could have beaten Trump and Harris.
  
  Yeah all those "gEnOciDe" trolls have mystically vanished since then ...
- That sounds like election denial. I thought you guys didn’t do that?

Chuckles the clown should be put on blast everyday.
The administration of HilariousChaos aren’t any better as they don’t have any control or want to have any control over the people in their instance.
- The entire instance is a fucking joke in name only. I was invited to make an account there around when they started by some kid named “Alice.” I noped the fuck out the minute I saw what it was:
  A shit-tier wannabe cover-band of 4Chan’s greatest hits.
- Is it mostly traitor lunatics or just random stuff including the traitors?
- They need to be found and blasted, that way no one has to deal with them anymore

e: there’s another symbol from France Americans could learn from.
- Good point!

And once again they move the goalpost and there's absolutely fuck all we're going to be able to do about it. 2 weeks ago we were angry that people were kidnapped and sent to a deathcamp. 1,5 weeks ago we were angry that people didn't even get a trial. 1 week ago we were angry that someone wasn't "supposed" to be sent to the death camp. Now we're angry that they say this man was a gangmember without evidence.
The discussion has moved from "sending people to death camps is fucking insane", to "it's okay to send people to death camps, as long as they're gang members".
This post is a big part of that goalpost moving.
Don't let them shift the narative. Yes, everything that is happening is wrong, but focusing on them lying about him being a gang member, shifts the narative to a point where it's okay to send people to foreign death camps, as long as they've done something the state deems criminal (in this case, being a gang member).
- This post’s focus is simply about an asshole mod that thinks it’s funny to troll people using a moderator’s authority.
  The fact that the guy has no criminal charges or what his association is isn’t relevant to the point, other than the reason said asshole mod chose to use as a way to troll someone.
- Even if he were a "gang member", it doesn't matter.
  It's absurd that libs buys into these tropes. It's a big part of their support for fascism.

... wayward 4Chan refugees ... common sense.
Come on now, you know better.
- Fair point.

Chuckles the clown is an accurate name. Hilarious chaos is not.
- Well said… and I don’t know if I want to know what your username means, but I’m intrigued.
  
  Inspired by an alcoholic shot called a Buttery Nipple. It's delicious but I didn't quite want THAT as my username.

PTB.
Like, I get not wanting "political" content in your instance. But guess what, everything has a political side! And the comment is completely related to the topic at hand (Garcia being kicked by force from one dictatorship into another, with no proofs that he would be a mara).
- It’s in a “conservatives” community, so, politics is pretty much the wheelhouse.
  And even considering the source, one would think there would at least be some sense of maturity when it comes to moderating, but nope.
  It’s wannabe edgelord trolling, even in the moderation/admin team.
  
  That makes it even worse.
- Like, I get not wanting "political" content in your instance.
  The post was more political than the comment, just saying.

I thought non citizens also had a right to a fair trial?
- with due process exceptions, anyone can be labelled 'non citizen' and treated without due process.
  either everyone has due process, or no one is.
- They did. And if you read a few of the comments here, it’s somehow the fault of the democrats?

Which judge? Which jury? What's the case so I can look it up? What crime is he charged with? When is his next court date? What was he convicted of? What was he sentenced to, and by whom?
-Questions I'm going to keep asking
Edit: I just read that modlog. Unrelated? Eat more boots, jackass.

Chucklestheleatherfootwareafficionado
- He’s definitely seen a few up close.
- Just going to throw in, as a vegan, 95% of people are leather shoe aficionados.
  I honestly would not have thought that the hardest part about becoming vegan late in life would be buying shoes without leather.
  It's definitely harder than buying food or eating out.

his tattoos are of dice and Sigmund Freud by the way, notably not of MS-13, a group to what he has no established connection.
- I think I read that he does have affiliation, but has never committed any crimes associated with them. Either way, he received no proper procedure, due process or trial before being found guilty as a result of suspicion and prosecuted.
  EDIT; meant to say that I had read that they are saying he does have affiliation. Not that he factually does.
  
  can you provide a source for the affiliation?
- Even if dude were the captain of MS-13, it doesn't matter.
  Dems buying into this phony racist hysteria about MS-13 are a fundamental part of the problem. They're just serving their masters in the prison industry.
  
  "Even if dude were the captain of MS-13, it doesn't matter."
  being a captain of an international gang that murders and rapes people would matter.
  pretending it doesn't is ridiculous.
  "Dems buying into this phony racist hysteria about MS-13"
  okay, you are confused.
  rump is not a democrat, he is an extremely conservative republican.
  MS-13 has been around for over 30 years, and the democrats I have not overreacted, extreme conservatives are the one overreacting.
  "They're just serving their masters in the prison industry."
  again you've got conservatives and progressives mixed up.
  conservatives are obeying corporate masters; they literally hired the corporate masters to run the country.

I mean, c'mon. It's a fucking clown shoe running the show.
The only question is if I'm talking about the thing in the picture, or the one that took the mod action.
The answer to that question is yes.
- Well put.

HC not beating the "just a reskinned exploding heads" allegations
- Don't say that too loudly or one of their admins will come to argue it's totally different trust us

The immigration judge literally said there was no proof he was MS-13.
Plaintiff Abrego Garcia is not a member of or has no affiliation with Tren de Aragua, MS-13, or any other criminal or street gang. Although he has been accused of general “gang affiliation,” the U.S. government has never produced an iota of evidence to support this unfounded accusation.
https://storage.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.mdd.578815/gov.uscourts.mdd.578815.1.0_1.pdf
Trump's attempts at "proving" he was MS-13 was a laughably bad photoshop of "ms13" across his knuckles that took exactly 5 seconds of searching to disprove.
- Yeah. I think what I’ve seen is that Trump and his dipshit administration is going off of some unsubstantiated bullshit claims by the police.
  That’s apparently all they need now.

The dems lost because they support fascist bullshit like the war on "MS-13" and the prison industry. And they'll continue to support this despite the resistance of a tiny minority of politicians.
The dems are helpless to oppose policies that they support.
- Are the dems in the room with you?
  
  Rent-free in his head, all day, every day. Not sure what he'd do without the Dems to whine about.
- As a left-leaning person, I didn't get that memo to support fascist bullshit like the war on "MS-13" and the prison industry.
  Was that supposed to come with my George Soros check?
  
  Were you listening to Kamala Harris?

PTB in this case.

Double

they should still have to adhere to the rules of common sense.
how precisely are you going to make them? do you see the issue here? and this is exactly why trump won. because democrats wouldn't do a damn thing for working class americans no matter how many we elect if the corporate owners didnt want them too.
trump on the other hand is more than happy to do whatever he wants and you're all suddenly seeing how effective it is when you dgaf.
- I mean, Trump isn't helping working class Americans.
  
  didnt say he was. point is he's completely shattering the illusion that the democrats couldn't have done anything each time they've had the presidency and that they choose to shit on the working class.
  trump won because he is doing what his base wants (deporting people and being an asshole) and democrats lose because they are not doing what their base wants and just give excuses each time.
- Based on the spectacular feat of mental gymnastics you performed in order to find a way to make all of this the democrats fault- I’m going to assume you’re not here in good faith and respond in kind:
  🫵 lol
  
  😂 correct i have zero faith in the democrats ability to turn their party around and its going to result in our country right into a period of fascist rule.
  Congratulations!

Telling people to "fuck off" is incredibly rude. YDI.
Trump is merely continuing the Biden tradition of seeing 40 beheaded babies and finding Hamas bases under hospitals. But if Trump does it suddenly you believe in the rule of law. It has already been demolished.
- Fuck right off
  
  Nothing gets Liberals angrier than being called out on their hypocrisy 🙂
- Telling people to "fuck off" is incredibly rude
  Oh hey look it's the average .world mod attitude! Rudeness < Nazi behaviour, so maybe check your priorities on criticism yeah?
  
  I see the "don't sass the nazis" attitude so prevalent among reddit mods made it to lemmy. Bummer.
  
  Yep. I am not even telling the genocide defenders to "Fuck off" nor personally insult them.
- This place is filled with people who do not know how to behave.
- Classic Democrat take. Propaganda didn't win Trump the election. The painful incompetence of Biden and Kamala handed him the election. And the painful incompetence of Trump will (hopefully, as in hopefully there's another election) lead to the election of whoever the next completely unlikable and unpopular Democratic candidate is. Have you folks ever thought of running a candidate who would actually tackle income inequality and fairly tax the rich? Nah, didn't think so.
  
  Anyone who calls you out on getting banned for insulting people is a Russian troll
  Use some basic manners before making a post on how bad mods are.