Monthly update on the FOSS "Ladybird" browser engine
Monthly update on the FOSS "Ladybird" browser engine
Update was from 3 days ago, I'm really hopeful ladybird could be a future browser option to help break the stranglehold chrome has over the market, while Mozilla is struggling to find meaningful direction.
It seems like an exciting project with monthly progress updates :) they keep chipping away at compatibility.
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What about the anti lgbt stuff? Thoughts…?
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I wasn't aware of anything along those lines, but reading through the whole thread of discussion was interesting.
Things seem ambiguous currently I'll have to keep an eye on that issue, I appreciate you mentioning it
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That definitely adds a bit more context still. Thank you for the additional information.
I don't know much about either of the first two people, but I do know lunduke and think he's gross (if you have context on the first two you're welcome to share but no obligation to of course :)
Though, I'm also a fan of futo and Louis Rossman. I try to air on the side of being able to appreciate people doing good work even if I don't agree with everything they do or think. People come from different backgrounds and not everyone will see the world the way I do, or be sensitive to the pain caused by the issues that affect me personally 🤷♂️
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These are off the top of my head, will add links in a bit.
Vaxry is the lead developer of infamous compositor hyprland, known by many for its toxic community. He is on record saying "I do believe there could be arguments to sway my opinion towards genocide". There is a print of this, somewhere. I've seen it. I will find it and put it here.
Brendan is CEO of Brave and known homophobe, kicked out of Mozilla for... being a homophobe. He now leads the foremost crypto browser, known for its bravery and gathering a large cult of cunts. N.B. not all brave users are cunts, but cunts are seemingly attracted to brave, where they may find a welcoming community of people just as proudly horrible.
I think Ross is ok (I haven't seen anything horrible so far at least), the issue is really Lunduke who, for those unaware, is also a known transphobe and extreme right-wing propagandist.
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Thank you!
And yeah the fact that brave sucks so god damn much is frustrating. Brave is the best independent search engine with their own index (of the free options) in my opinion. At some point I need to try searx and kagi, but I prefer an independent engine rather than a meta search engine, and am broke as fuck 😅
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I get that, I was excited for Brave as an independent search engine before learning more about them. Kagi genuinely seems to be a good meta search engine, but its leadership is ignorant, reckless, and frankly embarrassing. I won't comment on Searx since I haven't tried or read about it in a long time. Bit bleak, eh?
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Oof... I don't find that as long or intense of a pattern as with brave but the behaviour to reach out and repeatedly bug the guy about his small blog post reflects strangely and poorly on his character :/ I had no idea kagi kinda came with baggage as well.
And yeah, it definitely is. Thats part of why I try really hard not to let perfect be the enemy of good. There is no perfect, and I still want to be involved in good where I can, to the extent that there is good available.
Thank you very much for taking the time to share a ton of additional context. I often have a hard time keeping in the loop about things and if I'm going to use imperfect things because I think they're better than the alternative, then I want to at least pay attention to and understand their imperfections
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Thats part of why I try really hard not to let perfect be the enemy of good.
That's fair, I hope I didn't come across as attacking usage of "imperfect" solutions. It's definitely not my goal, I'm in the "try to use the least bad thing" camp.
Thank you for taking the time to acknowledge and engage with that context. I spend too much time on the internet and fully understand it's unsustainable for most—it's not doing me good, either—so I'm glad I get to share relevant content I've accumulated from time to time.
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Nah, you're all good, this has been a lovely conversion and I've appreciated your extra info :)
I hope you have a good day my friend 😊
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Thanks :) I agree it is ambiguous but still an odd choice.
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What about the anti lgbt stuff? Thoughts…?
It is important to remember that turning down a pull request does not make a person (or project) anti-LGBT.
Sadly, I have seen bullying and brigading from people who claim to be supporting inclusiveness, more than a few times. That behavior alone would be enough to sour me on them personally, and on any change they had submitted.
And, of course, there are other perfectly valid reasons to decline a PR as well.
Asking for changes we would like to see is fine. Demanding them is not. Resorting to character assassination when we don't get what we want is absolutely not.
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You phrase that as if turning down a pull requests in general cannot be anti-LGBT, when they obviously can. I don’t think your link helps.
No one is trying to hurt their characters. Just stating how their actions appear.
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No one is trying to hurt their characters.
Then I suggest not spreading comments referencing "anti lgbt stuff" when (as far as we have seen) there is nothing anti-LGBT about them. Even if you mean no harm, it can do damage, by coloring people's perception of the project and its leadership.
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(as far as we have seen)
Speak for yourself? They have repeatedly politicised changes that make the codebase more inclusive. The thread you linked too did get heated, but this seperate PR was perfectly calm and they still locked it, while providing really contradictory reasoning. They say they don't want to "alienate anyone who'd like to join in the project" but their use of male-gendered pronouns throughout is doing just that...
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I don't know if any of what you claim is true, since I haven't followed those discussions. However, even if true, none of it would mean they are anti-LGBT.
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Okay, but are you going to be satisfied with anything short of them saying "I'm anti-LGBT"?
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I would be satisfied with people not making wild, misleading, insulting claims about others in the first place.
I wonder why you're so intent on arguing in support of that behavior.
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Thanks for telling me what I needed to know.
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Hey, quick question, what do you think of the lead developer of LadyBird calling Brendan Eich, known homophobe and CEO of Brave, "Senpai."
Spoiler tag so image doesn't eat screen space
It's completely unrelated, right? He just doesn't know, right? I'm sure nobody ever tried telling him. Or maybe he's only capable of perceiving technical information, so the rest of Brendan's history never entered his head?
...Not at all, he's fully aware, and he regrets joining the people who spoke out against Brendan, something he only did to fit in. He should damn well know Eich is a homophobe if he's so smart, he just doesn't give a shit.
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turning it down doesn't but raging over the idea and attacking the user does
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The brigading wasn't from the same person who made the pull request, and happened three years later. The thread isn't even that toxic as far as GitHub threads can get.
It's not a great example of what you're talking about.
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Can you elaborate on that?
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Someone made a PR to refer to users in documentation as "they" instead of "he". The lead maintainer rejected it saying "This project is not an appropriate arena to advertise your personal politics." and then added a part against personal politics in the code of conduct. One brigade attracted for good reason later, another maintainer quietly merged the PR. It's very weird, but not anything too serious IMO.
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Definitely won't be using ladybird then. If someone hates trans folks and just women in general enough that they literally see using inclusive language to refer to theoretical users as politics I don't see any reason to do anything to elevate their work.
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Yeah, haven't looked into it again but when it came up first it had big "priviliged cishet white dude (as per usual with a lot of open source projects, thanks capitalism) not having enough empathy for others to change behaviour even the tiniest bit" energy. I'm not holding my breath but I have tinsy bit of hope they'll mature with the browser ...
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An absolutely strange hill to die on, and may be an indicator of a bigger hissy fit in the future.
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So weird, since "they/them" have always been used to refer to people who's gender/sex is not known!?
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Since their first language is German, it might be that they think that they/them is like how it is in German, never used since it's gendered language, and definitely political in the sense that it's just wierd to see and making a statement of you use it.
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The person that had the PR merged wasn't a maintainer, they just attempted to make the change using a different phrasing.
I remember they wrote "corrected grammar errors" and provided arguments and the PR got merged.Here is the PR. They even posted on Mastodon about it at the time.Edit: It seems now they require contributors to write documentation in gender-neutral language. However, the main dev still complains, to this day, how hard it is to run an OSS project while being "apolitical".
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The only thing I can find about that is an article from someone obviously transphobic and some reddit discussion about the article.
https://www.reddit.com/r/LinuxDrama/comments/1ewj6cs/ladybird_web_browser_developer_attacked_by/
I wish i had evidence from a source less likely to ignore anything that goes against their bias. what's there plus the stuff that happened afterwards mentioned in the reddit thread makes it seem more like the developer is ignorant but eventually came around. but there could be a lot more i don't know about.
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What are you talking about?
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On a code comment the author wrote "he" somewhere, not sure if referring to a specific person or was used to generally refer to "people". It could be the author was referring to a trans woman or could be a cis man (haven't checked).
Somebody did a PR changing that to "they" and the author rejected it and said something along the lines of "not wanting to get political".
Then backlash started.
Not enough meat here for me to boycott the app really. YMMV
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Check my comment, he was referring to the user reading the documentation in general.
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So most likely a mental translation issue. Massive nothingburguer specially with the dire need on options on the browser space
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Agreed, no need to throw a removedfit over one inclusive suggestion!
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