Trump to lift pause on 2,000-pound bomb supply to Israel, Walla News reports
Trump to lift pause on 2,000-pound bomb supply to Israel, Walla News reports
Summary
Trump plans to lift the Biden administration’s freeze on supplying 2,000-pound bombs to Israel and reverse sanctions against Israeli settlers.
您正在查看单个对话串。
Palestinian here, not in the US. So Harris would have done genocide but without more 2000 pound bombs. Trump does it with them.
Your voters couldn’t decide against genocide, they could only decide with which weapons it will be continued. You guys have a problem.
Edit: greetings to the Lemmy Hasbara division. Responses are kinda wild, didn’t expect this. I should post more here.
Biden already sent 14,000 of those bombs so you’re wrong. Both candidates are pro genocide.
I was hopeful about the peace deal with the Muslim countries signing on but as usual our politicians flood everything with shit so no one knows that’s up or down.
deleted by creator
Oh, who said I am a not?
Does anyone decide against genocide when it suits them? There's some irony in both Palestine and Israel supporters whining to the Democrats about not opposing the respective genocides hard enough while ignoring their Hamas and Netanyahu doing it to the other side. Take the log out of your own eye before complaining about the speck in the other's.
On a rational level, we all need to oppose killing of civilians and children. But man, it's hard to convince people to care when the people you're trying to save won't help themselves.
I don’t think I understand your comment. You think it’s hard to side against genocide? Because that’s what most of us are doing here.
And is it working?
Point being, the whole "genocide" thing is useless because people don't care. No one thinks they're committing a genocide. If you went to Nazi Germany, they'd tell you the holocaust is not a genocide, it's a security measure or something like that. Just like you probably don't look at Oct. 7 as a genocide. It's the same thing. We're all human, we're all easily tricked into being monsters.
Being biased against Zionists is a good thing.
"Bias" makes it sound like there isn't a completely impartial case to be made against them. Like the most meticulously documented genocide in human history.
Just scrolling through the comments here, people's takes vary from bad to good, but everyone's comment is only as long as the text they wrote. Then you jam this huge, not really relevant meme into discussion of an actual life or death issue for millions of people, which is just playing off of a pun on the name "John Goodman". And your comment isn't any better. You make a bunch of really off-base, unsubstantiated attacks on the guy you're replying to. You don't really seem to understand why they even brought up being Palestinian. You ignore the 100% legitimate criticism that you voted for someone complicit in genocide, brushing it off as "the only thing you could do" (it wasn't). Then you accuse them of trying to sound "edgy".
Buddy, your comment is bleeding "trying to sound edgy". What is this meme doing here? Where is your sense of responsibility or shame? You are joking about a genocide.
deleted by creator
Nothing like having third party resources blocked by default.
deleted by creator
Another asshole to the blocklist. Oh what do you know, another lemmy.world fascist.
Hey to any Palestinians out there I promise I will never let losers like the above person rest in peace.
deleted by creator
Non American here. Both your parties are genocide and apartheid supporters. Simple as that.
Yea, one of the two is more than the other. But you got to come to terms with the fact that your country's bipartisan effect in the region is kinda evil.
Lol, down vote all you like. I'm just telling the truth.
Everyone here agrees with you, dawg... We just understand our country's political system enough to know which was the correct choice to mitigate that evil.
People made the wrong choice.
You know how we say that Israel is going to continue with apartheid and colonization even if Netanyahu is voted out? And that focusing too much on Netanyahu is sometimes a red herring because Israeli Apartheid is structural and a long term strategic goal of the Israeli establishment? Like, sure Netanyahu accelerates the process and does it shamelessly and publicly, but it's not as if the process had not been in full swing by both center-left and center-right governments before him, who massively expanded settlements and entrenched the occupation and settlements.
Same logic applies for the US support of Israeli Apartheid. Your system moves faster and more overtly when controlled by your fascist Right. But I'm not going to pretend that your non-fascist Center is not basically moving in the same direction.
Just because your political system puts a gun to your heads every four years, doesn't mean the rest of us have to buy into the same blackmail. (EDIT: we have other blackmails foisted on us by our own assholes thank you very much.)
Just because your political system puts a gun to your heads every four years, doesn't mean the rest of us have to buy into the same blackmail.
Yeah but unfortunately for you, you do. Or even worse, you have no say whatsoever.
Grumble grumble. Stupid political realists. Grumble grumble.
Yea, one of the two is more than the other.
Not even.
Your truth isn't THE truth buddy
Disprove me. Point me official policies enacted by one of the two US parties that materially opposed Israeli Apartheid and the genocide of Palestinians since Oslo. To make sure I don't move the goalposts by claiming you cherry pick occasional bleeps, make a strong argument by showing me a consistent trend.
EDIT: added "since Oslo" because we need some start time.
EDIT2: Here's what ChatGPT has to say about this. It is obviously not the arbiter of truth, but I guess this is common enough knowledge that it has made to the training of LLMs. Not a proof, but a baseline to beat:
Since the Oslo Accords in 1993, both major U.S. political parties—the Democrats and the Republicans—have predominantly supported Israel, often refraining from officially opposing its policies toward Palestinians. While individual politicians within these parties have occasionally criticized Israeli actions, a consistent, party-wide trend of enacting official policies that materially oppose what some describe as Israeli apartheid or the genocide of Palestinians is not evident.
Democratic Party:
Historically, the Democratic Party has maintained strong support for Israel. However, in recent years, a progressive faction within the party has voiced concerns over Israel's treatment of Palestinians. Notably, members of "The Squad," including Representatives Rashida Tlaib and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, have condemned Israeli policies. For instance, in October 2023, Tlaib accused Israel of committing genocide, stating, "President Biden, not all America is with you on this one, and you need to wake up and understand. We are literally watching people commit genocide."
Despite these individual statements, the broader Democratic Party has not adopted official policies that consistently oppose Israeli actions. The party's platform continues to support a two-state solution without explicitly condemning Israel's practices. While some Democrats have urged the administration to take a firmer stance, such as the January 2024 letter from 60 Democratic Congressmembers urging Secretary of State Antony Blinken to condemn the forced displacement of Palestinians, these actions represent internal party debates rather than an official, unified policy shift.
Republican Party:
The Republican Party has traditionally exhibited unwavering support for Israel. Under President Donald Trump's administration, this support intensified, with actions such as recognizing Jerusalem as Israel's capital and moving the U.S. embassy there. The 2024 Republican Party platform reaffirmed the party's stance to "stand with Israel" and called for the deportation of "pro-Hamas radicals," indicating a continued strong alliance. WIKIPEDIA
While there have been isolated critiques—such as Trump's personal criticisms of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu—these do not reflect a broader party policy opposing Israeli actions toward Palestinians. Overall, the Republican Party has not enacted official policies that materially oppose Israel's treatment of Palestinians.
Conclusion:
In summary, neither the Democratic nor the Republican Party has demonstrated a consistent trend of enacting official policies that materially oppose Israel's actions toward Palestinians since the Oslo Accords. While individual members within these parties have expressed dissenting views, these have not translated into official party-wide policies or actions.
Ugh. Fuck chat gpt. It’s hallucinating and not a legitimate source.
That being said the uniparty supports capitalism, imperialism, and the unsinkable aircraft carrier known as Israel.
They are actually right
You do realize the United States didn't start that war. They've done a lot to stabilize the region and they have tried to solve the issue both before and after the war.
You try and negotiate a deal between Israel and Palestine it's not an easy task.
I never said they started the war. I said they support genocide and apartheid (and I should have added occupation). Which they do. You can argue all you like whether their reasons for doing it are good or bad, but the simple fact of the matter is that in a bipartisan way they support Apartheid Israel and its policies for genocide and occupation. That's just factual.
I was taking aim at the evil influence to the region. The Americans and Israeli didn't start the war. They have been working to build ties and alliances to promote regional stability. There are Iranian proxy groups that are destabilizing the region, these people are to blame for the war and destabilizing the region. You cannot support these groups.
I understand people get hurt in war but negotiations with these groups is going terribly. They have insane demands and are completely delusional. You would never accept a terrorist group doing an attack on your country without repercussions.
Malaka, I'm Greek. Better ask what I'd do if my country was occupied, like the Israelis occupy Palestine. My ancestors did worse to the Ottomans after 400 years of occupation and subjugation than what Hamas did to the Israelis after 80.
We understand what occupation means and what it does to a people. Same reason why the Irish support the Palestinians. And we understand that the "stability" you talk of reeks of Nakba, Apartheid, Occupation and Genocide.
Edit: toned down the chest thumping
I'm curious what you suggest the US should do to rectify your criticisms? Do you advocate for the US to take a completely hands-off approach, withdrawing all presence and funding in the area?
The US should listen to Daniel Levy, former negotiator for Israel under Ehud Barak. Look for good interviews and talks online.
That's, not really what I asked. You have an opportunity here to argue publicly for a position you believe in passionately, and are criticizing others for not holding... and you pass it off to me?
Why bother to preach if you're not willing to teach? Or at least provide a link or two.
Good point.
Here is who Daniel Levy is:
He was formerly an Israeli negotiator as part of the Taba summit and Oslo 2 peace process. He is current president of the U.S./Middle East Project (USMEP) and was among the founders of the organization J Street. So, you know, not some random guy.
Here are some links:
My rationale for focusing on Levy is that this is a person who has first-hand experience with Israeli politics, with the Oslo process, engages with the anti-apartheid Palestinian, Israeli and Western left, and is knowledgeable of US, British and Jewish diaspora politics. His vision for resolving the Israeli-Palestinian conflict is focused in a dignified, equitable peace through a two-state solution, grounded in international law and mutual respect for the rights of all individuals involved.
In a world where reason, compassion and universal human rights were the rule, Daniel's approach would be the absolute minimum baseline for any discussion about a resolution. There is objectively nothing unreasonable or radical in his vision. But in this timeline? He's labelled an unreasonable far-left extremist, and only consistently platformed by the likes of DemocracyNow and Novara.
So, there. He also happens to have a velvety radio voice, so, enjoy :)
Thank you. I will look over these as time permits!
Ok what would you do if your country was occupied like Palestine? Would you continue to fight Isreal and risk starting another war knowing full well every single war has been lost catastrophically?
This is not a theoretical question for a Greek person. Here is what we would do:
What would you do if your country was occupied?
But even that ultimately is besides the point, because we are looking at the whole thing from the outside. For a more sober look, see my responses to LengAways below.
You didn't answer the question. Those events do not replicate the situation in Palestine. The situation in Palestine is so lopsided that war is just not a realistic option.
If my country was occupied I would fight initially and for years after no matter how lopsided however if we got slaughtered multiple wars in a row i'd give up on violent resistance. If I was born in a country occupied for decades with a massive power difference like say china I would just live my life in whatever conditions existed. Things would be hard enough without getting bombed and sieged.
The ottoman occupation of Greece lasted 400 years. Similar numbers for the Bulgarians, the Serbs, etc.The Irish fought for 800. The Poles for 120 years.
If you come from a part of the world that has this history you understand what it means to not give up.
You still dont answer the question. Why is this so hard for you to answer when you said I could ask this exact question? You can bring up history from a different part of the world but like I said before it's not the same situation.
The path to their own nation doesn't come through attacks on surrounding countries. Do you think one day they are just going to suddenly win a war and gain their freedom?
You do realize that we supplied their weapons?!
I do not think blame for the wars sits with the person who sold the weapons. There are plenty of people selling bombs. Sell Israel no bombs and they go somewhere else, restrict weapons sales and you keep them as an ally but limit their capability.
Fucking cope.
How could it be any other way?
I think of the millions of "pro-Palestinian lemmings", there were all of like five that said Trump would help. Everyone else looked soberly at the bipartisan support for genocide, which you seem unwilling to acknowledge.
I think the tally at this point is about 30 billion dollars worth of arms sent to "Israel" since Oct '23. 99% of that under Biden. Breaking domestic and international law in doing so. That is the largest foreign benefactor of the U.S., a fundamentally apartheid state engaged in genocide for 77 years, more brutally and unashamedly than ever before since '23. Again, this is violating the Leahy Law, U.S. domestic prohibitions on the commission or complicity in genocide, the UN Genocide Convention, likely the Geneva Conventions, and other international law. I would love for someone with your stance to explain why Biden engaged in this, because I think you're just floundering trying to describe this situation without that key piece of information.
Hope that helps. Not sure why you are looking to excuse complicity in genocide by drawing a D/R division where there really is not one. IMO what you're doing in posting this is extremely immoral and I urge you to reconsider your views.
P.S.:
https://www.reuters.com/world/us-has-sent-israel-thousands-2000-pound-bombs-since-oct-7-2024-06-28
WASHINGTON, June 28 (Reuters) - The Biden administration has sent to Israel large numbers of munitions, including more than 10,000 highly destructive 2,000-pound bombs and thousands of Hellfire missiles, since the start of the war in Gaza, said two U.S. officials briefed on an updated list of weapons shipments.
Between the war's start last October and recent days, the United States has transferred at least 14,000 of the MK-84 2,000-pound bombs, 6,500 500-pound bombs, 3,000 Hellfire precision-guided air-to-ground missiles, 1,000 bunker-buster bombs, 2,600 air-dropped small-diameter bombs, and other munitions, according to the officials, who were not authorized to speak publicly.
As someone who's actually been following the individual arm shipments, the implication that there is any difference is literally insane. Biden was shoveling coal into the genocide engine as fast as humanly possible.
Yeah! If both of them are bad on this one thing then it shouldn't matter if the worse option goes in! Yeah!
Do you ever think, hey, maybe I'm making a really simplistic argument that the person I'm relying to has gone to the trouble to completely debunk?
I'm here but I'm not United Statesian so I can't vote in your elections (even though US foreign influence is so aggressive it feels like I should have a say).
No one said Trump would stop it. We said that Biden/Harris shouldn't be enabling it.
And that made centrists very, very angry.
Trump actually delivered a ceasefire.
Name does not check out.
When does STAR voting start in your state blue conservative?
What is star voting?
Harris would have done the same thing
https://www.reuters.com/world/us-has-sent-israel-thousands-2000-pound-bombs-since-oct-7-2024-06-28/
When would the killing stop under biden (or harris who was happy to continue his policies)? Pausing one fucking shipment isn't the amazing stand for life that you think it is. Sure though, blame it all on Palestine and not the democrats refusing to listen to voters (on many issues, not just this one) during a fucking election. I'm sure if the other pro-genocide candidate got in, we'd all be living in fucking paradise.
I hope your path of reasoning works out, but I fear Trump would even allow Israel to throw nuclear weapons at Palestine... just for shits and giggles of his fan base to see if Israel really would.
They will drive Israel to the limit of atrocious crimes they allow ... and use this to prosper antisemitic sentiment everywhere else. That's my prognosis, let's see who is closer to the truth.
Well, for one, Harris wouldn't have had people doing Nazi salutes on stage at her inauguration... But surely that's unrelated.
No but she would have had people like Liz Cheney on stage with her, who are just the somewhat more polite precursor to nazis and harbor the same essential bigotry just more disguised in the language of the ruling class.
I would put forward the argument that Democrat voters are obsessed with appearances and rhetoric, and completely ignore policy that contradicts the ideals they think of themselves as having. You criticize Elon Musk doing Nazi symbolism, great. Count how many comments you've posted about that, and then give me the ratio of those to the number of comments you posted criticizing Biden for sending ~30 billion dollars of arms to a genocide. Because, at the end of the day, the biggest problem with Nazism was that it resulted in genocide. You might remember from school that genocide is LITERALLY THE WORST THING EVER BESIDES COMPLETE NUCLEAR ANNIHILATION OF THE PLANET.
I'd like to see a minimum of 1:100 on those comments. I get the feeling it's less.
Nobody told you the killing would stop if Trump won. The minority of people in the U.S. who have a serious problem with genocide (enough to push them to action) mostly expressed extreme disillusionment at a political system where genocide has become acceptable enough to vote for across a broad majority of the population, and an unwillingness to support anyone responsible.
Your logic of "one genocide supporter would be worse than the other" is not compelling to anyone who's thought about it for more than a few minutes.
The sheer idiocy of these people honestly. "You helped Trump get elected because you didn't complain about Harris enough." FFS.
Biden, not once, ever, stated "full throated support for genocide".
Removed for misinformation.
At no point did Biden ever, once, tell Israel to continue killing Palestinians. The support was provided for defense from Iran, full stop.
October 25th, 2023: https://www.reuters.com/world/biden-criticizes-extremist-settlers-west-bank-2023-10-25/
August 1st, 2024:
https://www.jns.org/biden-reaffirms-support-for-israeli-self-defense-against-iran-in-call-with-netanyahu/
November 26th, 2024:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/biden-says-israel-has-right-to-self-defense-if-hezbollah-or-anyone-else-breaks-deal/
What Israel chose to do with that support is on Israel, not Biden.
Removed again for misinformation and temp banned.
What Israel chose to do with that support is on Israel, not Biden.
This is an awfully subjective political opinion to be moderating on.
It's not subjective. Biden's opinion on Israel is matter of fact stated and quoted multiple times.
Subjectively, I find it incredibly naive (especially for a President), but it's not the same as Biden dropping the bombs himself which is how the "buh buh gEnOcIdE!" folks are playing it.
In the end, we now have a President whose only opinion* is Israel didn't commit the genocide fast enough.
https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/04/politics/trump-israel-comments/index.html
“They’ve got to finish what they started, and they’ve got to finish it fast, and we have to get on with life.”
That's what a pro-genocide President looks like.
That's unfair, he's also of the opinion that a ruined Gaza is a great beachfront development opportunity.
I quoted the subjective opinion. "I just gave the murderer a gun, and told him to only use it for legitimate self-defense" isn't a situation where most people would consider the gun-giver to have no moral responsibility for a future killing. If you think it is, that's an unusual but valid opinion, but calling that an objective fact is not true.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_support_for_Israel_in_the_Israel%E2%80%93Hamas_war
Are you really trying to claim that USA supported israel without knowing they would have leveled gaza?
No, I'm saying Biden stated, repeatedly, he was providing support for the legitimate defense of Israel, for which he was a full supporter.
October 25th, 2023: https://www.reuters.com/world/biden-criticizes-extremist-settlers-west-bank-2023-10-25/
August 1st, 2024:
https://www.jns.org/biden-reaffirms-support-for-israeli-self-defense-against-iran-in-call-with-netanyahu/
November 26th, 2024:
https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/biden-says-israel-has-right-to-self-defense-if-hezbollah-or-anyone-else-breaks-deal/
What Israel chose to do with that aid is on THEM, not Biden.
Biden knew what Israel would have done, because they have been doing the same thing (over and over again) when given weapons.
I suggest getting a .world admin in on this.
You should not be moderating and banning based on your anger and subjective opinion.
Again, Biden's direct quotations are not subjective. He legitimately believes that Israel has the right to defend themselves and supplied support to do that.
Israel misappropriated that support.
Biden acted in good faith, Israel did not.
I don't see how it's any plainer than that.
Was Biden STUPID to do it? Absolutely. That doesn't mean he's the one engaging in genocide, Israel is.
deleted by creator
deleted by creator