We're hoping that very concrete, very public evidence might sway some of his base that actually have a few scruples left.

In case you're not familiar with Frank Wilhoit's amazing law, here it is:

Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.

You are right: truth and lawfulness doesn't matter, this is not about consequences or fear thereof but it is about attention. So long as headspace is taken up by something that presents him in a negative light, less attention is spend on validation and this leads to perceived lack of admiration. I am unable think of anything this administration does that cannot be explained by traits that align with narcissistic personality disorder.

The Epstein files are the last symbol of hope for many people. I think your assessment on their potential impact is probably right. However, some people give MAGA followers enough credit to believe that some of them might turn on Trump if a ‘smoking gun’ such as the Files were to surface. After all, ‘protect the children’ has been a perennial, if disingenuous, rallying cry for the right since the dawn of politics.

The fact is that the US is dealing with two major problems: The first will be solved when the orange dotard finally kicks the bucket. The second is much trickier: 75M people wanted what the shithead was selling. They will still be around when Trump is gone. Believing that MAGA cares about underage sex trafficking is the same as believing MAGA followers possess some humanity and can be redeemed after their leader is dead.

Truth is important. There's something they're fighting to keep hidden (standard disclaimer: of course they should not release CSAM or identities of victims, survivor or otherwise) and until it's revealed, the other side can still accurately say that we don't know the full extent of his documented involvement.

Additional information exists and every day it's not in the headlines and in our hands, real-life monsters feel the heat die down a little more. This must not continue.

There would be many people implicated in such files. Even if a handful of people at the top would be able to sidestep any consequences, dozens more would not.

The only reason the current admin is able to stay in power is because it's enabled by hundreds of influential sycophants. If a few dozen of those were put behind bars, they'd lose their majority, and stop being able to dismiss any and all legal challenges.

Let me remind you that the 14th amendment states that anyone who gives aid or comfort to an enemy of the United States is defined as a terrorist. If they lost their majority, it would open up every single person who voted against impeachment after the insurrection to getting slapped with terrorism charges.

It's because MAGA supporters (not representatives) mostly do honestly care about stopping pedophilia. The right has been saying it's trans people, or whatever, doing it, which is how they keep them under control. If we can prove that no, it's the elite, and specifically Trump, that are actually the issue then they'll turn on them.

The problem with MAGA supporters isn't what they care about mostly. It's that they've allowed themselves to be lied to and believe it totally. They want to protect their family and children, and they want good jobs for workers, and all of that. Republicans have been able to use their media powers to convince these stupid people that they're the solution. This is one of the few chances to very visibly and undoubtedly prove them wrong and change people's opinions.

I agree with you. Most of the informed people that have been paying attention already know he is a child rapist pedo Nazi shitstain. This world is so fucked. Anyways, I think it's a few things together.

Some of these people that keep posting or commenting "what about the Epstein files?" are the same people that post this inane shit all the time, like "egg prices", "voting Kamela", and other one-liners, that imo detract from and belittle these conversations. And some are just genuine and innocent in mentioning it. Maybe some are even bad actors doing this on purpose for some nefarious goal.

The hope is that eventually they'll say "ok, THIS is not acceptable" but they just keep accepting it. It's probably futile, but the options are keep trying, or become a fascist, so I'm going to keep trying.

It matters because many people believe it matters, this is what it ultimately comes down to. Because people's collective beliefs can hold enormous power. (Yes, we do live in a society)

If you actually talked to conservatives you would realise at least some are starting to openly voice disappointment in Trump.

He ran promising stuff like the release of the Epstein files and an audit of Fort Knox, none of which he has produced.

Because if you're distracted talking about what everyone already knows, you're not talking about facism and new horrors.

It worries me that, even in the best case where the Epstein scandal causes Trump’s supporters to turn against him and he’s forced from office by his cabinet or Congress, Vance and most of the rest of the administration will emerge unscathed—and public opinion on his actual policies will be unaffected.

I am getting tired of trying to prove to the assholes that they're assholes. Real change won't come at the end of a string of magic words.

Okay, you have to see this in the context of QAnon conspiracy, that is injected into mainstream MAGA. Remember that guy going into a pizzaria to save children that werent there. Well according to conspiracy the ruling elites are child abusers, from sexual to ritualistic sacrifices. The Epstein files are for many a large list of people that are in this elite group. MAGA ran hard with it, Trump ran with it. It was specifically mentioned time and time again. So a very large part of the conservative voterbase are convinced that Trump, to drain the swamp, would release the list. All elites would get rounded up, convicted, and we would be free from the grip of the ruling elites.

Trump is on the list.

So there has been an extremely hard pivot by MAGA, down playing it, burying it, etc. Trying very hard to keep this under wraps.

It's not that Trump cares much about the voter base, as long as there is a devout little group to do the dirty work. He isn't going to give up his presidency either way. But it's annoying for him. He has done so much shit, why talk about some shit that happened ages ago. Trump doesn't understand why this is bad for him, neither does he care.

We should care. a. there are victims. b. its a disaster for the dictator.

I think 47 and his cronies will manage to blame it all on Bill Clinton and sweep the rest under their carpet, along with his conviction in court and the impeachments. It's a media war. It's hard to play the game against the reality-tv-schooled incumbent to keep anything in the headlines. He'll just throw a dead cat on the table and take all the oxygen out of the room, i.e. annex Canada or Greenland, 100% tariffs on everything, ICE jackboots raids, national guard in all cities run by Democrats, any late night tweet while he is constipated. It's hard to keep anything in the news that is not conning from him. And this story is one of the few with staying power and the potential to be damaging to him before the judiciary has entirely lost its independence and maybe some of his followers rediscover their human decency in the attic. As such it is the only recruitment tool with oomph for Democrats to mobilize opposition to the fascist in chief. And, boy, do they need it!

I'm not sure what people even think the "Epstein files" are, or why they assume there's some smoking gun in there.

Most of his impunity comes from control of Congress. Clear proof of him being a pedophile maybe doesn't make a difference to some MAGAs on social media, but it does make a difference to some of his supporters who actually believe themselves to be righteous Christians. The megachurch pastors already understand that Trump is a crook and pedophile, but they can currently deflect by saying there is no proof. If there IS proof, they may have to change their tune to retain credibility with their flock. Then you'll suddenly have some contested congressional seats during the midterms.

Release the Trump/Epstein files