No, the dire wolf has not been brought back from extinction
No, the dire wolf has not been brought back from extinction
www.newscientist.com
No, the dire wolf has not been brought back from extinction
43 comments
-
The company that did this didn't directly clone Dire Wolves. Instead, they identified several "key traits" that defined the species external morphology and then edited wolf DNA to gain those traits.
First, this obviously isn't bringing the species back. It's more like artificial convergent evolution than anything else. But even if you accept that bringing a species back that will fit the same ecological niche and resembles the old species is "bringing it back," there's a much bigger problem. We cannot know what the "key traits" for a dire wolf are.
We don't know what key traits are actually required for dire wolves to re-inhabit their ancient ecological niche. All we have are their skeletons. We don't know what their fur was like. We don't know if they had any key soft tissue adaptations. We don't know if they have any unique behaviors that were key to them surviving in their niche. Imagine trying to bring back bowerbirds if you didn't know anything about their nest building behaviors. You could try to modify something similar from a similar species, but if all you had are their skeletons, you would have no idea that they were famous in life for making their elaborate nests.
No one alive has ever seen a dire wolf. No one has ever spoken to someone that has seen one. No one has ever read an account of what these animals looked like, behaved like, and lived like. We're just assuming here that their behavior is identical to other wolf species, and that the only differences are the major morphological ones. We can't know what these creatures were truly like, as they were hunted to extinction long before writing was ever invented. And there's nothing in the oral histories either, beyond just maybe stories about great big wolves that might, by some miracle, be a distant remembrance of them.
Also, for perspective:
the two species share 99.5 per cent of their DNA
And humans and chimpanzees share 98.8% of our DNA. Imagine if we went extinct, all you had was our bones, and some space alien landed and tried to bring us back by modifying chimp DNA. If they had nothing else to go on, how close do you think they would actually manage to really bringing us back? Odds are they would end up with something more akin to various ancient hominid species than our present human race.
-
Thomas Nagel: "What is it like to be a bat?"
Colossal Biosciences: "lol who cares as long as it looks like a bat?"
-
Silicon Valley is full of tech bros that dropped out of college before they finished their philosophy courses. And damn does it show.
-
-
I 100% was sold on the hype, but I think it’s still interesting having had my expectations tempered. I don’t think it could be argued they are original dire wolves. Maybe it could be argued they are a modern rendition of what those researchers believe a dire wolf would look like.
I think it could be argued to be its own unique species now, which could be named as a dire wolf for lack of a better name. Whether or not the changes they made have made them unable to breed with grey wolves is probably also an important question on what these animals are exactly.
The stated goal of the company seems to be to reintroduce similar extinct animals to the best of our ability and help introduce genetic changes to threatened species to better adapt to climate change.
I think the company calling the animal they made a dire wolf is mostly for marketing purposes at the end of the day though. Still really cool research! I hope they continue to get funding for this and other projects.
-
As with bringing back bowerbirds, even if you were to perfectly recreate humans from the DNA of chimps in a world where all humans had gone extinct, they'd hardly be what we call human. Without all of the culture that we've created, developed, and shared for tens of thousands of years, we'd just be a slightly more intelligent than average blank slate.
Even wild animals have learned cultural behaviours, particularly social animals like wolves. Hell, were dire wolves even social?
-
It's 96% for chimpanzees. Over 60% for bananas
-
-
The spread of misinformation about genetic science like that could be quite.. dire hahaaaa
I'll see myself out
-
It's a shame, because a lot of stuff like this is legitimately exciting, but sensationalism tries to sell it as something entirely different and sullies the conversation.
-
-
I checked both YouTube's "Trending" and my Lemmy feed today and I love how one is the perfect opposite of the other.
On one side, an algorithm wants me to
be amazedwatch ads looking at AMAZING videos talking about those wolves while on the other side a human enlights me with a good article that tempers the hype.Thank you btw human
-
For what it's worth, I saw plenty of Dire Wolf hype articles on Lemmy yesterday, but nothing about it one way or the other on my YT yesterday, so maybe not a great comparison.
-
-
Sounds like if the ship of theseus burnt to the ground, and years later, someone recreates it by modifying a boat to look like the original, would that be the ship of theseus?
-
More like the ship burned down and you re-created it from detailed blueprints. Same ship? No, same class of ship? Sure.
-
No, there were even animals more closely related to dire wolves, this is like if you took a boat that already existed, found some blueprints for a small portion of the parts of the ship and kinda copied that but not exactly either
-
-
-
Colossal is claiming that three genetically modified grey wolf pups – two males called Remus and Romulus born in October, and a female called Khaleesi born in January – are in fact dire wolves.
Those names say so much about the company culture already.
-
Another company run by a Musk or Ajit Pai clone I’m sure with some manicured “quirk” to seem out of pocket.
-
And if you know your Roman history .... Romulus murders his brother Remus .... which is why we call it Rome and not Rems or Rem-Rome
-
They couldn't even be bothered to pick a name of an actual Dire Wolf from GoT either. Fucking tourists.
-
Colossal what?
-
I recognize Khaleesi from game of thrones the other 2 I am going to assume is a reference as well. I have not ever watched game of thrones because the fandom always made me cringe so I can't confirm.
I feel it's safe for me to assume this is more of the same cringelord bullshit.
like when some cringelord claimed a juvenile of an already existing dinosaur species (Pachycephalosaurus) was something completely different and named it an equally cringey "draco rex hogwartsia".
-
-
But... but... baby woof!
-
I mean, it’s useful tech to be able to modify an organism to fit a certain ecological niche. Might save us after humans extinct the wrong species.
But it’s definitely incorrect to suggest that they recreated a species when they merely think they created a lookalike.
-
My hopes of owning a feathered velociraptor farm in the future: Vanished.
-
Okay your comment is the only reasonable place I can bring this up
The other night I had a dream that a baller company had to fight a Jurassic Park style pack of raptors and it was weird and epic.
The dancers had stealth and agility and incredible muscle density. The velociraptors had teeth and claws.
I don't remember how it ended.
-
I asked AI about it:
-
-
And no Jurassic Park! 😭
-
Turkeys are pretty close!
-
New purpose found in life: Gene edit turkeys so that they go: "RAR!"
-
-
I mean you can still hold onto them. Maybe someday we'll get lucky and find a perfectly preserved, freshly fed mosquito, and then BAM! Dino DNA.
-
Nope, dna has a half-life, sorry!
-
-
Sorry best we can do is scaly juarassic park style
-
-
TIL a dire wolf is an extinct species and not something just made up for fantasy worlds. Half-expecting to see "No, the warg has not been brought back from extinction" next.
-
But what if it had been? What a magical world that would be
-
In D&D we'd use it like a template for badass combat version. Get ready for dire trolls.
-
-
Aww man, this is not the follow-up I was hoping for..
-
Are the animals in jurassic park dinosaurs? These wolves were modified based on dna from dire wolves, and presumably made to be as close to the scientist's understanding of dire wolves as possible.
Species has multiple definitions, and not all of them have specific requirements. These animals are effectively dire wolves, and i don't think it's incorrect to call them that.
Another thing that i think should be noted is that whether these are actually dire wolves is unimportant. They're the offspring of one species that have had parts of their dna directly programmed to produce traits from another species. This is a major development that could lead to both the extremely cool and extremely unethical creation of new organisms.
(Ps. I know the jurassic park dinosaurs are inaccurate)
-
These wolves were modified based on dna from dire wolves, and presumably made to be as close to the scientist’s understanding of dire wolves as possible.
I guess you missed this part:
And Colossal claims it has turned grey wolves into dire wolves by making just 20 gene edits?
That is the claim. In fact, five of those 20 changes are based on mutations known to produce light coats in grey wolves, Shapiro told New Scientist. Only 15 are based on the dire wolf genome directly and are intended to alter the animals’ size, musculature and ear shape.
-
Nope, i saw that part, i just don't think it contradicts me
-
-
-
The Dire Wolf is an enemy found only in Canada along with Dire Bears and Snakes. They are like regular wolves, but dire.
-
Are you going to tell me that the dinosaurs in Jurassic Park aren't real dinosaurs? Give me a break...
43 comments