See?? I'm supporting togetherness

This is the default behaviour for chickens. I can't think of any chicken like creatures that exists in the wild that resembles. The chickens I kept had plenty of room both inside and outside. Outside was a predator proof fence around a large area with different kinds of vegetation, bushes and wet and dry environments (I also had a couple of mallards). Inside they had running water, things to climb on to roost, and various boxes to lay and sleep in. Every week I cleaned their living quarters and threw down fresh bedding. They were not for food or for egg production. I ate and gave away the eggs they laid.

Edit: to keep the roosters from doing the dirty with close relatives, I swapped rooster with other people that kept poultry as a hobby

Ever heard of domestication?

PETA bad amirite?

Big logical gaps in this argument:

The op never said they were superior morally.

Even, given the above, the op deemed chickens immoral that does not make all chickens' actions immoral. Preening, roosting and eating grain are not immoral activities.

Defining only the horrible acts as horrible is a circular argument as no definition has been provided as horrible.

Other than those three, you really stuck it to the carnist, chief.

Wow, no.

But what it does do is point out that PETA is full of shit and you shouldn't listen to the organisation that runs kill shelters becaus they think you shouldn't have pets.

The fuckers have actually STOLEN PETS and "euthanized" them inside of a day, when the animal was in good health and in a loving home.

FUCK PETA, they are a bunch of animal killers.

That one whooshed right over your head eh? He's saying that chickens families are not, in fact, the same as human families. They don't form a family unit with bonds above those of other chickens. It's mostly because they're chickens....and not humans and it was a dumb comparison for PETA to try and make.

Pointing out how chickens relate to other chickens does not mean it's an endorsement for cruelty...you stretched big time for that one.

Abuse? No. But kill and make tasty? Absolutely.

Free Space really should be "Where do you get your protein?"

Thank you for this!

WHERE WITH ALL THE ANIMALS IF ALL WENT VEGAN NOW?

Can someone please answer this?!

cheese is too tasty

yeah, I'm not sure about that

Copied from an old reddit post.

This is why people hate PETA.

Yes, PETA does some crazy shit, but as with many things there are two sides to the story which is difficult to see when you get bombarded by anti-PETA stuff as is common on e.g. Reddit.

Anti-PETA efforts by the meat industry:

Sites like www.petakillsanimals.com are run by the Center for Organizational Research and Education, which is a lobbying platform for the fast food, meat, alcohol and tobacco industries. They also target the humane society, even John Oliver did a piece on them and their founder Richard Berman. That's just one outlet for their misinformation-campains, they are also cited in lots of blogs and "news articles" as well, so it's not always very obvious.

• nathan-winograd-in-perspective
• nathan-winograd-misinformation-machine

They are the driving power behind all the misinformation and PETA-hate that is spread around. PETA is actually doing a lot for animal rights, that's why they are such a big target for smear campaigns:

• [Their biggest victories] (https://www.peta.org/about-peta/milestones/)
• [All victories sorted by recent] (https://www.peta.org/about-peta/victories/) (several per week!)
• See also http://www.petakillsanimalsscam.com/

PETA and their kill-shelters:

PETA kills animals because unfortunately there are no better places for them. Blame the puppy mills and irresponsible short term owners that give up their pets a few days or weeks after getting them because they had no idea what they got themselves into. Those people create more pets than there are places for them, so instead of having them become strays and further add to the problem, PETA put down those they can't adopt out. Because PETA accepts all animals, even those that other shelters turn away in order to not sully their adoption numbers, PETA shelters end up with many more "hopeless" animals. See more here.

The case of the mistaken dog (and how PETA doesn't steal and murder pets):

A farmer asked PETA to euthanise a pack of stray dogs that were aggressive and violent towards the farmer's cows. Upon arrival, PETA found the pack of stray dogs, took them to the shelter and put them down, as a free service. Unfortunately it turned out, that one of the presumed stray dogs was a pet-chihuaha called Maya, that was not sitting on the porch, as often claimed, but running freely with the stray pack, without leash or collar or supervision. PETA fucked up, because they didn't wait the 5 day grace period to give the owners time to look for and collect their pet. That's why they had to pay a fine and apologized for it. http://www.whypetaeuthanizes.com/maya.html

The monkey selfie:

The monkey took the picture himself btw, the photographer just left the camera lying around. I am not saying the monkey should be copyright holder and it's an open-shut case, but it does raise the question about the photographer having ownership over something that was voluntarily and independently created by an animal. What if a painter would leave his brushes lying around and an animal would create a painting? The artist actually sees it the same way and settled for a compromise with PETA followed by a joint statement. This was a landmark case in copyright law.

PETA equating milk to racism:

White supremacists actually use milk to demonstrate their superiority over "inferior" (their words, obviously) lactose intolerant ethnicities. That's the reason behind their campaign on the issue.

Final thoughts (I promise):

PETA does a good job at raising issues and are one of the most successfull organisations to fight for animal rights. The granting of rights is the only real way to protect animals from unneccessary cruelty. Animal welfare will always be arbitrary, both in what species are worthy of protection, and the extent of protection they are worthy of. You cannot consider yourself an animal lover without recognizing the importance of that.

Sometimes PETA (intentionally?) overshoot, that happens when you try to move the border of current perceptions (i.e. animals are objects to be used for food, clothes, entertainment). I am not here to defend their tone or (lack of) tact, and there are a number of (sometimes downright stupid) PETA-campaigns I disagree with. I'm not trying to convice you to become their friend, but at least judge them for what they are doing, not for what they are said to do.

Most of the criticism of PETA you read on Reddit comes straight from the mouths of the Center for Organizational Research and Education (CORE), formerly known as the Center for Consumer Freedom (CCF). It's basically a corporate propaganda organization with donors like Tyson Foods, Wendy's, and Coca-Cola. They also run campaigns claiming obesity isn't that major of a problem and that you can eat 10 times as much mercury from fish as experts recommend. The vast majority of the animals PETA euthanizes are suffering and are brought to PETA's shelter by their owners specifically to be put out of their misery, but the CCF distorts that into "PETA is stealing people's pets off the streets" and Reddit gobbles it up.

The media also knows that PETA is an easy target. Years ago I read an article in one of the British tabloids (the Sun or the Mirror) with a headline something like, "PETA blasts child's bunny wedding!" But if you actually read the article, what happened is a kid dressed up some bunnies in wedding outfits, the "journalist" reached out to PETA and asked them to comment, and PETA said something like, "we don't support dressing rabbits in costumes because it may be stressful for them." And that was the end of the story, but that wouldn't get clicks so they distorted the headline to make it sound like PETA was protesting or attacking the kid on their own accord.

For the record, I think there are perfectly legitimate criticisms of PETA, like the sexist imagery they use in some of their ad campaigns and their welfarist (as opposed to abolitionist) approach to advocacy. It just gets to me that so many redditors claim to be rational and free-thinking but then read literal corporate propaganda about PETA and swallow it whole without a second thought.

I'm getting the feeling all that shit people say about them is a smear campaign.

The world is burning. Meat has got to go, just like short holidays by plane. And of course a whole bunch of other things. There is very little room to bargain here as we're way behind on our targets.

who gives a shit what you eat

We all should because we share this planet. You should judge a friend who eats steak frequently the same as someone who once in a while chops down a bit of rainforest. The consequences are the same.

The animals that are being eaten, presumably

As one who does not care if the food i eat has meat in it, maybe i can clarify why people react like this. It's simple: you make me feel like i'm some sort of a heartless, evil person for eating meat, i will make you feel bad as well. Eating chicken is murder ? We humans are omnivores, we eat anything. Meat is less efficient land wise, but is more efficient to digest. Morals have nothing to do with it, as we have long evolved to be that way.

If you want people to eat more plants; my advice is to make it a better option. I often make myself a 100% plant pasta sauce, but that takes 3x longer to do and doesn't cost much less then just grilling a piece of meat and cutting a tomato or two. Make cheap tasty vegetarian fast food stalls, cheap mini markets, etc. Calling people murderers will make some of them hate you.

PS I have a vegetarian friend, for over a decade i didn't know he was. Respect his decision, has nothing to do with me.

Not moderating has gone wrong like a bazillion times.

Yes let all the Nazis racists eugenicists etcetera run wild because we don't want to censor based on morality 🥺🥺

You can't expect people in here to have some kind of brain. It's like trying to understand how they want a free (as in freedom) Internet without big tech at the same time they want censorship of their opponents and are lefties.

Ah yes, the food that sounds cute but has deep dark meaning: kill the parents and eat the unborn children.

No no no! It's better to shriek about my hurt little feelings and demand federation or whatever.

I don't know. That feels a bit off-center to me rather than middle considering one end of the spectrum is "kill nothing ever" and the other end is "How many endangered animals can I make extinct just for funsies." If everyone killed what they ate themselves, manually, I bet we'd have a bunch more vegetarians hanging around.

That makes no difference, PETA is still a joke.