The saga on Stack Overflow and Stack Exchange, and how tech always serves the ruling class.
Right now, on Stack Overflow, Luigi Magione’s account has been renamed. Despite having fruitfully contributed to the network he is stripped of his name and his account is now known as “user4616250”.
This appears to violate the creative commons license under which Stack Overflow content is posted.
When the author asked about this:
As of yet, Stack Exchange has not replied to the above post, but they did promptly and within hours gave me a year-long ban for merely raising the question. Of course, they did draft a letter which credited the action to other events that occurred weeks before where I merely upvoted contributions from Luigi and bountied a few of his questions.
"He knew that man was me.
Without a second glance!
That Micky Ds employee spotted me.
The crime stoppers bounty is his chance!
Why should I try to hide?
Why should I go unkown.
When I have come so far.
And struggled for so long?
If I speak, I am condemned.
If I stay silent, they have won!
I am the ceo slayer that got away.
They all are looking at me.
How can I abandon them?
How would they live.
If I am not free?
If I speak, I am condemned.
If I stay silent, I am damned!
Who am I?
Should not this wage slave benefit.
Pretend I do not feel his agony.
This innocent who can be set free.
Who else should face their judgment.
Who am I?
Can I conceal myself for evermore?
Pretend I am the man I was before?
And hide my crime until I die.
Be no more than an alibi?
Must I lie?
How can I ever face my fellow men?
How can I ever face myself again?
My fate belongs to capitlism, I know.
I made that bargain long ago.
I gave them hope when hope was gone.
I gave them strength to journey on.
[He appears in front of the court]
Who am I? Who am I?
I'm Luigi!
[He unbuttons his shirt to reveal the scares of a botched surgery]
And so UHC, you see it's true.
This man bears no more guilt than you!
Who am I?
I've read it is still well valued because people will keep asking questions there when LLM can't answer, so they remain a precious source of post LLM curated Q&A.
The submission has been clearly penalized by hn moderators: Posted 3h ago, upvoted >600 times with almost 500 comments, ranking 23rd on the front page. Ranking first currently is a submission with 80 upvotes, posted 1h ago.
Even if the 13% number were accurate - that's a pretty damning number. 13% of people supporting someone for gunning down a CEO in cold blood is terrifying to CEOs.
That's not 13% hating them. That's 13% of people celebrating someone for killing them. No lawsuits. No trials. Just gunning them down in the streets. Things have gotten really bad when you have that much of the population actively supporting your murder.
This is the only solution to modern world problems. Imagine how many problems we would solve right away if we started gunning down powerful people, CEOs, politicians.
That 13% would also be people who would openly admit to supporting his actions. There are a lot of people who condemn his actions publicly but in their own minds...?
Lmao it has 3x as many votes as anything else on HN but the moderated pushed it all the way down to page 3 (position 60-something when I just checked).
What can Stack Overflow's motivation possibly be to strip Luigi's account? Are their private equity owners in cahoots with health insurance executives?
It's pretty standard when a highly-publicized murder suspect's online profiles are discovered. Platform admins will typically disable/hide their accounts from the public while investigations/trials are ongoing. This is hardly unique to Luigi.
Do you have other examples? Because the article gave an example of a similar account that was not anonynized like this. Sure, accounts are often taken down, but the content isn't left up.
I'm starring this cause I want to look into this myself, and if I find any technical sources that address this claim and actually detail this as a SOP, I'll reply with that source later, or otherwise reply with "I didn't find anything."
That's not what the article is about. Stack Overflow has kept content that Luigi created up, but removed his username, in violation of Creative Commons. Edited the post to make that more clear.
I know I am. I'm so sick of this system they've created and perpetuated for decades/centuries. I just want to live my fucking life without worrying about basic needs, or how someone with most can take even more from those who have little. Americans have more guns per capita than almost anywhere else. Those are guns in the hands of the people, not mercs or armies or private security. They should be afraid of us. They should be checking their car's undercarriage daily before getting in. They should vary their routes daily to avoid patterns. They should see every person on the street as a potential assassin. Only THEN, will anything about these parasites' attitudes change.
Unfortunately, so many with the skills to engage in revolution are aligned with the interests of these corporate leeches, and thus are fighting the masses, instead of standing with them. They wanted a Civil War #2, it's time to kick up, not down!
On Stack Exchange, all of the contributions on the site are contributed under a license maintained by a third party called Creative Commons [...] the work remains properly attributed.
The presumption or admission of guilt does not and should not justify violating the Creative Commons License, nor perpetrating any illegal behavior agains any individual(s).
If JK Rowling went out and robbed a bank, or murdered an ex-Husband, in no world or timeline would that give a member of her publishing company the right to scratch out her name from any of her books and replace it with their own or someone else's.
"Censorship forced me to flee a pro-nazi site to another pro-nazi site," is a contradiction worth noting. It highlights the general pro-nazi vibe going around big tech.
As of yet, Stack Exchange has not replied to the above post, but they did promptly and within hours gave me a year-long ban for merely raising the question.
Laws mean nothing anymore. Therefore licenses mean nothing. Therefore ownership means nothing, and "theft" no longer exists.
Therefore ownership means nothing, and “theft” no longer exists.
WOAH WOAH WOAH... hold on there Circuitfarmer (checks clipboard) It says here you're not nearly affluent enough to circumvent the law... we'll be keeping a close eye on you... --BB
I managed to convince my brother in law by using the wrongful death case of Kanokporn Tangsuan as an example. Framed it as his moral responsibility to never sign up for any digital media ever again since he has a family. I pointed him to a few resources to sail the high seas and he's got his high seas pc hooked up to his TV and cancelled all his subscriptions. I'm so proud.
In my experience it’s usually the magats who are the ones defending asshole and/or immoral behavior by pointing out that the offender is acting within the bounds of the law or within their legal rights.
“No wars but class wars” as true today as when Trotsky said it many decades ago.
Not sure how anyone cannot see this very, very clear fact, made self evident by the treatment of Luigi and the composition of the upcoming administration and its supporters.
But every other commoner that sees it needs to take according measures.
True, although it may also be "good things" done by person do not outweigh "bad thing" done by person. I'm sure there's a name for that.
Like human experimentation. Yes, bad, shouldn't be done, outright illegal, immoral, inhumane, but has been done. Should we discard the scientific results?
I also stopped posting there years ago for much the same reason. You could feel the strangulation of the community as duplicate questions started getting shouted down, posts got turned into "community wikis" against your will and your own questions started getting edited to better fit someone else's plans and ideologies. The company was sold shortly after, so maybe animals can sense their pending extinction (some of them anyway)?
I miss those days when writing an answer genuinely felt like helping to grow the global community of friend developers. It's a shame no technology has been discovered that will let the small amount of collective good in us all work together against the assholes, but alas it seems the opposite is always true.
What's even more annoying is when their refinements end up putting an objectively wrong answer as the authoritative record.
I found a question where someone new to electronics was how to get more current from a USB power supply.
The "correct" answer that was posted before the question was closed was that a source can't limit current and the questioner should learn more about electricity.
The actual correct answer - and probably what the questioner was looking for - is to short the data lines together because a compliant USB charger will only supply 500mA by default, not it's stated max current.
The company was sold shortly after, so maybe animals can sense their pending extinction (some of them anyway)?
More likely the changes were made to improve the "saleability" of the website.
I miss those days when writing an answer genuinely felt like helping to grow the global community of friend developers.
One of the promises of the internet was, supposedly, that it couldn't really be monopolized because the barriers to entry were so low. But what we've seen is the influence of the Networking Effect as a means of consolidating user bases, combined with a cartel-style censorship that limits the degree to which word-of-mouth can influence a nascent community's growth.
And now the AI comes to fully alienate us from each other, leaving even the more token communities with a "am I talking to a real person or a computer facsimile" lingering dread with each passing year.
your own questions started getting edited to better fit someone else's plans and ideologies
That hits hard for me. Not that someone changed the spirit of my answer but that someone completely reworded it without my permission. It was almost like they were trying to steal my idea without running afoul of copyright or something.
It's 40% assholes
People who delete
"Hi,"
From the first line of the question
Because a modicum of politeness and humanity is inefficient
And don't get me started about the XY problem solvers
Stack exchange gamifies rudeness and dismissiveness.
the entirety of stackoverflow is not enough data to make the AI work properly. They need terabytes of text, stackoverflow has about 50-100GB of useful data at most
What if I told you that television shows were dangerous? It's true. In the year 2000, four out of every five injuries occurred in a home that owned a VHS copy of Robocop III. Someone might say, "That's compelling Robocorrelation, but that data alone does not suggest Robocausation." Fine. But maybe your first instinct was to say, "Robocop III is a movie, not a TV show, you fucking dumbass." If so, then congratulations, idiot, you're a Technical Genius. You're smart enough to spot a technicality, but too dumb to know everyone else did too and it was light years away from the point. You're the kind of person who tells your doctor, "Um, it's Chief Chirpa?" when he tells you that getting the Wicket doll out of your asshole will require surgery. "And, um," you'll add, "it's an action figure? Maybe you should have gone to a non-stupid medical school."
The nice thing about being a Technical Genius is that it feels like proof you're smarter than everyone. They can say you don't "get it" all day, but they're the imbeciles who think Robocop III is a TV show. Look at it like this: You are the only one in the history of Koala Times Bus Tours to contract syphilis from a koala bite. You might be embarrassed, but at least you aren't like those other fools screaming "Don't touch the koala bears!" when they are in fact marsupials. I mean, if koalas were actual bears, your whole face would be missing, not still here and covered in pulsing chancres.
Technical Geniuses reach maximum annoying when they decide that pointing out technicalities is a sense of humor. For instance, if you announced, "My wife is pregnant and we're having a boy," a Technical Genius might quip, "Well, technically only women can have babies. Unless you count the Chief Chirpa action figure currently breaching my anus -- um, which you should, since it is the dictionary definition. Heard of it? Hey, everyone! This idiot with no dictionary is watching me shit out a Chief Chirpa, and he doesn't even know which gender gives birth!"
I've looked into this but they aren't exactly small, it's not a straightforward operation for even the average developer or systems engineer to restore these into a working format.
I was thinking we need something along the lines of a read only public mirror run by the proper open source community - e.g. SourceForge or a major Linux project.. ISP's and universities offer mirrors of Linux packages so this could be a resource offered in the same vein. That's my line of thinking as far as a StackOverflow mirror goes anyway!
The next thing seems to be the discord (or any instant messenger ) channel for the project. That's my wild guess. I don't like it but looks like people are shifting from the web to instant communicators, so the knowledge is not perserved.
Thanks AI
The second amendment means I am my own chief executive and commander in chief of my own military. I authorize my own act of self-defense in response to a hostile entity making war on me and my family.
Nelson Mandela says no form of violence can be excused. Camus says it’s all the same, whether you live or die or have a cup of coffee. MLK says violence never brings permanent peace. Gandhi says that non-violence is the mightiest power available to mankind.
That’s who they tell you are heroes. That’s who our revolutionaries are. Yet is that not capitalistic? Non-violence keeps the system working at full speed ahead.
What did it get us. Look in the mirror.
They want us to be non-violent, so that they can grow fat off the blood they take from us.
The only way out is through. Not all of us will make it. Each of us is our own chief executive. You have to decide what you will tolerate.
In Gladiator 1 Maximus cuts into the military tattoo that identifies him as part of the roman legion. His friend asks “Is that the sign of your god?” As Maximus carves deeper into his own flesh, as his own blood drips down his skin, Maximus smiles and nods yes. The tattoo represents the emperor, who is god. The god emperor has made himself part of Maximus’s own flesh. The only way to destroy the emperor is to destroy himself. Maximus smiles through the pain because he knows it is worth it.
These might be my last words. I don’t know when they will come for me. I will resist them at any cost. That’s why I smile through the pain.
They diagnosed my mother with severe neuropathy when she was forty-one years old.
She said it started ten years before that with burning sensations in her feet and occasional sharp stabbing pains. At first the pain would last a few moments, then fade to tingling, then numbness, then fade to nothing a few days later.
The first time the pain came she ignored it. Then it came a couple times a year and she ignored it. Then every couple months. Then a couple times a month. Then a couple times a week. At that point by the time the tingling faded to numbness, the pain would start, and the discomfort was constant.
At that point even going from the couch to the kitchen to make her own lunch became a major endeavor
She started with ibuprofen, until the stomach aches and acid reflux made her switch to acetaminophen. Then the headaches and barely sleeping made her switch back to ibuprofen.
The first doctor said it was psychosomatic. Nothing was wrong. She needed to relax, destress, sleep more.
The second doctor said it was a compressed nerve in her spine. She needed back surgery. It would cost $180,000. Recovery would be six months minimum before walking again. Twelve months for full potential recovery, and she would never lift more than ten pounds of weight again.
The third doctor performed a Nerve Conduction Study, Electromyography, MRI, and blood tests. Each test cost $800 to $1200. She hit the $6000 deductible of her UnitedHealthcare plan in October. Then the doctor went on vacation, and my mother wasn’t able to resume tests until January when her deductible reset.
The tests showed severe neuropathy. The $180,000 surgery would have had no effect.
They prescribed opioids for the pain. At first the pain relief was worth the price of constant mental fog and constipation. She didn’t tell me about that until later. All I remember is we took a trip for the first time in years, when she drove me to Monterey to go to the aquarium. I saw an otter in real life, swimming on its back. We left at 7am and listened to Green Day on the four-hour car ride. Over time, the opioids stopped working. They made her MORE sensitive to pain, and she felt withdrawal symptoms after just two or three hours.
Then gabapentin. By now the pain was so bad she couldn’t exercise, which compounded the weight gain from the slowed metabolic rate and hormonal shifts. And it barely helped the pain, and made her so fatigued she would go an entire day without getting out of bed.
Then Corticosteroids. Which didn’t even work.
The pain was so bad I would hear my mother wake up in the night screaming in pain. I would run into her room, asking if she’s OK. Eventually I stopped getting up. She’d yell out anguished shrieks of wordless pain or the word “fuck” stretched and distended to its limits. I’d turn over and go back to sleep.
All of this while they bled us dry with follow-up appointment after follow-up appointment, specialist consultations, and more imagine scans. Each appointment was promised to be fully covered, until the insurance claims were delayed and denied. Allopathic medicine did nothing to help my mother’s suffering. Yet it is the foundation of our entire society.
My mother told me that on a good day the nerve pain was like her legs were immersed in ice water. On a bad day it felt like her legs were clamped in a machine shop vice, screwed down to where the cranks stopped turning, then crushed further until her ankle bones sprintered and cracked to accommodate the tightening clamp. She had more bad days than good.
My mother crawled to the bathroom on her hands and knees. I slept in the living room to create more distance from her cries in the night. I still woke up, and still went back to sleep.
Back then I thought there was nothing I could do.
The high copays made consistent treatment impossible. New treatments were denied as “not medically necessary.” Old treatments didn’t work, and still put us out for thousands of dollars.
UnitedHealthcare limited specialist consultations to twice a year.
Then they refused to cover advanced imaging, which the specialists required for an appointment.
Prior authorizations took weeks, then months.
UnitedHealthcare constantly changed their claim filing procedure. They said my mother’s doctor needed to fax his notes. Then UnitedHealthcare said they did not save faxed patient correspondence, and required a hardcopy of the doctor’s typed notes to be mailed. Then they said they never received the notes. They were unable to approve the claim until they had received and filed the notes.
They promised coverage, and broke their word to my mother.
With every delay, my anger surged. With every denial, I wanted to throw the doctor through the glass wall of their hospital waiting room.
But it wasn’t them. It wasn’t the doctors, the receptionists, administrators, pharmacists, imaging technicians, or anyone we ever met. It was UnitedHealthcare.
People are dying. Evil has become institutionalized. Corporations make billions of dollars off the pain, suffering, death, and anguished cries in the night of millions of Americans.
We entered into an agreement for healthcare with a legally binding contract that promised care commensurate with our insurance payments and medical needs. Then UnitedHealthcare changes the rules to suit their own profits. They think they make the rules, and think that because it’s legal that no one can punish them.
They think there’s no one out there who will stop them.
Now my own chronic back pain wakes me in the night, screaming in pain. I sought out another type of healing that showed me the real antidote to what ails us.
I bide my time, saving the last of my strength to strike my final blows. All extractors must be forced to swallow the bitter pain they deal out to millions.
As our own chief executives, it’s our obligation to make our own lives better. First and foremost, we must seek to improve our own circumstances and defend ourselves. As we do so, our actions have ripple effects that can improve the lives of others.
Rules exist between two individuals, in a network that covers the entire earth. Some of these rules are written down. Some of these rules emerge from natural respect between two individuals. Some of these rules are defined in physical laws, like the properties of gravity, magnetism or the potential energy stored in the chemical bonds of potassium nitrate.
No single document better encapsulates the belief that all people are equal in fundamental worth and moral status and the frameworks for fostering collective well-being than the US constitution.
Writing a rule down makes it into a law. I don’t give a fuck about the law. Law means nothing. What does matter is following the guidance of our own logic and what we learn from those before us to maximize our own well-being, which will then maximize the well-being of our loved ones and community.
That’s where UnitedHealthcare went wrong. They violated their contract with my mother, with me, and tens of millions of other Americans. This threat to my own health, my family’s health, and the health of our country’s people requires me to respond with an act of war.
END
Edit: Paragraph spacing may not be original from the Subtack post.
From what I understand, that's not the real manifesto. That's supposedly a fake one that was circulated shortly after his real "manifesto" was posted by Ken Klippenstein, and which has supposedly been confirmed by law enforcement: https://www.kenklippenstein.com/p/luigis-manifesto
That is the one he had on his person when he was arrested. The Stack Overflow one is not so much a manifesto as a testament, a recounting of his experience. And an understandable motivation for his actions.
I was aware claims have been made against it. But there is so much conflicting information, that I will leave it up.
Last time I read this from Klippenstein it was from someone disregarding another "manifesto" that had been circulating around. So much confusion to be had.
I am a little tired of the idea that "tech" is something extraordinary. Capitalists in a capitalist society will do all evil to fulfill their goal, t3ch or no tech. You could use the same sentence in everything in this society. Even: "... and how green energy always serves the ruling class."
I had 40k points on SO though I no longer contribute. Stackexchange is basically dead because it's a for-profit with very poor direction and LLMs basically made the entire thing obsolete relative to the monetary growths it needs to be sustainable. Understandably they can't attract any attention like this as they're 🤏 from going under.
I feel a bit sad for stackexchange but they are stuck between a rock and a hard place. I think stackexchange has their days numbered tho so this is realy not all that relevant. Give them a year or two tops
How will AI learn without human posted questions and answers. Docs for most software are abysmal. In a few years, people dependent on AI to code will be in real trouble with anything new.
Yeah I doubt it tbh. I loved my time with stackoverflow and it landed me jobs and friends but I'm quite bullish when it comes IT and AI. It's not replacing devs yet but definitely replacing q&a, debugging tools, code reviews etc already/soon.
I hope we'll have some open social coding experience like SO but trends seem to point towards more private stuff like coaching, bookcamps, shitty discord servers etc. as that's the only thing that can be funded sustainably.
Here's a fun fact I just recently came across. In the medieval times when the church wanted to remove a heretic, someone who was speaking out in opposition to church doctrine, they would burn those people at the stake. The reason they would do this was not because this was a common practice to burn people at the stake but in order to prevent relics of the heretics from being collected and giving their followers something to rally around.
I think Luigi's Stack Overflow history is a relic of his existence and something people could rally around and the powerful don't want that to exist.
what does this have to do with dividing us? i mean they're both not close to me. they're both wealthy people from well off families. i think instead of donating a bunch of money to him, people should start donating to people facing vast sums of medical debt.