Women and LGBTQ+ people take up guns after Trump’s win: ‘We need to protect ourselves’
National gun clubs field an influx of newcomers interested in learning how to shoot firearms for self-defense
I do not blame any woman or queer person arming themselves in the U.S. right now. But I think that you should think of it as personal protection rather than preparation for something larger.
Be aware of this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disarmament_of_the_German_Jews
The Jews of Germany constituted less than 1 percent of the country's population. It is preposterous to argue that the possession of firearms would have enabled them to mount resistance against a systematic program of persecution implemented by a modern bureaucracy, enforced by a well-armed police state, and either supported or tolerated by the majority of the German population. Mr. Carson's suggestion that ordinary Germans, had they had guns, would have risked their lives in armed resistance against the regime simply does not comport with the regrettable historical reality of a regime that was quite popular at home. Inside Germany, only the army possessed the physical force necessary for defying or overthrowing the Nazis, but the generals had thrown in their lot with Hitler early on.
Obviously, women and queer people are a lot more than 1% of the population, but you can't count on every queer person being on the right side and you certainly can't count on every woman to be on the right side.
The second amendment was not made for personal protection
It was also opposed by George Washington on the argument that "A bunch of farmers with guns will never defeat a trained army." He basically did exactly that, but it took the support of one of the world's largest super powers at the time in order to do it - France.
Not to say don't arm yourself. I plan on doing exactly that myself. But don't expect to be overthrowing the dictatorship to come. There are no resistance groups being armed by the EU here.
that was before tanks and instant communication. the army would have been less organized and maybe you could have a chance against the government, especially as a militia. today you don't.
you do have a chance against a bunch of fuckwads who threaten you because the party they voted for won and the think they can rape freely now. just not the government.
It's not about mounting an organized resistance. It's about making the black bag squads scared of coming to your house specifically.
When the chips are down, nobody's got your back like you do.
As an alternative, if we assume that a significant portion of the left is armed instead of just a minority, Rojava would be a good modern day example of the realistic effectiveness of an armed populace, as they employ horizontal citizen militias to survive against both ISIS and Turkey.
The Spanish Civil War is another interesting example, as the initial response from the left/anarchists when the fascists began their coup attempt was made up of civilian militias formed quickly and armed with whatever they had or could source from a local armory, and they were able to effectively fight off the initial coup in almost half the country, and gather themselves up for a protracted conflict. It's not quite as direct an example, as the leftists in that conflict we supplemented with tanks and airplanes and artillery from the USSR, but firearms were an essential piece to their resistance, and had the populace been more armed before hand, it would've been helpful, as they had trouble producing and acquiring enough through trade.
There's a great series on the Spanish Civil War here that gets into the nitty gritty, if you're interested. :)
With sentiment like "your body, my choice" floating around more and more, I hope that everyone in need will arm themselves accoringly.
Because the guys on the other guys think they are made of steel. Remind them that they have a lot of very vulnerable blood vessels close to the skin and that knifes are as cheap as their lies...
Jessie McGrath, 63, a lifelong Republican who is trans, grew up around guns on farms in Colorado and Nebraska. She decided to vote for Harris when Republicans started attacking gender-affirming care and “wanting to basically outlaw my ability to exist”. She ended up being a delegate at the Democratic national convention.
“Government getting involved in making healthcare decisions is something that I never thought I would see the Republican party doing,” she said.
What the actual...how are people this ignorant.
She was 100% on board with them regulating reproductive care because it has never personally affected her as a biological male.
She only has an issue now that her favorite team turned on her after telling her for the last 30 years that she's next.
Assigned male at birth is the term you want to use. "Biological male" is a term used by transphobes to spread misinformation.
Biology is very complex and not your elementary school version of biology. What makes someone "biologically" male? Is it having a penis, having testis, having more testosterone than estrogen, having XY chromosomes? These can all be intermixed with other characteristics.
The "basic biology" definition doesn't work in the real world, and the people using it are actively trying to harm trans people or ignorant. Now you're more informed so ignorance isn't an excuse anymore.
You know how some cis people are fucking morons? We won’t better than y’all.
The left needs to get on board with this. Govt isn’t going to protect you from far right militias when the shit hits the fan.
Cops aren't required to protect you from anything. Learn how to protect you and yours. And learn how to read situations, always.
Not advocating anything, but there's a "it could happen here" podcast episode for leftists out there, with some really good info.
AR-15 is a very good gun to get unless you're in a state like CA. Shotgun sare good too, Mossberg is fairly affordable(btw, you still need to aim with shotguns). Glock 19 for a pistol, just know pistols are harder to use and you will need to train with it more.
I like shotguns, but I don't think they're a great defensive tool. Even with massive extenders on the magazine tube, you are getting a max of 8 shots, and reloading quickly is a pipe dream unless you are one of the very few, very highly practiced competition shooters.
Can confirm, my wife has expressed an interest. We're just waiting for the local LGBTQ friendly range to open.
The other local ranges are either run by cops (ACAB) or require NRA memberships to join. Yeah, that's not happening.
Sometimes you have to open the gun range you wish to see in your neighborhood.
Or something like that. I think Gandhi said it.
Hey, you're in PDX, right? Do you have recommendations?
The one we're waiting on is called Wooster Armory in Tigard/Beaverton. Kinda by Washington Square, by the Guitar Center. The gunshop is open, but it looks like they're having trouble getting the range open. I'm going to pop in and say "Hi!" today and see what the deal is.
Threat Dynamics in Sherwood is good too, I did my AR training there.
Edit Wooster is now saying January for members, February for the public.
As a fellow PDXer this is valuable information.
Fascinating business opportunity, queer gun shops.
Im a liberal guess who now has a gun safe with multiple guns?
I guess we are making America great again by arming the liberals too?
Fucking FINALLY.
Yes, women should be armed. Gay people should be armed. Trans people should be armed. Religious minorities should be armed. People that are on the political left never should have ceded the right to keep and bear arms to the political right.
I'm planning on getting certified as a firearms instructor through the NRA (because no matter how shitty the NRA-ILA is, the training programs are solid) this coming year so that I can start working with The Pink Pistols and Operation Blazing Spear.
I would strongly suggest that people try reading This Nonviolence Stuff'll Get You Killed: How Guns Made the Civil Rights Movement Possible.
If you're one of the people that is considering getting a gun, please listen to the "It Could Happen Here" podcast episode titled, Safe Gun Ownership.
I need a plugin like DownThemAll to just add every book on that page (including "Customers also bought...) to my Goodreads want to read.
Narrative nonfiction has become my jam. New favorite category, especially history.
This would be a genuinely enriching good read for me. Thanks for the good stuff.
Remember that step 2 is to practice!
The whole Russian project was to have our "polite society" collapse as we, as Americans, lost all faith in our institutions and turned against one another and in the process, also lost any kind of collective identity, which makes us a weaker target externally. That happened.
It's crazy to me, looking back, how much this was openly discussed along the way, as it successfully happened in slow motion over the last 10-15 years - wasn't there also a book released that just laid their strategy bare? If there are historians in the future, will be amazing to read the perspective on all of this with time and analysis from those not trapped within the cycle of death and hopelessness.
It works because those of us who read and learn about things like this are a minority of the population. Not one large enough to counteract the effect either.
I think our society in reality is fine mostly; gun sales to conservatives under the Obama administration surged due to their fears at the time; now it happens again just in reverse.
The key problem is that the internet is separating people and allowing foreign actors and cynical domestic interests to create filters of what people hear and see.
you count yourself among a learned few then you should go out and create local events and spread local news as much as possible. People need to interact outside of their bubbles more and they would come to see mostly that they are both reasonable. It is only the facts that are current in question between the two isles, not necessarily the principles.
Yes it is called the foundations of geopolitics, written by Aleksandr Dugin. Its free to read on the internet archive.
Cult tactics. You get your targets to alienate themselves from the rest of society, their friends and family. You get them isolated and then you become their family. It's a mix of Republican think tanks and Democrats taking advantage of whatever the other side is. Abortion, LGBTQ, Racism. Obviously bad actors from across the globe have stoked the fires and accelerated it, but it's been a political tactic since forever. Competing interests do exist, but not at the societal level. Political actors have convinced the religious that they are being oppressed by the "other side" and that they should be able to spread their ideas because they see other groups having their ideas being imposed on people. In reality out groups such as LGBTQ want the equal rights those religious people enjoy,. It's just been taken to an extreme because it's a divisive topic and religious conservatives have been told that their manufactured beliefs are wrong. In reality, they should support those out groups because they enjoy the constitutional protection that those groups are asking for.
Guns!, the cause and solution to most of America's problems.
Nah, man, the ultimate cause is always anti-black racism.
Along with weaponized religion and stupidity of course
Stay strapped or get clapped...
It feels like they picked the worst screenshot intentionally though when talking about that YouTuber...
Like, maybe it's a new kind of magnifier that you flip up to use instead of off to the side to not use. But that AR just doesn't look like whoever built it knew what they were doing.
Like the BLM protests where it was obvious people went out and bought ARs just for the event and didn't even put sights on beforehand.
That being said don't wander around gun YouTube on your account it only takes a couple videos for the algorithm to decide you're a gun nut, and that comes along with a bunch of other rightwing videos, because normally it does.
But Reagan is the one who passed Cali's gun laws, and he did so because people he didn't like were marching with guns.
Obviously it would have made more sense to start when Biden was in office, but it seems like unless protestors carry guns, the cops will just beat them without a second thought.
If they even think some have guns tho... Cops won't do shit.
If cops get return fire in a (leftist) protest/riot, they'll come back with MRAPs and live rounds and re-enact Kent State. They live for that moment.
Oh, and that magnifier is on a Unity FAST mount, and yes, it flips up to get in position. It's on a higher sight plane along with the Eotech to help with shooting while using things like night vision goggles, and a lot of people say it's more natural and comfortable for fast shooting in general. It's actually some Gucci shit and looks squared away to me.
Weird, I never saw one of those before, but if it works it's way better than hanging off to the side.
And I think you're forgetting how much cops are cowards. They won't go into a school when it's one kid with an AR and they have a seat team.
They'll say they want a firefight all fucking day, when they get the opportunity they shit their pants.
But we know how they treat unarmed protestors, and the difference when there's guns present.
Checking 2 boxes out of 4 from the Libertarian dream
I have a conundrum, maybe people in this thread can weigh in.
I'm a woman living in an area with a small but loud MAGA faction and useless police who are probably also Trump supporters. I'm also not white.
Hunting is common here, and although I've never been I do know how to shoot and have access to classes if I want to improve. We also have friends and family with firearms and a couple of them live nearby.
I feel like I should get a gun. I know how to use one and I want to be able to protect myself if necessary. But I'm scared of firearms. Something about them disturbs me. Maybe it's the likelihood of someone dying once a gun comes out. Maybe it's just a fear, however unfounded, that I can't or shouldn't handle such a powerful tool. But the reason behind the feeling doesn't matter so much as my ability to overcome it, and I'm not sure I can. If I had money to burn I'd buy one just to see how I feel, but I don't so I can't.
In short, I'm torn. I want to be able to just get a gun for peace of mind and call it a day, but I fear that as soon as the gun is in my house I will become a nervous wreck and that will defeat the whole purpose.
I'd love to hear from anyone who feels the same or has overcome this fear.
Training and familiarization helped me a lot with that exact feeling. I had the same feeling about circular/table saws. My dad was a carpenter, and those things freaked me the hell out - one tiny mistake could have devastating consequences, and that was all I could think about when I was around them. But with careful instruction and exposure, learing to use and be more comfortable with them, that feeling was gradually replaced by calm and confidence, and they changed in my mind from these objects of terror into valuable tools. There was still fear, but it was a healthy, respectful fear.
I went through the exact same process with guns as well. Some classes with a good instructor, giving you a chance to get more comfortable and familiar before you bring a gun into your home, could help a lot.
Everything you're describing is completely reasonable. For the past decades, left-wing "policy ideas" have floated banning guns or at least some form of gun control. They state statistics, examples from other countries, testimony from gun experts, etc etc all describing how perfectly harmful just owning a gun can be and how unlikely you are to ever run into a situation where a firearm will improve your situation and chances of surviving.
This has been overtaken by the rhetoric of "they're coming for you!tm". The exact same playbook that was used by the right-wing. Who wins? The gun manufacturers and war profiteers.
It's amazing to see the collective consciousness just completely glaze over from just a few years ago. If you think you're statistically more likely to be targeted, then it's your right to procure a firearm in the United States and I'll leave it at that. But, if you actually look into it, you'll find you will be put more in danger by having a firearm in the house than not.
You're right about the mental aspect, if you own a firearm and are constantly thinking about it and the threats it can protect you from, you've created your own hellscape that many are already in. It's much safer and better for the community to be involved in your neighbors lives and to form bonds with those close to you in a positive manner. Somehow, everyone's forgotten the examples the rest of the world has set forth and have fallen into Americana again.
It's definitely a mind fuck, going from "I support heavy gun control and don't ever want one in my house" to "this might be the single best way to protect myself from violent fascists, should they come after me."
I'm very involved in my community, but I live in a purple county and these days I am also feeling very outnumbered. It's tough to essentially be in a holding pattern waiting for retribution that we've been told to expect.
It's just tough, all around.
Take a reputable course and learn about guns. They are dangerous in the hands of irresponsible untrained yokels but if you are smart and informed they can empower you and safeguard your well being.
Guns have traditionally been a pacifier for anxious right-wing weirdos who are afraid of Nancy Pelosi, but they are also a good hedge against those right-wing weirdos and will be a pacifier for your anxiety about them
I don't own a gun and feel the same as you. I am leaning toward getting a gun safe and keeping the gun and ammo locked up and hidden. If it gathers dust that's great, but having it there if I need it would be a comfort I think.
You do not want to have a gun that you're not comfortable with. Having to deal with a high stress situation and then trying to use a gun when you don't have brain-dead levels of familiarity with it is asking the trouble. Luckily it's fairly cheap to build most of the muscle-memory with dry-fire and handling drills. But if you plan on using it for home defense or personal protection, you need to be prepared so that your mind can focus on other things during your troubles.
A thing to maybe consider is to get a subscription at a range and check out a rental firearm to plink on the range. You lose some money in the experience like going to a movie or whatever, but you're not out the full price of the firearm. Then you can decide how you feel. Granted, active fire is much different than object that sits on shelf. They're quite docile when stationary. Even so, it's just psychologically weird normalizing the thought of, "I have a device on this shelf that has only one purpose, to delete life." Sure, hammers, nailguns, knives, etc. can be used for killing, but they have a useful primary purpose. Guns don't.
Yeah I've been considering that, but I'm not sure the ranges near me are women friendly spaces and I don't think I'm in the right head space to voluntarily push into a male dominated space like that. I wonder if there's a good way to screen potential ranges, should I just come straight out and ask if they're welcoming?
Having a life ending device just "sitting on the shelf" is definitely my biggest issue. I have an ex who would threaten to kill himself whenever our relationship was on the rocks, and while my husband is a very stable person I still have a hard time shaking the feeling that weapons+men=bad news. Though I asked if he was comfortable with me having a gun safe that he cannot unlock and he said he supports whatever is going to make me feel safest atm.
I just hate that this is where we are.
Lol, this thread is a train wreck and is the perfect example of why Republicans keep winning elections despite being on the wrong side of history and having policies that hurt the American population at large.
The left will never win as long as we form circular firing squads and argue over petty bullshit.
firing squads
You need guns for that.
lol
why do you think the guns are pointed in a circle
Triangles are too pointy
Because the whole “I need a gun now” reaction is just people trying to assuage the fear and uncertainty of the future. While there will continue to be random violence against minorities and lgtbq, the predominant way they will be hurt going forward is via policy. Policy that marginalizes them. Arming up because you think right wing mobs are going to enact a pogrom against you is no different than right wing nuts arming up because they think a caravan of criminal mexicans is heading toward the border. Don’t fall into the trap of thinking you are “in control” because you took a shooting class and bought a pistol. When we are afraid we naturally want to “do something” about it. But as soon as you reach for a weapon you’ve lost.
I like how your comment is the perfect example of the behavior that you claim to oppose. You're cutting into the left while identifying yourself as left, and everything you wrote was destructive. Congratulations?
There are several reasonable positions that a person could take on this issue. You could point out the entertainment in increased calls for gun regulation. You could point out the consistency with saying that you're going to arm yourself as long as guns are legal, but also be in favor of increased gun regulation. You could point out that there are different factions within the Democratic party and on the left in general, and how people all have their own varying agendas. You could encourage a general strategy for Democrats and Democrat supporters to get along. But you did none of that, because you didn't care. And I don't mind if you care, but I want other people to see it, just in case they do.
Or you could understand that "gun ownership" and "gun regulation" are not incompatible concepts, despite NRA/Russian propaganda to the contrary.
I also noticed the destructiveness, thanks for pointing all this out!
So very much this.
Good. Gun rights are human rights. All people have the right to defend themselves and those around them. Taking that away by banning the only tool that evens the playing field is not OK.
You mean Americans, not people. This is not a normal thing in the rest of the world, only America.
You mean the country that has more guns than people has a gun problem?? No fuckin way.
I defend myself with a tiger and feed it highschool kids. Statistically, I'm an insignificant lunatic.
This is the blue conservative version of "your body, my choice". Well that and the bipartisan war on drugs.
Now playing The War On Drugs - I don't live here anymore
We as leftists, must organize in ways that match the fascists. Subversion of their goals is our goal. The class and culture war is in full effect and we must not be complacent.
Nothing gets republicans talking about gun control faster than minorities arming.
Ive had one for a while. It's not something I hope to ever use, but now it's less likely that an armed person will be coming after me for my money, which I can just give and not have to kill to defend myself, and more likely they're coming for my life.
ah i see Aleksandr Dugin's book is coming along as he planned.
Time to get out of this country.
Own a corporation that owns all of your property. Have many guns. It's the American way.
Why are Americans answers to everything guns? So much paranoia and mental health issues in this country it's insane.
Well, we can't effectively ban guns. At least not in our foreseeable political future. And the people who are already armed are overwhelmingly voting to elect a fascist who likes to incite violence among minority groups.......... It's kinda easy to see why people would want to arm themselves.
I mean rapists, transphobes, bigots, and neo Nazis all now feel carte blanche freedom to do whatever they please in this country. There will absolutely be more crimes against women, LGBTQ+, minorities, and liberals. Not arming yourself against these animals is the insane thing.
If you look at the one side of the political spectrum that seems to be usurping power over here, they fucking LOVE guns. It wouldnt surprise me that if they got violent, it would be armed heavily with firearms. This is the exact response i would expect from would be victims of aforementioned gun violence. in the words of my constituion and bible humping american brethren, we shall NOT BE VICTIM TO A TYRANNICAL STATE!
What would you suggest? I have three trans friends who are making plans to move, at least for a few years, but not everyone can do that.
It's me, another trans who is actively applying to move out of the US. If I were staying here I'd be arming myself too even though I hate everything about guns. I've been voting, protesting, community aid, talking with people I know, building relations with my neighbors, it's all backsliding anyway. Not a lot of options left for me
Feuer frei!
Me months ago: "the NRA matters and feminism matters and the solution is making sure women have more and larger guns and better tactical training."
Everyone back then was like "no guns are bad!" and now suddenly, look who is seeing the light.
Trans people should not be armed. Trans people should be given vouchers to buy large amounts of weapons so they can be HEAVILY armed and also should be given subsidized weapons training by the government.
When I meet a trans women, I want to admire her dress and know she has excellent tactical training.
We need to stop seeing gun rights as a left or right issue and appreciate the fact that guns are anti-tyranny. The left's constant anti-stance alienates a huge number of working class people as well. The problem with any sort of "reasonable restrictions" is the government always wants more, more regulation, more rules, and little by little it gets harder for the average guy or gal or intersex person. Liberals need to stop alienating middle America with this anti-gun stuff so we can protect trans people.
Too bad they didn't take up voting before Trump's loss...
'Cause nothing solves a gun problem like more guns**
** I am a gun owner for the exact reasons cited in the article.
America, can we stop it with the guns and violence?
I get the idea of wanting to defend oneself, but that ultimately means a shootout. It's hardly going to matter who shot the first bullet in the history books. The far right are also going to arm themselves when they see other people arming themselves. And it's only going to 'prove them right' in their eyes.
Do I have a better solution, no. But more mass shootings isn't going to be the answer. And it's only going to take one shootout before it's used in a legal sense against people. And guns aren't going to be what's made illegal in the United States, especially with a republican-controlled government...
The far right have already armed themselves. Pacifists just end up at the bottom of the mass grave.
As long as you have no better solution, then defending oneself is on the table. Nobody is talking about mass shootings, but when people are getting beaten up in the streets because the emboldened nazis are walking around feeling their oats, then maybe their intended victims should be given a chance to stay alive, even if it conflicts with your morals. Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
Unfortunately, in the American system, the only answer is for everyone to have guns
As dangerous, sad, and silly as that sounds, there is truth to it.
I don't like it, but we've made a fucked up situation. Likely the only way we get the momentum to fix it is if things get bad enough though, which I'm not encouraging just pointing out that a large segment of our society has a stupid concept of gun rights which isn't actually in the constitution.
You could make that same argument to the countries neighboring Nazi Germany.
We have examples in history of what happens to unarmed people when fascists take over and few fight back, and it does nothing to quell the fascist's efforts or 'fears'. We also have examples of armed people fighting back, like the leftists in the Spanish Civil war. Their defeat was not a given, and they made the fascists work bloody hard for it. The alternative would've been the leftists having to blend in or be disappeared/killed, or they could've left everything and fled. The less you fight them, the stronger they become, until they become too big to run from or ignore.
I get the idea of wanting to defend oneself, but that ultimately means a shootout.
Study a concept called “deterrence”. It’ll blow your mind.
It's hardly going to matter who shot the first bullet in the history books.
Generally speaking whoever shoots first lives while the other one dies. Above statement makes no sense?
The far right
Admit it. You only refer to “the far right” and never “the right”.
are also going to arm themselves when they see other people arming themselves
We’re already armed, in response to the other people who’ve been arming themselves for thousands of years. The world being a dangerous place is not something we are just discovering now.
Do I have a better solution, no.
Awareness is always a good first step to growth
But more mass shootings isn't going to be the answer.
Buying a gun does not cause maas shootings to happen.
And it's only going to take one shootout before it's used in a legal sense against people.
?? explain
And guns aren't going to be what's made illegal in the United States, especially with a republican-controlled government...
You guessed it. We republicans are going to make women illegal. Such clear headed insight on your part
