Reddit claiming they weren’t recovering deleted posts
I’m not sure if it’s a coincidence, but I raised a case with the ICO in the UK, and today they got back to me asking for all my communication with Reddit. Also today - after a month of silence - Reddit also emailed me with this
If you’re in the UK and had been affected by posts being restored, I’d recommend contacting the ICO. It takes less than 5 minutes
That's pretty dubious, otherwise why would I get all these replies from 3-7 years ago? Not new replies on dead threads, but the replies were posted that long ago, and I'm being notified about them now as "new" comments. Seems a lot like deleted posts coming back.
This is why Power Delete Suite edits the comment before deleting it. If Reddit is keeping a record of deleted posts and comments, then theoretically they'd only be left with a bunch of comments that say nothing. But I'm pretty sure that if they're keeping deleted comments, then they're also keeping edit histories.
I imagine they have full offsite backups they can pull data from. That's why we have documentary shows like Mr. Robot, never forget 5/9!
Yes, comments are being restored, but what they're saying is it's not something they're doing deliberately. The scripts people were running were basically failing and comments got restored automatically. That message literally encourages you to run them again or try different ones
Except that’s crap, because I have been manually deleting my Reddit comments weekly at minimum for years, and I’ve had several that repopulated a few weeks ago, after being deleted for multiple weeks.
Some of them have respawned more than once even.
So Reddit is entirely full of shit.
I’m a web developer, that is absolutely not how any of this works.
Their claim that the scripts are failing causing comments to be restored is not possible. When you make a request to a website the site returns a success or fail status. The scripts are getting success statuses, the users are manually checking and seeing that their posts are deleted and then they reappear later. This means there is a mechanism between step 2 and 3 being run by Reddit affecting an already completed action.
Don’t comment on stuff like this unless you have any idea what you’re talking about.
Why do you assume that reddit saying that's the explanation, means that that's the explanation? Christian's done a pretty good job of documenting multiple instances of Reddit lying about what's going on, and spez has been observed editing other people's comments, so I wouldn't assume that they're telling the truth in this instance either.
That makes absolutely zero sense. The scripts issue individual delete requests for each comment. If a comment is deleted, it should stay deleted, even if the script ultimately fails.
I deleted mine by hand, they still returned. I've taken to editing them and replacing the text with [deleted]. Seems to be working better for now.
Whether they’re doing it on purpose is not relevant to the legal aspect of the situation. They have a responsibility to honor deletion requests. If a user complains, the appropriate response is “sorry you had a problem, we’ll fix it,” not “sorry, we will only honor our legal responsibilities if you follow our preferred [but not stated until now] procedure for requesting deletion, try again.” Having database problems opens you up to legal liability whether you like it or not, and trying to convince users that you are not responsible for your own database is… inappropriate.
Besides, there have been bugs with manual deletion, too. This is at least partly a problem with their own systems.
Sounds like a reddit admin posting on Lemmy spreading misinformation mischief to me! Is meat back on our menu boys?
“Welcome to gaslighting 101! Please take a syllabus from the pile you will [not] find by the door, which will [not] include your instructor’s contact information and office hours.”
Right? Make sure you trust your script? Who's broken the trust here?
If you’re in the UK and had been affected by posts being restored, I’d recommend contacting the ICO. It takes less than 5 minutes
Link it or put the email address in your post if you want people to actually do it
This is nothing more than reddit pushing their luck with european data laws, and finally relenting and going "OMG if your stuff wasnt deleted it was your fault, not ours, We promise it'll totally work this time if you do it again, since we've turned off our desperation measures after being threatened by fines by the EU"
The founder of Tildes, Deimos, is a former Reddit backend engineer who believes this is a technical issue rather than a case of Reddit purposefully subverting user intentions:
Yes, this is almost certainly a technical issue. The way reddit caches things probably isn't the standard way you're thinking of, like a short-term cache that expires and refreshes itself. There are multiple layers of "cached" listings and items for almost everything, and a lot of these caches are actually data that's stored permanently and kept up to date individually.
There are also multiple other places and ways that comments are cached—comment trees are cached (order and nesting of comments on a comments page, for all the different sorting methods), rendered HTML versions of comments are cached, API data is probably cached, and so on.
All of these issues are probably just some combination of all of your posts being difficult to find and access due to the listing limits or certain cached representations of posts not being cleared or updated properly.
This isn't really a good excuse though. Right to be forgotten doesn't me the right to be forgotten except in a cache loop. Sometimes this stuff is time sensitive.
If you added a 5s delay between deletes, they don't come back. Not a caching issue
Oh, so we all got the same bs copy pasted response at the same time? Mine took over a month, so I’m referring it to ICO.
Oh so it was literally a co-incidence I got it a few minutes after the ICO email?
Apparently so. It’s impressive how it took them 1 month+ to come up with this from their “Legal Team”.
If it isn’t on purpose, then they have a bug that is restoring comments. My main account is 18 years old. Cake Day is December 2005. I deleted it all, and then I checked from multiple devices to ensure when I logged in it was all gone, and it was. Until it wasn’t. I had about 100 random comments from 2013 to 2022 come back. So I manually deleted them all… again. And then a few days later, suddenly different comments are back. I must have repeated this deletion process 4-5 times. Each time, Reddit’s interface (not a third party script or app) showed me everything was gone… until it wasn’t.
They have some automated recovery going on whether they want to admit it or not.
Site is broken enough it may be both not on purpose and automated. The suggestion to use 3rd party scripts says it all. Aren't they legally obliged to implement that feauture? And yeah, they recently fucked over 3rd party apps, so it's even more ridiculous. It would be nice if they have a lot of complaints anyway.
I'd have to dig around for it, but I remember someone posting on here that reddit was restoring their comments. Then they found out that the comments they claimed reddit restored were actually in a privatized subreddit that opened back up. The script they were running to delete comments couldn't because it didn't have access to the comments to delete them.
Reddit is doing a lot of shady shit but I don't feel like this is one of them.
Okay, now that’s a plausible explanation. Some of those subs may have been private and coming back online over several days. Thanks for the insight.
I've filed my GDPR request a couple days ago and a shreddit session is due after that. Then another GDPR request to check.
If you’ve got an old account and active account, you’ll need to use your export to iterate through all comments to delete. Any script or app not using the export will be severely limited by the way the API (and this website) return comment listings for users.
Shreddit is rate-limiting and takes the GDPR export file as input. It's written in Rust with executable binaries available.
Mine are staying delete now after initially a few popping back up. What’s more concerning is that I requested my data a few weeks after I deleted my content. I was fully expecting to get empty files but nope ALL of my content. Dating back 10 years is still there! It’s not on my Reddit profile but they clearly kept it somewhere and can recall it whenever they want to. They do not delete the data.
Mine are staying delete now after initially a few popping back up.
Something like this happened for me too, but I believe these were comments that I didn't yet delete, they just weren't visible anymore. The older ones started to pop up once there was new space for them after deleting the newer ones. (On your profile not all comments you ever made are visible, only the newest/top/most-controversial ones, depending on what you sort for).
For example in my profile my very first post was visible, but none of the comments I made there. Before deleting the posts I went through each one and deleted my comments that way. There probably still are many comments from me laying around undeleted...
Mine were fairly recent and needed to be deleted several times to stay deleted. Seemed really random.
A blatant lie. They've restored some of my posts and comments 4 times.
I hate a lot of the things that reddit has been doing but I still think not all of them are on purpose. I ran into this issue myself before it was widely discussed and my first thought was that it had simply failed to delete some comments or deleted only from some cache.
So far every exampe I've seen of this can still be explained by bad engineering and I see no reason to think it is "undeleting" stuff by design, since it seems to happen to very random content that has no general value (like restoring 20 random comments out of 900 that were deleted).
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I got the exact same answer.
I kept all my communications with them and I still have to legally wait untill july 28th to report them to my national competent authority.
Please do so, when you can. This is not just about protesting, deletion can be a matter of personal safety for some people, which is why these laws exist.
When the ICO recieve a complaint they usually send an initial notification email to the data controller to advise that a case officer will be assigned in due course.
Well, unless it relates to a serious or ongoing data breach, which tends to be triaged immediately into an active investigation.
Initial notification letters do usually recommend trying to resolve the issue with the data subject in the interim though.
That probably spooked Reddit into moving your case up the priority list as I imagine they've got a pretty substantial backlog of SAR, erasure and objection requests, considering the circumstances.
The response window for most of those rights is 30 calendar days + extensions if applicable, so they could also have just been responding as late as allowed, accounting for aforementioned probable backlog.
Do let us know when the ICO gets back to you though, will be fascinating to hear what they have to say.
I very much doubt they'll get back. I also put about minimal effort into the report as I really don't expect anything to come of it
You feel that? You feel it slipping?
When you have to be this hands on with your site, manipulating it, it just means your circling the drain… slowly working your way down.
It’s going to get exhausting putting out these little fires constantly. If only they had a group of people that would happily do the moderation for them… for free.
But why even acknowledge it if you’re just going to lie about it. Cringe.
Thanks for reminding me to delete my account & all its posts
Keep your account for a while after deleting
heck I can't even get my data to begin with. When it did not show they sent me bakc an email saying it would take up to 30 days. today I emailed back that it has been well over 30 days.
So like they are clearly full of shit. How do you fight something like this?
Keep pushing with the relevant authorities. There is a difference between "We are not intentionally restoring comments" and "We certify that we have forgotten all of your info", and that's what these authorities enforce.
It doesn't matter if Reddit's inscrutable back end makes it difficult. That's Reddit's problem, not yours. If they want to do business in the EU, they either have to comply or pull a Meta and stop serving EU residents entirely.
They had a third option, to treat their users as human beings and not dumb fucks to exploit until they want to leave (and forget they ever went there), but they declined to use it.
This. The whole question of whether Reddit meant to restore comments is a distraction. The actual issue is that people who wanted their comments deleted are finding that their comments have not been deleted. If Reddit wants to prove that it was not their fault, they can do it in court. No lawyer is going to believe the kind of half-assed excuses Reddit has been handing out. I would like to see this hashed out in court, if for no other reason than that a court case is probably the best way to find out what is actually happening here. It seems like Reddit not going to be honest unless they’re forced to be, even when honesty would benefit them.
They also claim that API changes is reasonable; they also claim that IPO is a great idea
They've lied plenty of times before, why believe them now?
So those things only matter as search engine discoverability right? Doesn't Google cache and keep them for pretty long though, so does it matter if user deletes their old content?
Yes, it matters hugely.
Let's say I do a google search for "how to frobitz a widget" and the top result (because as you say it's in Google's cache) points me to a post on /r/WidgetFrobitzing.
I then click through and find that the post is deleted or has been changed to say "lol Spez sucks use Lemmy" or whatever. I'll almost certainly close that tab and go back to google to find another link. That deprives Reddit of clicks through its ads, of time spent on site, and it also means that user is less likely to follow links to Reddit in future as they will know they're not as useful as Google thought they were.