This has been a doozy of a year. And it's the best year so far blah blah. So how are you all coping? Does it hit anyone else like a bolt of lightning that probably I - we - won't die of old age?
I don‘t. I‘m accepting that i, as an individual, will not be able to impact it and so i‘m pretty much going with it. Humanity will survive, thats for sure but i make sure to make the most of it in the time where it‘s still bearable.
Nah. It's only been around a very, very short time and it won't remain much longer despite probably being one of the longer stints the planet's seen of life so far. We should still get to punch MAN into the high score screen and be seen by other players later on, like we saw with DNO.
Humanity will survive I'm certain of it, however our thermo industrial civilization will not and most of the people currently living in the planet will not.
It will happen whatever I personally do.
The best I can do now is to find ways to have the happiest life I can using as little ressources as possible for my family, my community (neighbors, friends ...) and me. It's a process that forces us to reassess a lot of things we were doing but it is fascinating.
Practically it means finding ways to lower our monthly expenses, try to consume local as much as possible and learning a lot of new techniques..
I am educated in science and I do not think humanity will survive, no. Most megafauna will probably die out. There are ~10 planetary boundaries and we've crossed a lot of them. Earthquakes and volcanoes will start picking up. AMOC collapse could be as soon as 2025.
No. I also read that. There was a prediction that AMOC collapse might be inevitable by 2025 and take a couple centuries to happen.
We have pretty good evidence the currents are slowing, but no real data to predict if and when it might stop. A couple researchers made a prediction that is not currently accepted by the field. It’s just pretty dire, but would affect a few generations from now even if true
Then you should recall that some of the largest megafauna ever lived for tens of millions of years at much higher temperatures(and therefore sea levels)
I'm a silly goose with young kids and I've been head-in-the-sand trying to deal with my own survival. Once I had an iota of stability, I started to let the outside world in again and often wish I hadn't.
I estimate I live in a place least likely to be dramatically affected by climate change, early on. It's not like I'm in Florida and can't afford to insure my home any longer because of hurricane risk. It's not like I'm likely to be one of the 1.2 billion climate refugees by 2050.
So I try to take little steps to get prepared for something I never thought I'd need to be prepared for. We're growing more and more of our own food, we're expanding our water/food stores and storage. We plan to get a solar system soon (so we're the 1/10 that makes it through an extended grid outage), while global supply chains still function.
I've started a little (20TB) apocalypse library, full of illustrated guides, youtube videos, books, and resources.
My biggest stumbling block is starting community. I generally don't like people and as you've seen in this thread, most people don't take climate change seriously.
And, as someone else said... weed and time in nature.
Yes. I am friends with ecological scientists, biologists, soil scientists, ornithologists, and other various environmental researchers. The rest of my natural life would be ~40-50 years. We probably have 10-20 at most. Remember, the heating is exponential and delayed, and we've also exceeded several other planetary boundaries. Our governments are decades too late. We are literally already in the middle of an extinction event.
Even if everyone TODAY stopped burning all fossil fuels, we'd still have to sequester millions of tons of carbon in 10-20 years with no infrastructure for it. To do this will release more greenhouse gases. Amd we still have to address the 9 other planetary boundaries we've crossed including ocean acidification, soil destruction, and pollution.
The absolute best shot we have is to deflect a percentage of the sun's rays from ever reaching earth with some kind of space blanket or shield. Likely we will just inject sulfur into the atmosphere with unknown consequences.
That you don't realize how bad it is, is the sadder thing. We have seriously failed in educating people about science. Chemical reactions need specific energy requirements to work, which means specific temperatures. It's a big deal to our very cells themselves that the planet is getting hotter. And again, that is only 1 planetary boundary and we have crossed others.
You can literally see footage online of people's housing falling into the ocean, and their property wasn't oceanfront when they bought it. You can look u0 articles about billions of sea life boiling alive off the oregon coast and baby eagles flinging themselves from their nests to die due to heat. You can see the recent article about Dubai being beyond the wet bulb temp for humans to survive. That's not normal, ya'll. None of this is normal.
But whatever, it's too late. Enjoy your remaining years as much as you can, and don't forget you can always starve yourself to death for free if you don't have a bullet. Good luck everyone.
Likely we will just inject sulfur into the atmosphere with unknown consequences.
Kind of the only hope we have left at this point. One which I'm desperately holding onto.
Articles about insect populations being decimated by something like 70%... They are the ones most vulnerable to climate change, and they're all dying. How people can see that and not understand is mind boggling.
I joined a climate activism group in my local area, frankly it's the best possible way to deal with it. You can make a difference, the messaging we get is often intended to make us feel powerless to keep people from protesting, but it's actually one of the most empowering ways to deal with it. Being with a group of passionate people amplifies your ability to effect change, and given how broken many of our governments are, it's necessary. The biggest thing stopping us from forcing big changes is our lack of numbers, solidarity is strength.
It certainly beats sitting around feeling angry and stressed.
I become a stauncher anti-capitalist every day, since capitalism and its unsustainable and literally impossible aim of infinite growth, and the greed and corruption it encourages, is why climate change is not only happening but also not being treated seriously, and abolishing it is the only hope we have of dealing with the damage climate change will bring and try and minimize it going forward (since its past the point of stopping it entirely).
The whole point of those responsible shifting blame on to individuals who have nothing to do with the decisions that got us here, nor the profits they make, is to get you to the point you're at now - hopelessness which leads to inaction, or desperation that leads to futile action (like banning straws or paying to reduce your "carbon footprint" - a term they made up for this exact purpose, and so on, all of which are there to make sure you're criticising your neighbour for their recycling habits instead of the companies that say they're recycling and get paid to but really send the garbage directly to landfill, or to a developing nation already drowning in western trash).
What you actually need to be is angry and focused, to ensure your anger is aimed at the right people and the systems they uphold that got us here. Those systems are not natural or inevitable or immutable, they are artificially created by and for the benefit of a really small group of humans, a group we could easily be rid of if we actually united to do so.
This could have been written by me. I despise capitalism, capitalists, and if I could, would ensure that every company knowingly polluting or harming people or the planet would be dissolved and their boards put in jail, or worse. I have always hated capitalism, I'm realizing, the older I get, and learning how many of these companies KNEW the consequences of their greed makes me even more radicalized against it.
We glamorize wealth hoarding and that baffles me. I have a 4yo son. I see in him the same things I see in these capitalists. I give him what he wants, say a scoop of ice cream. I get some for myself, maybe a different flavor, and he asks for mine. He gets upset when I tell him to enjoy what he has and that I want to enjoy my ice cream too.
Recently, we got into LEGO and I will be building something, usually just fucking around, and I'll start to make something cool. He'll come up and want it. Even with other blocks, it's what little I have that he wants. Sometimes, there is no amount of persuasion to allow me to continue what I'm doing.
I'm convinced that greed is just a regression/stopping of cognitive development to the level of a child. I would pity these capitalist fuckers if they weren't destroying the planet and our lives for their greed.
Makes me think, sure, go ahead, build that bunker to escape the disaster you [capitalists] created. Nature may not be able to get in that easily, but people didn't become the apex hunters of this planet from giving up. Persistence will reap what you have sowed.
I honestly believe that billionairism is a mental illness and should be treated as such. Involuntary confinement and treatment, because they're a danger to others.
...instead of the companies that say they’re recycling and get paid to but really send the garbage directly to landfill, or to a developing nation already drowning in western trash).
More to the point, instead of the companies that say they're recycling but haven't done a damn thing to reduce how much trash they manufacture in the first place, and in fact are doing every single thing in their power to keep expanding to manufacture trash at ever faster rates.
I'm mostly just staying inside this time of year. I personally likely will not die of climate change as I'm privileged enough to be able to keep moving when I need, but I probably will die from micro plastic induced cancer.
Depends on the rapidity of the onset of the negative effects of climate change. If it’s slow, we’re gonna lose a lot of people, but we’ll be able to preserve some form of civilization. The worst affected will be the usual poorer people and those who can’t geographically escape the heat for whatever reason.
Worst scenario is rapid onset that disrupts the global network of food, energy, manufacturing, medicines, materials, etc. that literally keep everything working. If that goes tits up in an uncontrolled way just plan on losing a very significant chunk of the world’s population very fast. At a certain tipping point we also lose the people that know how to make things work. Modern society works because we have the ability to free some people from manual labor and subsistence existence to take on highly specialized learning. From fixing the grid, to doctors, to IT specialists, to the academics that teach these specialists. Lose enough of them and you lose the knowledge of how to do anything that makes modern civilization work.
So it all depends on your views if you think you’ll make it to old age. Do you think the world will collapse quickly or will it be a controlled descent? It certainly doesn’t look like we’re going to solve a damn thing regarding anthropogenic climate change, much less reverse anything, and we’re already stuck facing the damaging climate changes we started.
If it’s slow, we’re gonna lose a lot of people, but we’ll be able to preserve some form of civilization.
Assuming this is the best case scenario, are you willing to make a prediction about number of deaths by a certain year?
The reason I ask is because I think climate change alarmism is an unscientific, nonfalsifiable system of beliefs that don't match reality.
And part of that is that people never make solid predictions. They resist it. Are you willing to make a solid prediction with an actual timeline on it, given this is your best case scenario?
It certainly doesn’t look like we’re going to solve a damn thing regarding anthropogenic climate change, much less reverse anything, and we’re already stuck facing the damaging climate changes we started.
Yeah we're definitely not going to reverse climate change.
As far as I can tell, the main disrupting effects of climate change are going to be higher sea levels. So lots of people will have to move, or protect their cities with dikes.
There will be more farmland than before, given the effects of CO2 on plant growth.
I don't see any scenario where it leads to a collapse of civilization.
related... There are now ac/heat pump mini split units that are set up to be linked directly to solar panel systems and run offgrid or with grid assist.
This is great for a few reasons:
solar radiance and need for cooling are related.
if you hook directly to solar you don't need to convert AC current to DC and lose 10-20% of the energy.
if you dont tie the system to the grid, you might be able to avoid the use induction effect. That is, installing air conditioning tends to make people use more grid energy.
It also helps with adding solar capacity to people who have electrical issues in their house and can't get typical solar install, or who can't add more solar capacity due to net metering edicts by their utilities, or dont want to pull permits for electrical work.
I've had my eye on a system from Airspool here in the US - should help with these warmer summers and help offset a little of the heating need in the winter too.
I would look into a full central system - but I have a relatively new gas furnace and can't justify replacing it and dealing with all the required electrical work.
We live on an ocean-going sailboat. We make our own water and electricity. We have ~25 years of membranes, filters, and most parts. While we have the means to move around to cooler climes, going further northward means more severe storms and shorter working life of everything. So there's that consideration.
Having the escape hatch of the boat does a lot to ease the anxiety.
Other coping mechanisms:
fixing people's bicycles for free and evangelizing micro-mobility
monitoring and mapping marine health in maritime communities (kelp, fish counts, bottom conditions); yes this is "just" monitoring, but one measurement is worth 1000 opinions and hopefully helps to move the needle on getting everyone to pull together on environmental protections
community education on aeroponics and micro-hydroponics
community support on emergency preparedness
I'm sure I'm skipping over some of my other copium prescriptions, but those are the most salient.
We had the same idea. Even ended up living on an old 37' for about a year... then we popped the stern tube during an engine test (40 years worth of copper corrosion)...
Well you can imagine what that was like. It was only through sheer dumb luck that we saved literally everything we own. That coupled with some expensive engine repair and we ended up spending the cost of the boat again in repairs.
There's more to the story but ye, we live in a house now.
This is not to discourage any one btw, just pick your boat better than we did. Also, you need to be really into DIY or really rich, because God damn, boat stuff is expensive!
Our social media and blog are severely neglected, in large part because of surveillance and chokepoint capitalism (see: Cory Doctorow). But this would probably be the best entry point into our socials: https://youtube.com/@svcascadia
I'm mostly very curious how this all plays out. I'm also a bit worried, but there's not much I can do about that anyway, so whatever.
I wish I could travel a thousand years into the future and read all the history books.
I think these are very interesting times (and as we all know, it sucks to live in interesting times) with all the innovations and political desicions. Even the failures and missed opportunities. It's all very interesting.
I've been keeping my mind busy, learning actionable skills and survival stuff. I am learning foraging, growing food, I've made a real decision to not reserve my happiness for retirement, as that day isn't guaranteed but today is. I convert the worry into little reminders about how today is the most important time to do the thing. I live immediacy and radical self reliance. I recycle, upcycle, reuse, buy second hand, adopt, occasionally dumpster dive, and reduce my negative impact on the planet. I donate to charities that help people in crisis, so more people can enjoy today while they have it. Also, instead of anxious, I get high.
I do what I can to reduce my own CO2 footprint - mostly for my own conscience.
In every election I vote for the party with the most focus on CO2 reduction that has a good chance of making it into parlament.
I chose both my work and home specifically so I don't need a car to commute, and am completely safe from "once in a lifetime" floods (which will probably happen every other year soon).
I could make decently more money and rent more living space elsewhere.
Otherwise I don't worry. Cause what else is there to do?
I could die in the climate wars, in an epic storm, in a new pandemic...
Or quietly in my bed at age 100 like my grandparents, who survived 2 world wars, the cold war, and 4 revolutions.
Who knows?
The Earth has been much hotter than the worst-case scenario for anthropogenic climate change. (It used to be rainforests-at-the-North-pole hot.) Climate change isn't going to kill you unless you're both extremely poor (by global standards, not by first-world standards) and unlucky, although it may significantly reduce your quality of life as resources are redirected to mitigation. Where do these "mass death everywhere" ideas come from? They're not a product of the scientific consensus.
As for me: it seems like the climate where I live is getting warmer. There has been much less snow recently than there was when I was a kid; it's convenient but unsettling. The summers are getting hotter too, although the difference isn't as dramatic. I'd like to move to somewhere further north, or maybe a place like coastal California which is without temperature extremes, but I would want to do that even if the climate wasn't changing.
That climate change is killing bigger multicellular organisms isn't debatable, we are in an extinction event that was made significantly worse by bird flu. If we lived outside, we'd be dying too. And soon, our power grids will start failing even more, just like Texas.
The problem isn't that it's going to be warmer. The problem is that it's getting warmer so quickly that populations won't be able to adapt. Ecological collapse is absolutely on the table here. There is no real debate in the scientific community about this, just deceptive propaganda that's disguised as 'conflicting science' but is simply a smoke screen to keep people ignoring the problem.
We're going to lose a lot of diversity but hardy, fast-growing species will spread into niches formerly filled by specialists. Some models even predict that net ecological productivity will increase significantly (there does exist disagreement about this).
Humans have drastically altered ecology permanently anyways, during fruits and vegetables into near monocrops and changing them within just a few decades, it's pretty clear that can be done for temperature changes. Though yeah of course temperature changing changes ecology, but why assume that change will be disastrous collapse
Yesterday I had a climate change anxiety attack. I came to the conclusion that despite wanting to have children, I shouldn't because the earth is currently dying underneath our feet. Watching outside my window, a cat I've been taking care of brought her litter of kittens to take shelter under my awning, and it had me feeling very bitter, that I would never know the blissful highs and devastating lows of parenthood. All the joy and pain and love that embodies raising a child, past generations have forfeit through destructive environmental/corporate/profit-centered policies.
I was able to calm myself down, oddly enough through a few memes I saw. one of which being an old cunieform tablet that had a transcription of a man from Assyria decrying how the world was falling apart back in 1200 BC. And the second, one of Neil Degrasse Tyson saying simply, "If we can geo-engineer other planets, we can certainly fix our own."
Made me feel a little more hopeful, that we could still prevent the worst of it, and perhaps fix what we couldn't prevent.
Still not sure about having kids though. If I still even can, with the level of microplastic in my testes, and PFAS everywhere else.
It's devastating. I want to be a mother so badly, but I know I'll never be able to. It's not even the fact that I'm infertile. After all I've been through my life has just been left too unstable. I've been left too unstable. I would love to adopt and raise a kid, but I know deep down I could never provide the upbringing that they deserve. I would just watch in horror as a precious child deals with the consequences of my instability.
We've both been afforded far too much trauma. It's not our fault, but I'll be damned if I make my problems someone else's. It's like, the one thing I don't want to do. There are other ways to make a positive impact on the world without having children, heck, just look at Mary "Mother" Jones!
Kids are very adaptive. They will grow up in this changing world and it will be normal to them. They will grow up instinctively being able to deal with things that we will forever strugle with. Kids are amazing in finding their own solutions, even at a young age.
I think it is much more important to be financially and emotionally able to support a child. You should ask yourself if you are able to do that. You can get financial and emotional support from your environment, many people do that ("it takes a village to raise a child"), but you can't afford a full blown mental breakdown when you have kids.
I'm not trying to convince you to have children or not, just giving my two cents. There's probably plenty who disagree, especially in a thread like this, so feel free to ignore me.
In my head, I envision year 2084 as one where humans are isolated mostly to the poles of the Earth, the only suitable farmland left. Where life is nothing like what I would recognize, and we're merely prolonging the inevitable migration into underground dwellings, away from the harsh barren hellscape of our own creation.
But that's not the reality. Human beings have the remarkable ability to adapt, and change our environment to suit our needs. I know that there are people smarter than I, that will figure out how to curb, and ultimately roll back the most devastating aspects of our pollution crisis. I know that we will survive, and thrive into the future, even if it means shrinking the population down from it's current 8 billion.
But today, I can pick any spot on the globe, and find a terrible human caused crisis there, and some conservative politician doing everything in their power to make it worse (and make money off of making it worse). And that just fucking kills me.
I do my best to limit plastic use and eat less meat. But that's a mosquitoes fart compared to all the pollution that can easily prevented by the players that matter. Governments still choose fossil over nuclear, not enough subsidy on fossil alternatives that we could have had decades ago etc.
I just distract myself by focusing on how my life is falling apart. Occasionally I'll distract myself from my crumbling life by stressing about how the world is burning.
I still try my best to do what I can. But at the same time I've come to terms with the fact that we're all fucked and everything I'm doing is pointless. But I'd rather do what I can and strive to do better than give up and make things worse. I have completely selfish reasons for doing my part and it's literally just because I'd feel like an asshole.
I found this video to be helpful in putting things in perspective. Basically, despite all the news, we are making progress and it is a priority. Technology is improving really fast to the point where renewable energy is actually the more economical choice.
A lot of companies are actually making an effort to implement more green policies. I work for a tech company, and a lot of discussions revolve around energy efficiency and performance per watt.
Remember that climate change activists want to make the world seem much worse than it is. That's their "job" after all - to raise awareness and attention. It doesn't mean what they are saying isn't true, just that you should view it as them putting a negative lens on it.
Personally, I worry about many things, but not really climate change. With most issues there conflict between two groups. But I think most people generally think climate change is a real thing, even if they disagree on its priority.
It already is worse. The number of extinctions in the last few years alone is heartbreaking.
I don’t think that activists want it to seem worse than it is. I think they’re trying to wake us up from sleepwalking collectively into disaster. The ones I listen to seem pretty measured.
I found this video to be helpful in comforting me. It minimized all those scary truths those pesky scientists keep bringing up. Once you find just the right take you can be on the bandwagon but with zero responsibility and accountability!
My point was that saying "nothing is getting better and everything is terrible" is doing a great disservice to all the hard work of people actually working on solving this issue. There's certainly a lot of work that still needs to be done.
There are three lenses on how to look at the world:
The world is awful.
The world is much better.
The world can be much better.
These need not be mutually exclusive and you are limiting yourself if you only focus on the world through one of these lenses.
We have solar and a plug in hybrid car. I try to support small local businesses. We moved to a place with historically cooler weather above sea level. I vote in all the elections I can. I keep up with the town planning board and try to influence towards car independence. I stay hydrated, wear natural fibers, and try to buy used when I can.
Heat stroke due to rising temperatures. That is, if you forget to stay inside with the ac when it's 50 degrees celcius outside and go run a marathon instead (or you're allready very old or ill and susceptible to heat stroke)
Or drowning, because you're too stubborn to move away from the shore when sea levels rise enough to flood your house.
Or a falling tree on your head, because you don't believe in wheather forcasts and climate changed has caused more frequent wheather extremes.
There's plenty of unique challenges caused by climate change, but we can adapt to most if not all of them.
Or starving in the street as supply lines start to collapse because you aren't wealthy enough to inoculate yourself from the consequences of ecosystems collapsing.
The heat is unbearable, but at the moment, it's probably not going to kill me, it's probably just going to be annoying. People in Arizona live like normal in temperatures 20% higher than body temperature, which nobody would guess is good for anyone. Meanwhile, I'm on the East Coast, where the sky is this week's issue.
I just don't give a fuck, when I'm dead I won't care about anything. And my own existence is full of problems and worries enough just to worry about the goddamn sun or sea levels.
Fair enough, nihilism is a valid philosophy that often helps people cope in difficult times. And it really probably doesn't matter at this point anyway.
What on earth made you think that climate change is going to lead to the extinction of our species? What kind of exaggerated analysis have you been consuming?
Same. Ironically, very funny to me, we are arguably the stupidest species by far. I mean, we are the only species to extinct the whole planet. That's wild. That one insect species that's confined to a solitary rock in Africa wouldn't do this. Even they are smarter than people.
What people don't realize is that the extinction of humanity has already begun. The population is going to start plummeting as the rate of people not having children accelerates and the elderly start dying off. As climate change worsens, food production is going to procedurally decrease, and as the workforce shrinks logistics will fail. There will be widespread famine, people are going to be priced out of being able to eat. There will be violence over this, but the damage is done--no amount of revolution will be enough to restore the production and transportation of food to high enough levels to feed everyone. As more and more people die off, the problem will only accelerate. "Oh rich people will survive", people say. Sure, but for how long? With a global failure of logistics and communication, it's not like your money would really be able to buy much, if you can even access your wealth. Humanity is fucked, enjoy life while you can now. If you can.
I do what I can, reduce consumption and minimize waste, but it's not like it'll matter. It's still worth it to try, though. It's like a heroic last stand, just on a much much much slower and less glorious scale.