Canada needs proportional representation federally
cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ca/post/24368090
The seat make up would look more like the left if we had a more fair and accountable proportional representation over the obsolete first past the post.
We repeat that every time this chart looks like this. Which is almost every election. We even elected a guy on the promise to change it. 🥹
Yup, and now it will bite him in the ass. Imagine if we had coalition governments in Canada that actually represented the Canadian voice. The parties will have to make concessions and actually talk to each other like in a marriage.
It's plausible that Trudeau could want to push through voting reform as one last move to salvage something since him losing the next election likely spells the end of his political career.
The problem is the Liberals as a whole. It pretty predictable Conservatives are going to do a horrible job and by the 2029ish election the tables will be flipped and Liberal will only need to campaign on not being a disaster of a party like the incumbents.
We can build up the pressure further on the prime minister if we can continue educating others about this.
Its the same "power corrupts" story again and again. Karina Gould gave an impassioned speech on electoral reform (http://www.ourcommons.ca/DocumentViewer/en/42-1/house/sitting-64/hansard#Int-8963139). But after replacing Maryam Monsef as Minister of Democratic Institutions, her views suddenly became far more simplistic. In a 2017 interview on CBC's Metro Morning, she was asked "Why is it important that people at the very least believe every vote counts?". She replies "Because they do. … We literally count them: 1, 2, 3, 4, up to the majority that wins."
The people have the power not the conservatives or the liberals and research has shown the Canadian public wants proportional representation however we’re currently not putting enough pressure about the unfair system of first past the post. There was a vote on national citizen’s assembly that went like this
“On February 7, Parliament voted on Motion M-86 for a National Citizens’ Assembly on Electoral Reform. The result was: YES 101 NO 220 In addition to the support of the NDP, Green Party and Bloc MPs, 40 Liberals and 3 Conservatives voted for the motion. To see how your MP voted, scroll to the bottom of this email.”
It's incredibly depressing to know that my vote in federal elections is useless just because of where I live.
Interesting to see the charts there showing a steady 25% against. Even when asked if a majority government should have the support of a majority of voters!
Who are these guys! Its hard to believe that a quarter of people surveyed appear to not want our democracy to function.
Good luck convincing the government to enact it when they've already decided our poor populace just doesn't have "enough interest" in the idea.
Not sure why this is down voted. This is exactly what happened. Trudeau ran on electoral reform in 2015. That was gonna be the last FPTP election, he said. Then they did some consultations with the public and said that not enough people wanted it. Shortly after, they threw the whole thing down the garbage chute.
Then they did some consultations with the public and said that not enough people wanted it.
Worse than that, Trudeau straight up said "People wanted electoral reform because they were unsatisfied under the Harper government, now that we're in power everything is fine and people don't care about electoral reform anymore."
Source article in Le Devoir (French), I'll quote the relevant part here:
« Sous M. [Stephen] Harper, il y avait tellement de gens mécontents du gouvernement et de son approche que les gens disaient “ça prend une réforme électorale pour ne plus avoir de gouvernement qu’on n’aime pas”. Or, sous le système actuel, ils ont maintenant un gouvernement avec lequel ils sont plus satisfaits. Et la motivation de vouloir changer le système électoral est moins percutante [ou moins criante] »
That graphic doesn't tell me anything. Maybe it should be defined better?
Left is based on popular vote while right is based on how many seats favouring the parties.
"Vote"
votes for electoral reform
"Fuck you. Anyways... don't forget you HAVE TO vote for us if you don't want the conservatives again."
Man, we really are more alike then we think
The Corporate Liberals and Pierre Poilievre Conservatives need to be held accountable
If that's the batshit crazy we'd release to the rest of the country then I'm good with FPTP. We can keep our elitist "i've got mine so fuck you" conservative asshats to ourselves while we learn from that mistake. If we can. Holy fuck I wasn't aware the ignorant hillbillies were that enraged at actually getting services despite a pandemic that they want to elect the absolute worst group to ever manage something, ever.
Now do the Maritimes.
The Atlantic provinces and Quebec are probably the biggest reason we won't see PR actually take affect. They currently have massive over representation constitutionally guaranteed and I highly doubt they are gonna give that up without a massive fight.
The closest we will ever get is a different way to count votes within the current riding system, which is still not PR at the end of the day.
(And aside from the fact that PR doesn't solve the issue of more populace regions fucking over less populace ones without regard)
Exactly my point.
Proportional representation isn’t the cure-all everyone thinks it is. Vote-splitting goes away, sure, but then you get lots of small parties forming coalitions. If you want to see that in action, look no further than Israel’s government.
No thanks.
Israel and the EU are prop rep and they went hard right.
Prop rep only looks good on a spreadsheet, it's terrible when you consider power dynamics.
First of all the parties have all of the power in a prop rep system. There really isn't any point in even having seats other than to make it appear like a legislature instead of what it really is. A coalition formed in a backroom in when the parties in that coalition hold all of the power and the parties outside of it may as well not be there.
The seats belong to the party, not individuals representing communities. Which means the MP can't cross the floor if their party is going to screw over their community. They can resign but then the Party appoints someone else to sit in the seat and that person votes the way the party tells them to.
The biggest problem with First Past the Post is the name. If you call it a Community Representation system (which is what it is) it sounds a lot nicer doesn't it? You vote for a person to represent your community you put pressure on them to put pressure on their party and on Parliament to make the necessary compromises and concessions in the best interests of the community.
Minority interests can more easily be ignored in a Prop Rep system than in a Community representation system. In a community representation system, a thousand votes in a riding can swing it and that means any party can lose seats if they ignore minority interests. In a Prop Rep system even an million votes from minorities are meaningless if the party they vote for isn't part of the ruling coalition.
Would you really want Canada being run by a coalition between the CPC and PPC where all power rests in the ruling coalition? Where the CPC has to give the PPC what they ask for to maintain power? This is the situation in Israel right now, and it may soon be how it is in the EU.
If you want electoral reform maybe push for ranked choice voting instead of a Prop Rep system that's currently failing in some very high profile ways in other parts of the world.