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I don't like Joe Biden, I'll never forget the Neoliberal bullshit he did with the Republicans in the 90s we are still suffering from further eviscerating the safetynet to the draconian war on people suffering addiction. He's one of the OG former opposition party members the Reagan Revolution convinced to take the bigger bribe checks from Wall Street than Unions could ever match, today's neoliberal(D) party.
That said, I voted for him in the last election, and I will again out of harm reduction. He has improved on policy, but l even if he didn't, the American people do not get a vote on whether or not to elect a senile President this cycle.
You can have any President you like, as long as he's senile. If you vote, we'll get a senile President. If you don't, we'll get a senile President.
The question is whether you want senile and gleefully cruel(R), or just senile(D). I'll take just senile.
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the American people do not get a vote on whether or not to elect a senile President this cycle
I feel like I've somehow become trapped in some kind of simulation or thought experiment where the purpose of it is to make lesser evilism seem as ridiculous as conceivably possible, and every time I think it's peaked with just comical levels of absurdity, it somehow manages to escalate.
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Except you do get to vote for no senility. That is what the primaries were for. Trump was actually struggling quite a bit against a young woman.
As was Biden for a hot second against a younger candidate. That was short lived. Biden was also getting a bit of a slap by a few people who were not on board for having Biden run the party again.
This is why you don’t sleep through the primaries and complain you only get the only one vote on parties.
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2016 proved that wasn't true. The DNC pushed the candidate they wanted, and the guy who kept being up or near Hillary just got ignored by the press so most people barely ever saw him. You don't get to pick anything in the primaries. The two parties in charge tell you who you get to have.
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You can have any President you like, as long as he’s senile. If you vote, we’ll get a senile President. If you don’t, we’ll get a senile President.
there are other candidates you can vote for
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do not get a vote on whether or not to elect a senile President this cycle
Yeah this is just false.
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He said, with no examples or evidence of any kind.
Edit the way "vote' is used in that sentence isn't so much a ballot transaction....it's more a "choice".
Biden or trump WILL be the next president.
This sucks but cannot be avoided.
Edit edit choose left right or abstain, it's all the same. A senile president will be the next president
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Love that ratio!
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It's up to the DNC as to which candidate takes the running ballot. I'm betting there are a lot of conversations right now about who will be that person.
You are half right and half wrong because that decision will come down to whether establishment Democrats or populist Democrats win.
And to be quiet frank, I don't even think the DNC gets a say. Since Biden is the incumbent, unless he bows out voluntarily, I don't think we the people or the DNC get to choose.
Our hands are really tied when it comes to the presidential frontrunner, unfortunately.
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Or vote third-party, and you'll probably get a senile President, but maybe not.
And more importantly, you're helping to break the Duopoly and normalize voting third-party.
If a minor party manages to get 5% of the vote, they qualify for federal funding in the next election, and that might lead to real change.
Cornel West is polling at about 3% (and after Biden's performance, I wouldn't be surprised if Cornel picks up a couple more percent). We could be close.
Edit: Or just keep on thinking you have to settle for the lesser of two evils. (How's that working out for you?)
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If you're in a state that will certainly be blue or red and has 0% chance of swinging unless a huge proportion of the population changes their party affiliation (California, New York, Mississippi, Alabama, to name a few) then vote 3rd party, sure.
If your state was within 10% of flipping colors in any of the past 3 presidential elections, DO NOT vote 3rd party. Your vote matters too much to risk it.
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Or vote third-party, and you’ll probably get a senile President, but maybe not.
Vote third party and we are guaranteed to get a senile president. It's a two party FPTP system.
Edit: Or just keep on thinking you have to settle for the lesser of two evils. (How’s that working out for you?)
Better than telling people to throw away their vote. How's that working for you? How many 3rd party presidents have you gotten elected with your strategy? How many fascist policies has your strategy avoided us?
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Build a platform by building consensus, not pitching a longshot
Vote for all down ticket races and help get blue policy makers in every seat possible.
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It's obvious third parties have no chance. Why even pretend that's not true?
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What if I don't like any of the major minor parties either?
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I am not going to vote for Joe Biden. I am going to vote for the Biden Administration. They can "Weekend at Bernie's" the old man for all I care.
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Biden could drop dead on January 21st and we'll still get to call this mission accomplished, VP Jeffries ain't a half bad outcome personally, although Kamala having her eyes on that incumbent effect is gonna make me groan come 28
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Jeffries is literally one of the most corrupt neolibs in Congress in terms of taking bribe money.
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That's been the standard US Presidential SOP since Nixon developed a serious drinking problem and Kissinger demanded all orders go through him first (so as to avoid WW3).
They had an old, dementia ridden actor, and the dumb-ass Bush son for that reason, too. HW Bush could handle his shit but he raised taxes and puked on the Japanese PM so that's a pass. Trump is just another stooge to be kept in line so that his doners get what they want.
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This is a good perspective. Great way to look at it.
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Biden shit the bed and should fuck off. But I’d vote for his corpse over any filthy republican traitor.
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A shame the electoral college voters won't feel the same way
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So the man has a stutter, and he's old, what ever. All I can do is cast my single vote. Last time, I voted against Trump, and honestly, even after the debate, I'll cast my vote this time for Biden.
I'd much rather cast my vote for Hakeem Jeffries, or Shift, or Bernie, or a dozen other people who aren't an option.
Thing is, I'm going to cast my vote in Cook county IL, so it literally won't matter. IL is going blue no matter what, and I feel like my participation is merely token.
I wish I could do more, I want to scream at clouds about what is happening to the country, and it doesn't matter.
Saw a stat that says Trump is 65% to win, and want to physically grab people and shake them, but what would it matter?
Had I walked into that debate blind, not knowing who those people are, what the "facts" and the facts are, I'd have thought, that Biden guy seems weak and befuddled, and boy that Trump is sure a confident leader. It made me feel sick.
As I told my mother today, I don't have kids, I live in the midwest, have a good job with a big stable company, truth is, even a second Trump term won't effect me that much. I can just sit back, enjoy my 30 so years left, and watch the world burn, but damn it, I have empathy for others, and there are many, many people whose lives and livelihood are going to be seriously impacted, and that bothers me.
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I'll also be casting my vote in Cook county. I have hispanic kids. My wife is Salvadoran. She is a US citizen born and raised in the US. I'm a white atheist and a dual citizen of the EU who has had the audacity to previously speak poorly about my corporate overlords. I grew up in the south. I don't trust these project 2025 fucks to stop at illegal immigrants. Biden sucks, but I'll vote for him anyway because the system literally gives me no other option. Until the system changes or fails, this is what we must do.
If you value the supreme court, lower court appointments, social security, healthcare, childcare, the environment, action on climate change, a competent CDC for the pandemics we're going to experience more frequently, etc., vote Biden. Yes he's old. Yes he sucks. Unfortunately he's the lesser of two evils. And by a wide margin.
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This Biden protection is crazy. we need a candidate who actually stands a chance against Trump. this is insane. It's 2016 all over again.
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I don't even see why that matters. Even if the candidate was an actual real turnip, the choice would be obvious.
I mean I don't vote in your election but it seems quite clear to me.
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I think part of our different view might be based on how our electoral system is.
So to explain: Trump's never won a popular election before. Even when he became president, most Americans voted for his opposition Hillary Clinton. We have a very gerrymandered and corrupt voting system to oversimplify. Because of that The main decider for presidential elections is voting turnout. If a lot of people come out to vote, the Democrats usually win. If they don't the Republicans win. Voter turnout is higher when people want to vote for the Democratic nominee. No one really wants to vote for Biden. Most of us will vote against Trump myself included. That being said, if we run a very unlikable candidate against him like we did in 2016, he might win and that's terrifying. This election is serious so we should take it seriously and run somebody likeable and not half way to being a turnip.
God forbid if Biden stays in there, I hope he wins. I'll even vote for him but I am not feeling good about his odds.
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I'm not voting for the insurrectionist in 2024. I don't care how frail Biden looks. The choice is obvious. I'll worry about the next candidate.
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The reality is that with the Republicans embracing fascism America will not recover without the candidacy of another FDR, someone who voters can not only want to vote for but will replace any overly partisan Congresscritter that opposes his agenda.
That's not happening. Period. Maybe the Democrats will win this year, maybe not, but in 2026 and 2028 they'll still be ratcheting America to fascism regardless with their neverending deluge of "moderates" that are always a little more right than before in an appeal to voters who want a dictator instead of picking candidates their base actually wants.
This road isn't ending well no matter what happens.
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I dont care who you vote for. It is very clear to me you will vote for Democrats. That is great.
I do care about who my aunt and her family votes for, a lot. She is democrat leaning. Her husband is republican leaning. They both believe the middle class is getting destroyed by politicians for the last 2 decades. They are both retired. They used to be middle/low income. These days they are clearly low income.
- In 2004, they both voted for Bush.
- In 2008, they both voted for Obama.
- In 2012, they both voted for Obama.
- In 2016, they both claimed to vote for Trump, although I believe my aunt might have voted for Hillary. (Uncle has military background. He kept saying if he did what Hillary did when he was in active duty, he would be in prison for the rest of his life.)
- In 2020, they both voted for Biden.
For the last 2 years, they both are saying that they don't want to vote for Trump but Biden destroyed the economy for middle class. It was clear they might give Biden another shot if he managed to recover the economy before the election.
Ever since the debate, they both are dead set on voting for Trump. All I hear is "Of course the economy would be bad, he is senile." or any "Of course xyz would be bad, he is senile."
As I said, I don't care who you vote for. I care for the votes of people that have not decided whether to vote for Trump or Biden. In the debate, Biden lost a lot of them. Biden lost that debate, clearly! Saying "they both are senile" or "Trump lied during the debate" is damage control by Dems. If Dems insist on going forward with Biden, Trump will be president. I am sure of that.
Now you can say my aunt and her family are stupid. You can say I am stupid for not changing their minds. You can say Trump is an insurrectionist and we are all stupid. You can even say all of the Americans are stupid, it is your first amendment right. You can down-vote me to hell if it makes you feel good. None of these will change the fact that my aunt and her family will vote for Trump unless Dems change the candidate or Biden manages to shit rainbows and use it to gift a million dollars to my aunt's family.
At this point being a Biden apologist is the same thing as voting for Trump. Trump will win.
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The choice is obvious to you. Not to the average American.
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Hey it worked out well when they protected Hillary.....
Wait no it didn't
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Agree, this astroturfing is insane. I can't help but think it's a coordinated campaign, because Biden was very clearly senile in that debate, if not something worse. Democrats can still win if they let Biden retire and choose someone who can rebut Donald Trump.
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Just look at my two recent submissions to c/politics that were immediately down-voted anonymously for highlighting FOCUS GROUPS of UNDECIDED SWING VOTERS.
Not one substantive argument.
And you know I can't tell if it's scared Dems, or astroturfing right-wing operatives trying to ensure we maintain course with this sinking ship.
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How can someone even expect him to not be senile at this age.
I can’t help but think it’s a coordinated campaign,
Social media with bots and shit allow for such, yes.
By the way, I don't think the organizers of this campaign want Dems to win. They want Dems to lose.
It may not be seen from the US and the EU, but Trump's presidency has helped quite a few disgusting things to start happening in various parts of the world, though they continued during Biden's presidency.
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Bush was clearly the face man of an executive admin that he didn't run, he was s figure head. Clinton, it was assumed by the press and a lot of the voter base wasn't running his admin, the first term Hillary was said to be running things and a slew of technocrats was assumed his second term, Reagan, we now know historically, was experiencing Alzheimer's all through out his presidency, much like Trump, he also had a strict schedule of not even pretending he showed up to work.
There's nothing wrong with electing the face of an administration you want in office, this is largely Obama's admin still running the government, that's what we all want. Unkie Joe can take all the naps he wants, it make no real difference.
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I don't know why everyone thinks this is some rarely understood point. I think most people get this.
However, You have to be electable to a country where 30 to 40% of people. Think Trump is a god king who can do no wrong and never lies. Hillary's administration almost certainly would have been better than Trump's. Hillary still lost. Biden running as he is now is dangerous. That's where it makes the real difference. Biden might lose to trump and we might get Trump again. Any other sane and half way competent milk toast politician won't have that problem. Biden continuing to run is a danger to democracy.
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This is a really important point.
The president is really only as good as his staff. They can only do so much as an individual person.
Joe Biden knows how to hire a good staff, and respects the limitations of hisnl office.
Meanwhile, if Trump could've harnessed the energy from his revolving door of "loyalists", we might've been able to stay under 2°C.
But, part of Project 2025 is actually planning to make 50,000 merit-based non-political positions (basically middle-management, and sometimes lower, at NASA or ATF or Dept of Education or FDA) into political appointments, and fire them if they don't toe the party line. In order to circumvent Congress and run everything unilaterally.
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This is a terrible sentiment. Yes, no leader can do things by himself. But he needs to be present. He needs to understand what is going on. He needs to be able to resolve conflicts and make decisions. And he needs to smell it, if someone is trying to sell him bullshit.
Do you think the administration is just all great teamplayers who have no agendas of their own, who have no conflicts or problematic histories with each other? Of course not.
Think of it like any team sports team. You cannot win the superbowl or champions league with a bad trainer.
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I think it's more insane to say that Biden doesn't have a chance against Trump when he's already beaten Trump once, which is why he's President Biden.
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Well I hope you're right but I and many other see it differently. 🤷
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And the guy who already beat him once just isn't good enough huh
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Biden seems to misunderstand why he won.
He seems to think that people were really impressed with him as a candidate and that since he's so much more impressive than all the other potential Democratic nominees, he's the only logical choice to try to beat Trump.
He certainly enjoyed the support of many people who believe that but he relied heavily on the support of several other cohorts to push him over the edge. Those cohorts didn't like him. They didn't like him at all. They just hated Trump more, held their noses, and voted for Not Trump.
Biden has been telling several of those cohorts that their priorities don't matter. He had tenuous support from those groups and he took that support for granted. Many of those groups are now thinking, "You failed to deliver on the one thing we wanted from you. I no longer see you as a significant improvement over Trump."
Claiming that they're just throwing a tantrum over a raspy voice further trivializes their concerns and pushes them farther away.
A clever MAGA troll would make exactly this kind of post. All it does alienate critical voters from Democrats.
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Did you see the debate last night? That ain't the dude who ran in 2020. Also I think the political pressure pot of 2020 was unique because people were trapped inside and forced to watch the news even more. People would have voted for anyone but Trump then. There's still a lot of people that feel that way myself included. But not everyone who felt that way in 2020 feels that way in 2024. That's just the reality. I really don't think Biden has it this time.
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Biden literally hung his mouth open like a brain dead zombie. He lost his train of thought multiple times... He said "we beat Medicare" ffs. Wtf does that mean?? I want to defeat Trump, but Biden is not going to accomplish that. Change the Democratic candidate before it's too late.
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Even he agrees he isnt. How does it feel to be this wrong lol.
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Any other candidate just wouldn't have the name recognition. Millions of Americans just vote for the incumbent regardless of who it is
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Is this the new liberal bible prayer each night? Keep telling yourself
god is real and he loves youBiden will win because he's a "good" choice for the idiots who don't know better? -
Hey now that we have the benefit of hindsight I just wanted to show you how wrong you were and how confident you can be that youre right when you're so so wrong please be a little more open-minded going forward and listen to people😏
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raspy voice
The gaslighting will continue until morale improves.
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The people here are either delusional or trying to convince themselves they didn't see a disaster of a debate.
"So he didn't somersault onto stage" That... That's not the issue here
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Legitimately I can't tell how much of it is self-delusion and how much is just blatant lying. Either way, these geriatric ghouls don't deserve this level of mental gymnastics.
Even liberal media like the NYT are admitting it, and we can all see him with our eyes, I don't see what this sort of blatant denialism is supposed to accomplish other than demonstrating in-group loyalty.
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Alternative is 4 years of more maga federal judges causing multiple generations of damage. It doesn't matter at all about Bidens health. He has advisors. He has a vice president. No one would be filling federal benches in sewage. That it all that matters.
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Debates are little more than performances and Joe completely shit the bed.
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This. Debates mattered 20+ years ago, when Candidates had just a few opportunities to talk about who they are, what they've done, what they want to do, and why those qualities make them the best choice for President.
Now, we have a near inescapable connection to politics. The content of the message is known, and the only reason for debate is confrontation, and delivery is all that matters.
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I'm sure I didn't originate that, but it's fun to see it said.
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People aren't even giving him crediting for beating Medicare!
/s
In all seriousness though, I just can't understand how someone can watch the 2020 debate and 2024 debate, and say the only thing wrong with Biden was his voice...
Like, he wasn't great in 2020, but 2024 made it sound like Obama in comparison.
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The worst part is he was coherent afterwards. The fuck happened.
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he was coherent afterwards
He was reported coherent as soon as he was off camera.
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He's at his very best when it comes to small talk & happy talk with small crowds of people. Small lines, empty promises. Quick touch-and-go interactions. No opposition. In debates where he's required to explain himself, answer lines of questioning (without teleprompter), not so much.
It's also possible he got another shot of drugs post-debate to perk him up for the crowd of his own supporters.
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Funny the way you mentioned Obama because you are spot on.
Obama was by far the best US president in recent history and maybe ever. Then the Dems just went like OK we'll never ever do something like that again.
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As a European, I miss seeing Obama being nice to everyone he meets. I also liked the tan suit btw.. Shame he didn't run again.
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Biden has been a far more successful president than Obama when it comes to implementing policies in a progressive direction.
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Then the Dems just went like OK we’ll never ever do something like that again.
I mean, it's because instead of pulling the DNC left. He just abandoned it because it was a relic of the past and it was easier to just ignore the DNC and let state parties handle their own shit.
His mistake was not completely burning the DNC down. So after he left office and moderates retook control in 2016, they've made a lot of moves to ensure a moderate or Republican are the only two options.
People talk about how much Obama pissed off trump.
But its nothing compared to how much Obama pissed off "moderates".
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Obama was by far the best US president in recent history and maybe ever. Then the Dems just went like OK we'll never ever do something like that again.
Here's what I told someone else:
The Dems lost the house of representatives in Obama's years 3 and 4. Again in years 5 and 6. And then lost both the house of representatives and the Senate in Obama's years 7 and 8.
You need more than just the president. They lost in 3 out of 4 of Obama's cycles. And you're wondering why they aren't running to the left? They lost 3 out of 4.
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RBG, Feinstein, now Biden. Selfish geriatric boomers should learn when to retire.
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most important thing is that he can still use his arm to sign legislation. that's all you need him for. the actual deal is the cabinet. that's what you're voting for.
too bad most people don't think about that, and fuck the dnc for putting the country in this situation.
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This is a terrible sentiment. You need a team and you need someone to lead that team. Having the leader just be a puppet is terrible.
You'll get a dysfunctional cabinet this way, you will get grifting, taking advantage of the puppet showing his face to bad ideas and you will get foreign influence prying on the weak puppet president.
And even if the president is not a puppet and "only weak". We have a government falling apart and in deadlock because of our chancellor being a weak leader in Germany. The only thing holding them together at this point is the fear of them losing power sooner in an early election. All it does is give even further rise to the fascists.
You need a competent leader at the head of the cabinet. And that starts with her or him having their mental capacity.
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Biden has been president for almost 4 years and we haven't seen any of those things. That's how I know all this FUD is overblown. The things you are describing were rampant under Trump, not Biden.
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No. Just no, dude. 64% of Democrats thought he was too old to run, and the party didn't even hold a primary. Then he walks out for his first debate and gives an incoherent performance that completely validates everyone's fears about his age, and you want to play it off with a, "bUt HeR eMaiLs!" meme? Screw that. We shouldn't be trying to convince people they didn't see what they saw, we should be figuring out how to get him off the fucking ticket.
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Why does nobody ever talk about how Trump is too old to run?
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Trump could be the youngest presidential candidate in history and he would still be essentially just as bad. Possibly even worse. If Biden didn't have these excruciating moments where he seems super senior and gets incoherent he would be pretty good. Unless you happen to be a Palestinian obvs.
Anyway, people have higher standards for Biden and THEY SHOULD.
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I tried convincing trump voters hes shit long ago, but every conservative community immediately bans me.
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- They do, but it's always coupled with a mention of Biden as part of a "both sides" argument
- Biden's age is the most problematic thing about his candidacy. For Trump, it's the least because it's overshadowed by so. many. other. problems that are so much worse (being a treasonous fascist, for example).
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Because it's far down on the list of reasons he shouldn't be president.
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Fucking exactly, amen. Biden couldn’t make any sense. Trump should be in jail, and Biden needs to be replaced on the dem ticket asap.
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Gaslighting the public in to maintaining the status quo for the rich and powerful..
E: and before the die hard liberals descend on me and accuse me of being a trump supporter because they can only see the world in blue or red - the alternative being worse doesn't make your guy any good (nor did I mention the word "vote" - or don't - once), it only proves that the system is rigged to never serve you. Now if only you were willing to confront this admittedly uncomfortable fact and move on from the fairy tale you've been sold, we might actually get some progress instead of treading water by "reducing harm" (all the while harm is not actually being reduced, we're just being held hostage in exchange for it theoretically not getting worse)
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It's been obvious for a long time and the lies just kept going. Now, instead of eating shit, they're changing the narrative. If you see through it, though, welcome to Moscow, comrade!
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Sure, let's all pretend the problem was his voice. Ignoring all problems will do wonders in november.
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No one is ignoring the problems...aside from the talking heads who are rambling on about this
As another said: vote for the Biden team, not Biden
Else you get trump and Jared kushner again
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We should all be screaming at the top of our lungs for Biden to drop out now. Fast. Throw in Newsom or Whitmer. I'll vote for either, doesn't matter.
This is a no brainer, and no loss. Either they do it which would be great, or we're stuck with biden anyway, who now looks to be much worse off against trump.
Everyone should be telling biden to drop out. Everyone everyone everyone. And loudly.
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It doesn't matter who you or I will vote for. People that understand the danger of Trump would vote for a ham sandwich. What matters is who swing voters and never-Trumpers will vote for.
Most of them would never vote for anyone from California because that state is synonymous with the worst problems of the left. They would also never vote for Whitmer because she is a self described progressive (and let's be honest, being a woman doesn't help with more traditionally minded centrists).
Jared Polis would be ideal, although I would bet unfortunately being gay and Jewish would hamper him. His type of politics is exactly what we need to appeal to those toying with the idea of Trump.
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I dont think anybody actually likes Newsom, hes a rich bastard who basically everyone dislikes. He aint got the respect Brown has due to just being a decent bureaucrat he doesnt have the goodwill of Schwarzenegger due to atleast trying his best. Hes just a dime a dozen slimeball politician nobody actively likes.
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Exactly, anything will be better than trump/gop
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I’ve dropped emails to Schumer, Jeffries, and my local senator and congressmen to tell them that Biden should drop the fuck out. Those that are going to vote blue are going to vote blue regardless. No one who was voting against Trump is suddenly going to switch it up.
If Harris. Comes the pick, that’s the only wild card I see. She will alienate a lot of folks because she isn’t as progressive as media is making her out to be. And let’s face it…racism and sexism.
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If Harris. Comes the pick, that’s the only wild card I see. She will alienate a lot of folks because she isn’t as progressive as media is making her out to be.
I don't think I can comfortably vote for someone who made their career as a prosecutor, she may as well have been a cop. I didn't like her as VP either for the same reasons.
Didn't she make a name for herself as a DA aggressively procecuting for MJ? People who statistically looked a lot more like her than me? So we get slow roll fascism instead of a sprint?
(heads to wikipedia)
She prosecuted more than her predecessor, and her replacement issued blanket pardons back to 1975. So that was an option she had but chose not to take, as I see it.
Under Harris, the D.A.'s office obtained more than 1,900 convictions for marijuana offenses, including persons simultaneously convicted of marijuana offenses and more serious crimes.[76] The rate at which Harris's office prosecuted marijuana crimes was higher than the rate under Hallinan, but the number of defendants sentenced to state prison for such offenses was substantially lower.[76] Prosecutions for low-level marijuana offenses were rare under Harris, and her office had a policy of not pursuing jail time for marijuana possession offenses.[76] Harris's successor as D.A., George Gascón, expunged all San Francisco marijuana offenses going back to 1975.[76]
I'm not a single-issue voter on MJ, but I think it's a decent indicator of where her head was at.
Sure, if they put Harris up will I vote for her? Yeah. Then in 2028 they'll tell me I have to vote for facist-lite again because Democracy is stil under threat even though Trump's heart explodes from all those cheeseburgers in 2027, so she'll get a second term. No real chance of real progressive policies or whitehouse-driven police reform until 2032.
I've never seen Biden look as bad as he did in the first debate, so I'd like to see how he is in the second debate before I kick him to the curb. Then maybe we get someone who isn't so cozy with police in for 2028 instead of Kamala's second term.
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Honestly, maybe I am a bit detached with my European perspective but doesn't the president come with a lot more? An entire cabinet of ministers, the parliament etc. So even if the president is not your type of person, maybe it doesn't matter much?
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You are exactly correct. A lot of Americans think of the President as the sole arbiter of government authority, despite the fact that they are just the head of one of three branches of government. As head of the Executive, they have a ton of agencies and advisors who report to them.
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This is true, but the president (or presidental candidate) is also the face of their backing party, and that matters a lot. We've seen other people try it, but Trump is the only one who can really whip up the MAGA frenzy, which is why conservatives have painted themselves into a corner with him. Likewise, Biden represents what democrats find frustrating about the party: out of touch geriatrics who promise nothing but more of the same.
So yeah, while the president isn't doing most of the work directly, they set the tone, and they have a lot of influence over (or direct power to appoint) people who run major things.
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Genuine question from a non American, what happens if Biden wins presidency but then dies in the first year in office?
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Full senile moment = "raspy voice"
Biden apologists are gonna be the reason Trump gets elected.
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I mean if Trump gets elected, it'll be because people would rather have a felon conman narcissist racist rapist wanna-be-dictator idiot over someone with "senile moments." Call me an apologist, but the blame should fall with the morons that think the guy who literally tried to illegally have the last election thrown out was the right choice there.
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Biden apologists are gonna be the reason Trump gets elected.
How the hell does that make sense to you? Do you have a viable alternative?
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Literally what I said.
People sticking their head in the sand and believing every voter is as much of a cultist as them. Did everyone forget 2016?. The Democrats are refusing to run anyone else because of all the cultists that will let them get away with not appealing to anyone and still voting Democrat.
Jill Stein is not just a viable alternative now, it's the only chance there is to beat Trump.
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This whole night was so many layers of exhausting, but probably not for the reasons you think... No rational, serious person was expecting Biden to Willy Wonka front somersault into this debate? it was going to be what this was, the only true surprise was probably the volume of his voice (which they chalk up to a cold, okay fine, I guess) and actually how well he did quickly processing and responding to trump's gish gallop and unchecked stream of consciousness mistruth firehose with little help from the impotent moderators for the majority of the night.
The people in this country, in their immediate reaction to this debate, demonstrate that they just fundamentally lack the focus, empathv and frankly basic intelligence to process the substance of this or any debate. On average, we respond solely to voice pitch, tonality, body language and facial expressions, like a still developing toddler... Or a dog.
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You know the moderators are there to enforce the rules of the debate, right? They aren't live fact checkers. Their job is to manage clocks, present questions, and occasionally, ask a followup question, not to defend one particular position or person.
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Strawman, nobody is arguing the point you're trying to make about the moderators themselves? I'm citing CNN as host and moderator, their anchors are just deaf weight seat filters under strict orders from zaslov and the billionaire.
They are saying that the network that wraps and produces the entire thing should have done it with a real time overlay graphic fed by a room of professional fact checkers working in real time to provide context (you did notice that the debate was coming into your living room through a magic plastic box and it was not actually a tiny window into a tiny room in your home that held two tiny old men inside arguing, right?)
This is extremely simple and completely necessary with trump - simple because he just repeats the same 5 lazy, limp lies, you wouldn't even need to research in real time, just 5 big brightly colored buttons to press that display pre-written fact check graphics for each of those stale lies.
Imagine in your opinion though, a plain text box that says, "There is no support CNN has found for Mr. trump's claim that 'everyone in Mexico is a terrorist that is both murdering, and has just been murdered, at all times.' is "defending one particular position or person".
Child.
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I have no faith in the future and only pray death is swift and merciful. I will vote Biden in hopes of delaying the inevitable another four years.
I was hoping that the Right's march into fascism was going to be the call to action that Americans needed to abandon them and push the country into being a proper developed nation....
Instead, people go along with it to own the libs, and the privileged who know better have the resources to stamp their foot and wait for a savior they should know will never come.
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It wasn’t so much the voice that was the problem, it’s that his answers were often bad and totally incoherent.
If he was clear and concise, I’d deal with the raspy voice.
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Except he didn't just have a raspy voice. He was mixing up words, rambling, even struggling to put full sentences together at points. And when he wasn't talking he looked to be spacing out at times, just trying to hold it together at others. His performance was as if he was fighting a very high fever, a migraine, and/or was trying not to puke the entire debate. I totally believe reports that he had a minor illness and was having an off day as a result, but unless he had something like the flu (in which case he wouldn't have been allowed on stage, certainly not that close to Trump) it would be completely reasonable to expect him to perform much better even while sick.
I think that matters to voters, because as president you don't get to take a sick day; shit goes down and you need to be there for it. Maybe he's not too old to be president on days when he's feeling well, but I think a lot of viewers last night thought he looked completely incapable of handling any kind of sudden crisis in his condition last night.
Obligatory: assuming he's still the nominee I'm voting for Biden in November anyway because all the alternatives suck more.
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Exactly, he was served up tons of opportunities to make great and compelling points and garbled them all. Trump is so terrible of a candidate you can think of anything at any time and make a great case against him. Biden sounded months away from hospice care.
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As an european, what scares me , it is that Biden is the ACTUAL president. If he suffers from dementia, who is really in charge now. Who takes the decisions? Usa are involved in at least two major wars and dictate the policy to the europeans. Who is responsible of that? If biden cannot be a candidate , why it is an actual president?
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The VP takes charge, we have the position for a reason. One of the better elements of the presidency is that there is a clear line of succession and even a good bit of "we dont fucken know whos alive" backups.
Also Reagan was already president and utterly demented.
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Also Reagan was already president and utterly demented
And look how that turned out...
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The cabinet, and the heads of federal agencies who are appointed by the president (everything from the FBI to the EPA), is doing the actual running of the country. In particular Biden just signs off on whatever they tell him to, as an individual, I don't think he has been making any serious foreign policy decisions himself.
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Chief of Staff is Jeff Zients, a former Bain Capital guy
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He almost certainly has a great team doing a lot. Biden isn't perfect but knows how to delegate. He doesn't need to be that lucid if he can delegate well. He still may not be reelectable.
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If he suffers from dementia
Other than a few examples of stuttering or mis-speaking, something which we all do (yes, even you youngins), can you provide any clinical evidence that Biden has dementia?
Because all I see is the proven effectiveness of GOP marketing and it's influence even on people who are disinclined to believe it.
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They're both going senile
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You should watch how you talk. We do more than any of you countries. We send more aid and supplies to Ukraine to Israel than any of you fucks and your golden leaders you love so much. We train and run war simulations with allies in hopes of preventing war. Our economy is doing the greatest it has. All that with a 'dementia riddled' leader. You should wish you accomplish what that man does.
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He needs to withdraw. He has to. The man looks like he's dying. It's time to stop playing pretend. This is fucking stupid. He's literally not physically capable of being president. He doesn't just have a raspy voice, he rambles incoherently, he can barely seem to register what's going on at any moment. He nods off in public. He's ancient. He should be no where near a political office.
If he runs he's handing Trump the presidency. And I don't even fully believe he cares. If he cared he would never have run in the first place. He also chose to hammer home on his unending support for Israeli colonialism and crimes against humanity. Just to further aleniate the progressives and moderates who want him to stand up for human rights.
I have no faith in him to drive a car let alone handle the political office of the presidency. He could be a literal corpse and he'd still get my vote over Trump. But you're asking people to vote for someone who is openly incapable of doing the job he's campaigning for. He HAS to step down. He CANNOT defeat fascism. He is not capable of it and he is so chronically neoliberal that he cannot even create a strong opposition to fascism.
We're all freaking the fuck out because this is the worst scenario. The one we ALL SAID WAS COMING. We were all told not to talk about how old he is Trump is old too and all that. And Trump absolutely is old but he's a fascist for one and fascists vote differently than anyone else does. But much worse he always rambles incoherently so standing next to Joe he looked as he normally does and Biden was the one who had visibly aged.
Enough is enough is enough he has to go. Where is the real political effort to have him withdraw. The clock is ticking until November and he HAS TO GO.
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People acting as if Trump or Biden would run the show. Biden has a cabinet of people and appointees who are putting in place their policies put together by experts. His policies have mostly benefitted the lower and middle class with a focus on bringing manufacturing back to America and improving infrastructure.
Then theres Trump and Project 2025.
I think I'll be voting Blue, regardless of who is running.
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People acting as if Trump or Biden would run the show.
So in other words, you think the president should be a puppet? Because that is the implication of responding to "dude is unfit for the office" with "well he is not running it anyways, he's just the face."
I don't know of a single country run by a puppet that was run well. What you get instead is all the worst people to take advantage to put their personal benefit in, since it's not their face associated with it.
Also internationally it is very very very bad to be run by a puppet. Nobody will take the puppet serious and everyone will again seek to put their own interests in. We already see that with Israel playing Biden like a fiddle.
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he can barely seem to register what’s going on at any moment.
Saying this out loud hurts my heart. My father has dementia. He was diagnosed 3 years ago. I hope his progress stops or stays at slow pace.
During the debate, I saw a lot of similarities between my father and president Biden when it comes to their reactions to questions asked.
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If only that was an accurate summary of the flaming autopsy of a show.
I agree, better him than Trump, but let's not minimise Biden's interpretation of Monty Burns.
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is there a way to prove content manipulation on a website ? Isn't reddit already super pro democrat... why is this fediverse and others being drowned in this bullshit ? Fuck them both biden and trump and us politicians, they are just puppets. The real masters are the corporations . I thought this website you would see more posts like reviving occupy wall street.
But the corporations they got the money....
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Guys, this dude has it all figured out!!
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Believe it or not, but candidates don't have to be set in stone. I'm no fan of "but we couldn't do anything about East Palestine" Buttigieg, but I'd take him over either leading candidate any day. I have an even lower opinion of Newsom, but I'd even pick him. Biden is no longer in a position to be a strong counter to Trump.
Edit: in anticipation of good faith questions, my top pick of all major democrats would be MN Governor Walz. I genuinely believe he is the most competent leader in the entire country at the moment, but he has absolutely no aspirations for presidency.
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LOL I just had a discussion with someone in another thread about how Walz would be great, but the person I was talking to said he didn't think Walz had the name recognition.
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I think the problem is his national name recognition is from George Floyd protests. (And the Agitators that were 100% from outside our state.)
It was a difficult and challenging time and he rose to it.
Walz is an excellent governor, and he would make an excellent president but I think he’s done after this term.
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Without a doubt, he'd be amazing. Unfortunately his lack of recognition outside of the Midwest is also a huge downside. He'd be seen as a nobody coming from the weird lefty state
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Not a lot of people were fans with Biden hence the non commital votes.
It was trump trial that was likely too fascinating for anyone to pay close enough attention during the primaries though.
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"I thought you said Hillary had a private email server?"
"Yeah, that too."
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Dat cough he had in North Carolina today jeeeeesus I've had a cough like that before and the cold that goes with it is an ass kicker.
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Cope, neolib your corpse-led country will fail if led by either of those two stains
330 million citizen and only those two were viable?
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Am I the only one who remembers that Biden said he would only serve 1 term because the DNC pulled out more trickery to keep Brnie from winning?
They made sure to keep every other candidate up until super Tuesday and then all the other candidates pledged their votes to Biden. Warren made sure to stay in to keep those people who voted for her from voting for the only other progressive.
Harris had the worst showing of the last primary, so why should she be considered a frontrunner. The Democrats are running the same plan they did in 2016 and 2020, but we aren't Trump is a terrible position. U admit that he's a better choice than Trump, because any half-dead moderate Democrat is right-wing enough to be slightly better than Trump.
The DNC is too invested in their Corporate Pragmatism to realize that the only Corporate Elites backing Biden are doing it so that they have a modicum of morality. They don't mind Trump because Trump will give them everything.
The DNC spent too long slowing down the major Trump prosecutions so that they would happen this year instead of last year to help with the election which has backfired. They didn't have anyone to stand out in the last 4 years, just hoped and prayed that Biden would last.
We have 2 people who aren't fit for office to choose from. 1 is a degenerate compulsive liar and grifter, while the other has lost which century we belong too and keeps having senior moments. One will give us Project 2025 and try to declare himself president for life, while the other will not help the regular people because nobody in the Administration understands that Stock values are not a good economic metric for those who can't afford to invest because food, rent, Healthcare, and gas is too expensive for jobs that haven't had a major pay increase in a decade.
Yes I'll vote Biden, but we shouldn't be forced into this.
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Am I the only one who remembers that Biden said he would only serve 1 term
You're not the only one who remembers this, but it never happened. There were off the record aides suggesting that but Biden never made any sort of public commitment or suggestion he would only serve a single term.
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Didn’t stop him from implying it, though,
Or his campaign running with the idea to sell to middle-aged (“younger”) voters.
If we’re going to rag on him for empty campaign promises, there’s much better ones, though.
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I mean you could boycott the election like a lot of us
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Serious question, is it possible that if Biden wins, he could step down and his VP could take over? The guy is REALLY old, so is Trump, there should surely be some sort of age limit.
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I think VP selection will have a massive impact on this election. Trump's choice.will either give people a sense of comfort or pause.
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This post is Similar in vain to the "he had a cold" comments
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Who'd be the dream choice for american democrats? Hillary Clinton? Michelle Obama (who's not even a politician) with Barrack as advisor or VP?
I get that this is Lemmy and most people here are communists who'll say Bernie Sanders, and that's fine too, but wouldn't he turn away a bunch of voters?
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Gretchen Whitmer would be a sane pick.
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It sounds like the DNC is looking at some former state governors. I forget the names but recent governor of Michigan, Kentucky, and Minnesota were mentioned. But I'd put money on them rolling out former California governor Gavin Newsom. He's super moderate, not very likable but not too unlikable, and the only one of the names I've seen mentioned that I actually recognize as someone who pays some attention to the news.
Plus there's an interview where they're asking him if he's going to be picked and he's struggling not to beam like he's just been told he has a shot right now at his biggest lifetime goal.
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Bernie would easily beat Trump. Do I think the DNC would let him? Not without INTENSE pressure. More likely, the DNC would probably go with a Democrat governor from a swing state. At worst, they will run Clinton who already ran and lost to Trump in 2016.
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wouldn't he turn away a bunch of voters?
He'd turn away the 1%...but they're 1%.
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Andrew yang
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To me it seems like it would obviously be Kamala. But people hate her for some reason that people can never seem to articulate. 🤔
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She's a cop that was picked as the VP DURING the George Floyd riots.
Most of her political career has been making laws harsher for every day living and giving the police a higher budget.
I have genuinely no idea why anyone thought it was a good idea to pick a pro-cop VP while the police are actively killing people.
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A raspy voice and a wispy mind
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Chase Oliver for President 2024!
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what a straw man argument
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It is insulting to suggest that this is why people won't vote for Butcher Biden. Then liberals wonder why Arab and Muslim Americans are disgusted not just by Biden but also by the Democratic base that enables the dehumanization of Palestinians.
To suggest that our opposition is merely over "stutter" or "dementia" implies that you don't see Palestinians as people or that their genocide as a valid concern.
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And why exactly do you think Trump would do better? I mean besides his most recent opportunistic flip-flop to criticizing the war for taking too long.
Lessons from Trump’s presidency:
Though Trump has sent mixed signals about his views of the war, his policies as president unambiguously favored Israel.
During his presidency, Trump moved the US embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem and recognized Israel’s sovereignty over the Golan Heights, in a reversal of longstanding US policy. He also slashed funding to the UN agency supporting Palestinian refugees and closed the Palestinians’ diplomatic mission in Washington.
In 2018, he withdrew the US from the Iran nuclear deal, a move cheered by Republicans and Netanyahu. The following year, the Trump administration again broke with decades of precedent to declare that the US no longer considered Israeli settlements in the West Bank a violation of international law. The Biden administration reversed this policy in February
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That's great and all, but we weren't talking about Trump. We're talking about Biden.
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Good thing I never voted for Trump. I voted for Biden despite everything I knew about him because some people promised to push him left. Not only Biden hasn’t undone the evils Trump did but he is competing with him on who is the bigger Zionist.
All the people who have repeated that Biden did a lot of character development and he is no longer the racist guy he was, were either themselves misled or intentionally trying to mislead. He’s the same person who was eager to kill women and children in 1982:
“Begin said he was shocked at how passionately Biden supported Israel’s invasion when Biden “said he would go even further than Israel, adding that he’d forcefully fend off anyone who sought to invade his country, even if that meant killing women or children.”
https://theintercept.com/2021/04/27/biden-israeli-invasion-lebanon/
He also slashed funding to the UN agency supporting Palestinian refugees
The same thing Biden is doing right now https://www.npr.org/2024/02/18/1232301965/the-u-s-is-barring-funding-to-unrwa-the-only-international-organization-aiding-g and this defunding is based on false allegations https://www.npr.org/2024/04/23/1246613547/unrwa-israel-hamas-gaza-war
The Biden administration reversed this policy in February
Yet the settlements are expanding and the US sent more aid than ever to Israel. Until the US conditions aid on the dismantling of illegal settlements in the West Bank and the return of the Golan to Syria, it is all for show.
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