RFK Jr. can't win. But he and Cornel West could put Trump back in the White House.
In a race certain to be close, third-party candidates are not only a problem for President Joe Biden, they may pose his biggest hurdle to reelection.
If anything, RFK will split the Republican (Russian) vote
This author is a dipshit
I don't know this author, but when I see articles like this I always think it's a reverse Hanlon's razor. I refuse to believe the people reporting on it are stupid and assume they're fucking evil.
I said this in another post, but i believe older democrats who dont keep up with the nonsense of politics could very well just see the name Kennedy and vote for him. If we werent in a very red state i would be worried about my grandfather in his 80s doing exactly that.
RFK Jr. is a piece of dog shit drying in the hot summer sun. I can't imagine in any universe this guy (who makes me wish there was a Sirhan Sirhan Jr.) draining votes from Joe Biden when their views are diametrically opposed.
Really, really low-information voters might see the last name and think he's like JFK.
That's most of his base.
RFK is the wish.com JFK.
I support Kennedy. RFK’s sister, who said she’ll vote for Biden over her own brother. lol
They run this same story about third party candidates every election year. The problem is they never show that the people who voted for the third party candidate would've definitely gone to one party or the other. People know what's at stake, why do you assume people voting for RFK Jr would've voted for Biden? There's nothing about his platform that is very left leaning. The most left leaning thing about him is his last name.
Edit: Just as an example, I voted for Nader in 2000. I'm someone who would've voted for Gore otherwise. But guess what? I was voting in a state that wasn't in close contention at all, so I could vote for a third party without really changing the calculus of who would get elected. The idea that votes for third parties are fungible with votes for major party candidates is just not accurate.
Because it's true every time, and it works a lot. Gore would have won if Nader wasn't on the ticket, and guess what? The Republicans have been propping up third-party candidates for years.
Hell, in Florida they got some random dude on the ticket just because he had the same name as the Democrat -- and it worked.
Well, there were a certain number of disaffected Sanders primary voters that switched to Trump when Clinton "won" the primary in 2016. It's hard to believe, given how diametrically opposed Sanders and Trump are, but there it is. Why would they go from a moderate candidate to a far right one? I don't know, and it's really hard to pin down in the data.
That's kind of the problem we have now. Why would someone that was a Biden supporter flip to RFK, when RFK is very clearly significantly to the right, and way off in crazy-land compared to Biden? I don't know. But given how likely Trump supporters are to show up, Biden really can't afford to lose too many to RFK. Or West, for that matter, who is closer to what I'd prefer politically.
Pollsters do ask "if the election was held today, between X and Y, who would you vote for", for multiple combinations of candidates, so you can infer some of those opinions. I don't think they explicitly ask people to rank their choices, or at least I haven't seen those polls.
I believe the latest polls show Bobby Kennedy Jr. taking slightly more support from Trump. It makes sense. In order to support Kennedy, you have to listen to him first.
The conspiracy theorist label stops the left from even considering him. The voters who are more likely to give him a chance are on the right. They don’t care if he’s called a conspiracy theorist.
I think it's a mix that varies state from state based off the latest polling.
Could be, but it’s likely to tend toward Trump voters as time goes on. They’re less resistant to someone being unpopular in the mainstream media.
Being called crazy by the media is a prerequisite for right wing viewers to trust a candidate.
now that he's made a decision, it really just takes one look at who his running mate is that would cause any Leftist to walk away.
Idk he really appeals to my desire to have a stupider, less popular trump. And he's a Kennedy!
/s, because this is the internet
Vote Blue No Matter Who! /s
The problem is the people running the DNC
At some point, we're going to have to make an actual left wing party. Because the only thing the national DNC cares about is money
They don't even know how to spend it effectively when they get it.
Socialist Party of America, Socialist Alternative, The Communist Party of the USA, and plenty others have been trying to run left of the Democratic Party for a century, it won't work in a FPTP voting system, converting the Democrats into a Socialist party would literally be easier.
If you want a left wing party other than the Dems, you're gonna have to change FPTP first.
Or or, and hear me out here. We could do what has happened many different times throughout history. And take over/replace the structure of a party. The Democrats already ignore state and local elections across several red states. What if we lefties/socialist/etc instead of trying to prop up separate parties and separate candidates that always fail. Fielded our own candidates who more closely match our own ideals. And run them as Democrats in these areas. Focusing on funding them ourselves as well as whatever money the DNC apparatus might provide. We might actually start winning. And if we start winning we might actually be able to replace those in the DNC. And if we replace those in the DNC. Things might actually get better.
converting the Democrats into a Socialist party would literally be easier.
They're a private organization...
They'll keep doing whatever they want without changing as long as people keep voting for him.
The only thing the DNC has that a different private party wouldn't is momentum.
If they just gonna keep following the rnc, we have no choice but acknowledging we were abandoned long ago already
Nope, party flips have happened before and they will happen again. You sound extremely condescending for someone who doesn’t know nearly as much they think they do.
The Democratic Party is run by deeply monied interests. You well never succeed in “converting” it to socialism. and no, getting a handful of candidates like AOC elected over the course of a few decades doesn’t show that you can. It actually proves the opposite point.
Today’s Democratic Party is more conservative than ever so all of you claiming we can convert are either incredibly naive, or deliberately trying to sabotage leftist movements.
We should all know by now that that's not how it's going to have to work. The way to change politics in a country isn't from the outside. It's not even from the inside really, it's by getting inside and then tearing out all the support beams of fixtures and rebuilding it from the inside out. That's what conservatives under the Republican party for the last 15 to 20 years. They completely took over the party ousted all the ones that were too moderate for them, they rebuilt their party from the inside to be what it is today. Leftists are going to have to have the discipline to do the same.
I love how democrats scream about a few thousand votes every election. Why is it that democrats cut it so close with a fascist, racist, sexist, dogshit party every election? The democrats should consider that they're doing a shit job and should work to improve themselves instead of shrieking "but other guy!!!" every single election and claiming that everything cost them the election except for themselves. If they lose the election they smugly say "look how right we are with how bad things are!" and if they win the election they smugly say "we won so we must be doing something right, let's keep the shitty status quo going!"
Uhh huh. You seriously think any of the voters that we lose to RFK Jr or West care at all about things like policy or actions of democrats in office? Reality has no place in that discussion. Unless democrats start going for the fringe conspiracy nutter vote, those votes are a lost cause
I would love it if that were the view that most Democrats had - then I could vote for the people I like in peace. Unfortunately, every day we get a new "vote blue no matter the genocide" post trying to shame people into voting for Biden. I pray to one day be a lost cause who isn't worth being yelled at (the earlier the better).
I'm pretty sure everyone cares about their own well-being. I haven't been paying much attention to RFK Jr since he's a non-factor, but at a glance I can see why some would like his policies: https://www.usatoday.com/elections/voter-guide/2024-11-05/candidate/robert-f-kennedy
Yes, there is the whole conspiracy theory thing, but I don't think entire groups of people should be completely written off as crazy since people's justifications and motivations aren't so straightforward. I often see democrats claiming that we shouldn't let perfect be the enemy of good when it comes to faults with their favored candidate, but this luxury isn't afforded to other candidates. If support for genocide can be overlooked, I'm sure far lesser things can be as well (though RFK Jr is the same on support for Israel/genocide as Biden).
Democrats are so used to sniffing their own farts that they don't realize how bad they smell.
I thought that was Jr's goal? He seems to be chumming up with right wing conspiracies pretty well.
how is that going to draw in people who would have otherwise voted for the boring mainstream democratic candidate?
The only person who I've heard be in love with RFK Jr. was a former Trump voter.
American electorate: "Fuck this two party system that prevents real choice on real issues."
Also American electorate: "Damn that third party candidate spoiling things for my side!"
The two party system is not solved by having a third party run. It's the nature of the fptp voting system that it will tend towards two parties. All having a third party run will do is reinforce the idea that you have to pick the lesser of two evils.
The solution to the two party system is to work from the ground up to get the voting system changed. So despite your attempt to shit on Americans, you're the one wrong here.
Pretty much. Someone told me here yesterday that I'd be "voting against democracy" if I didn't vote for Biden. That doesn't sound like a statement from someone who supports democracy.
RFK doesn't appeal to Democratics
A better title would be:
RFK Jr. can't win. But he and Cornel West could make Biden lose the White House.
If Biden loses it will be because of Biden and his 4 years of doing absolutely nothing and not getting anything he promised In to law. Also the genocide. As shitty as it sounds people can overlook the genocide if Biden was actually improving people's lives but they are only getting worse under his presidency.
Biden is an average to above average president.
It's mostly republican lawmakers passing shitty laws in republican states that makes live for many American worse. DeSantis is the one fucking up Florida. Gregg Abott and Ted Cruz are fucking up Texas. Biden has very little influence on that.
And Biden is fighting the terrible decisions from the previous Trump administration. Were many shitty things are only now starting to show their full efect. Like the increase in higher income tax for lower brackets. Or deregulating coal mining operations that were in place to protect rivers, or defunding the women's health budget. Most of these things take time for the average person to feel the impact. And Biden is actively trying to reverse some of them. He recently signed a new bill that gurantees funding for women's health research. Biden rejoined the Paris agreement (which Trump left), with the goal of reducing emissions and combating climate change. And a lot more. But just as with the negative efects taking time to be felt, so does reversing them.
Biden for some reason just isn't liked by many Americans. It has little to do with his policies or (in)actions as a president. People like to bring up the geonicde for why they don't like him. But many of the same people have been critizing him before the situation in Israel even started.
Yeah keep blaming everything except the fact that Biden has assumed dig shit policies since last summer.
And getting Trump back in the WH is the answer to that?
You know this straw-man you've committed to is losing us the election, don't you?
Look at the polling, look at the primaries. Biden has to do better on his own merit. Trump being bad is Trumps issue, not something that will get Biden elected.
This insistence from the neo-liberal wing of the Democratic party that this is how to run a campaign has basically handed the election to Trump. Stop it. Stop giving the election away. Do better.
Same song and dance from the 2 party machine. The way the political system is. This isnt democracy and I'd rather see trump elected purely so he can implode the system. And it'd be entirely the democrats own fault for falling into complete corruption and ineffectuality. Biden is bank rolling and arming a genocide, hes been nothing but a puppet president his entire term and the democratic party has become a corrupt oligarchy just the same as the republicans. This 2 party system is given power only by the willing consent and active participation of the american people. And I think its time that the american people said enough is enough and abolished the two existing political parties completely so that we can form a functional democracy instead of this corporate klepto clown show.
RFK isnt a perfect candidate but hes the best political candidate iv seen run for officeoin my lifetime.
Trump might implode the current system, but a functional democracy won't replace it. It would become a one party system in the style of Russia, trump has been clear enough about that.
Oh no if only Biden could adopt left wing policies and stop doing Genocide then he could get those voters!
No wait they are obliged to vote for God Emperor Biden! The Genocide must flow!!