Real-world CO2 emissions of cars are 20% higher than indicated. For plug-in hybrids they are 250% higher.
Real-world CO2 emissions of cars are 20% higher than indicated. For plug-in hybrids they are 250% higher.
Today, the Commission published its first report on the real-world CO2 emissions of new passenger cars and vans. The report is based on data collected in 2021 from fuel consumption monitors installed on-board of these vehicles.
EDIT clarifications:
- the article is from the European Commission. This thing comes from a serious study based on hard facts and data.
- Check this comment by @wooster@startrek.website, who reported the data.
- Note that plugin hybrids are still better than pure ice, but they were expected to be much better.
It's not a typo: plug-in hybrids are used, in real word cases, with ICE much more than anticipated.
In the EU, fuel consumption monitoring devices are required on new cars. They studied over 10% of all cars sold in 2021 and turns out they use way more fuel, and generate way more CO2, than anybody thought.
The gap means that CO2 emissions reduction objectives from transport will be more difficult to reach.
Thruth is, we need less cars, not "better" cars.
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When I saw the headline, I thought this was clickbait, since the headline and the linked article avoided quantifying how much CO2 the vehicles said they consumed vs the real world usage.
If you dig into the cited materials, it turns out it wasn’t hyperbole.
That said, I still consider it extremely poor form to omit the information the study was centering its argument around.
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Honestly I thought that, being the article on the European Commission website, was a good enough sign of trustable source.
I added a disclaimer at the top of the post hoping to make things more clear
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To be fair, I’m really just judging the EC’s article writer. Not the trustworthiness of EC or the study itself.
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I dont get it. The numbers are all less for the hybrids
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They are a less than full gas vehicles, but they output considerably more CO2 than they are tested and marketed to output.
Many people buy them because they believe they are a green form of transportation based on the marketing. But the real world pollution they cause makes them not very green at all.
This is a significant report, especially when you consider the source.
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Thanks. It sounds like they are greener in all cases. But they're not as green as the industry expected because people aren't actually charging them
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Marginally greener when compared to the most environmentally harmful modes of transportation (I.e. other cars and trucks), but not even close to green when compared to alternative forms of personal and/or public transportation.
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Definitely walking or bicycles is best.
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This is the problem, people who are nervous about charging, or unable to charge at night but want EVs think that a plug-in hybrid will somehow come close enough.
The plug-in bit is key though, otherwise you’re just lugging around a few 100kilos of dead weight.
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That and from what I understand of them they only cover about 25 miles. The reason to get a plug in hybrid vs a full plug in is generally because you need to drive more than that on average. I have a full electric from 2015 with a horrible battery, and on a single charge I can get ~50 miles at most in greater Atlanta area, GA, USA.
That's mostly fine for me, but I once looked up the plug in hybrids for trios etc, and I sometimes forget to charge and have issues having to charge on the road. A plug in Hybrid would have saved me those minor problems, but not because of the electric part. I have a feeling anyone using a plug in hybrid is barely using the battery part of it. I get by because I mostly use the car for shopping, so on average it's once or twice a week, all within 1 battery's usage a day.
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Or because 90% of the time you only go 25 miles and you want to occasionally go to DeKalb market a few times per year
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Sure, my comment doesn't cover every use case, and apologies if it sounded like I was accusing anyone who had one. I'm just saying I know my limitations somewhat helps me decide not to do certain driving, and the ability to just drive without worry might have me drive more often beyond the 25. Even my own driving would often go beyond 25, as H-mart alone would eat 25 for me, so I'd make half my trip on gas everytime.
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I don't live in a car-dependent location, so forgive my ignorance, but wouldn't renting a petro car for those few times a year be cheaper and better for the environment to boot?
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The issue become, Can I get to a rental place? Do they have something to rent to me suitable for my use? Will they even rent to me? How do I get the vehicle back to the rental place? Can I afford the high cash outlay right now?
It's not so easy to rent a car. There are lots of hoops to jump through.
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@SnipingNinja @delirious_owl city residents does the same, even with petro cars: they have small city cars, just to go cheap everyday, and rent bigger comfortable cars for long trips.
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Places with car sharing programs where you rent by the hour, yes.
Cities where you rent cars by the day, no.
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@SnipingNinja
Exactly, have a small electric car for everyday, and a few time you rent a car for the purpose. For example a pickup for carrying stuff, RV for the holiday, or something large and comfy for large distances.
So much cheaper and you always get a brand new car.
@delirious_owl-
Or just use a bicycle and public transport for everyday and carshare for the purpose
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from what i understand, the real world hybrid data is significantly worse than its WLTP test data. so much worse that it's only a 25% improvement over petrol/diesel instead of the 75% improvement that would be expected given the WLTP.
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Wait don't they only get like 25 percent better milage anyway? Why would that translate into 75 percent better CO2
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Because if they are charged regularly then they'll be operated in EV mode most of the time emitting 0% carbon. Plug in hybrids also usually do worse in mpg when in hybrid mode compared to standard hybrids, so if someone buys a plug in but doesn't charge it, it's actually worse than buying a standard hybrid.
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Today I learned there are apparently diesel hybrids. Huh.
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