Supreme Court restores Trump to ballot, rejecting state attempts to ban him over Capitol attack
Supreme Court restores Trump to ballot, rejecting state attempts to ban him over Capitol attack.
If Congress must act to re instate a candidate but almost must act to bar a candidate, why was the amendment written the way it was? Pretty stupid they want Congress to make the determination.
The dissenting opinion puts that into the spotlight. It really is dumb that they're saying even federal courts/administrative bodies can't make that determination.
I'm kinda glad because I don't think trump will win against Biden, but I think Nikki may have. Plus now the repubs are divided a bit between Nikki or Trump and less will probably show up to vote.
No matter what, the next election will suck and if Biden wins, Harris will probably take over as president after like the first year.
No one read beyond the insurrection clause, sec 5 of the 14th says only Congress can remove him
Yet the Court continues on to resolve questions not before us. In a case involving no federal action whatsoever, the Court opines on how federal enforcement of Section 3 must proceed. Congress, the majority says, must enact legislation under Section 5 prescribing the procedures to “ ‘ “ascertain[ ] what particular individuals” ’ ” should be disqualified. Ante, at 5 (quoting Griffin’s Case, 11 F. Cas. 7, 26 (No. 5,815) (CC Va. 1869) (Chase, Circuit Justice)). These musings are as inadequately supported as they are gratuitous.
To start, nothing in Section 3’s text supports the majority’s view of how federal disqualification efforts must operate. Section 3 states simply that “[n]o person shall” holdcertain positions and offices if they are oathbreaking insurectionists. Amdt. 14. Nothing in that unequivocal bar suggests that implementing legislation enacted under Section 5 is “critical” (or, for that matter, what that word means in this context). Ante, at 5. In fact, the text cuts the opposite way. Section 3 provides that when an oathbreaking insurrectionist is disqualified, “Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability.” It is hard to understand why the Constitution would require a congressional supermajority to remove a disqualification if a simple majority could nullify Section 3’s operation by repealing or declining to pass implementing legislation. Even petitioner’s lawyer acknowledged the “tension” in Section 3 that the majority’s view creates. See Tr. of Oral Arg. 31. Similarly, nothing else in the rest of the Fourteenth Amendment supports the majority’s view. Section 5 gives Congress the “power to enforce [the Amendment] by appropriate legislation.” Remedial legislation of any kind, however, is not required. All the Reconstruction Amendments (including the due process and equal protection guaranteesand prohibition of slavery) “are self-executing,” meaning that they do not depend on legislation. City of Boerne v. Flores, 521 U. S. 507, 524 (1997); see Civil Rights Cases, 109 U. S. 3, 20 (1883). Similarly, other constitutional rules of disqualification, like the two-term limit on the Presidency, do not require implementing legislation. See, e.g., Art. II, §1, cl. 5 (Presidential Qualifications); Amdt. 22 (Presidential Term Limits). Nor does the majority suggest otherwise.
No. It says -
The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article.
Which is a repeating of the Constitution in the case of section 3, which says states administer elections unless there's a specific law from Congress. Section 5 uses no exclusionary language to say states cannot enforce the amendment.
Unanimous. Something we are missing?
They were probably all afraid that banning Trump on the ballot would tear so violently at the fabric of the country that it could end in a civil war with armed members of Trump's base roaming the streets creating chaos.
This ruling is very unsurprising to me. I'd been very surprised if they had gone the other way.
The US is a very unhealthy country.
Edit: Spelling
I just hope that by tossing the Republicans this bone, that they will end up not ruling that the president has absolute immunity in the next case.
Losing this one is not a big deal, because he only would have been removed from states that he was almost certain to lose anyway. Republicans love their insurrectionists, after all.
I think with a ruling like this where the intent was so crystal clear that it couldn't have possibly been misinterpreted by anybody yet the ruling was entirely backwards, that now is a good time for a constitutional convention and a total rewrite of the constitution. If it's not clear, let's make it clear.
The problem is this is something that needs to be lanced earlier than later. In almost every historical case of a government in crisis like this, the earlier it is handled, the better the outcome.
Basically this is a test of our country and we can either weather it or not. By deferring it gets worse. For example if we had prosecuted Nixon there would be far less appetite for breaking the rules. And as we go forward extreme opinions will seep further into the intelligence and armed organizations of the government. Whereas a problem now might see the military mostly stay on their bases, in 8 years that could be completely different. Especially if conservatives purge officers not loyal to the president personally.
I'm not saying you're wrong, it's always just so weird to hear people say that they don't just, you know... interpret the law.
Unaminous, but the 3 Liberal judges wrote their own opinion saying while they agreed with the ruling, they feel it should have been narrower, and that the ruling cuts off some legitimate avenues for punishing insurrectionists.
states cannot invoke a post-Civil War constitutional provision to keep presidential candidates from appearing on ballots. That power resides with Congress, the court wrote in an unsigned opinion.
Sec 5 of the 14th clearly says only Congress can remove him
I can see the argument from a certain perspective of the language, outside of context.
But remember when this amendment was passed. Right after the Civil War.
So, they wanted an amendment to bar traitors from federal office. Then they put in a section saying Congress has to actually make laws enforcing that rule, or it does nothing. And then, they didn't make any such laws?!
So, what, they went through all the work to make a constitutional amendment, and then it does nothing?
No, they clearly felt that the rule was clear enough as it was, and section 5 is there to allow Congress to make supporting laws built upon that to help enforce that rule. But that rule should have teeth on its own.
No, it says only Congress can re-instate, the removal is to be assumed.
"Section 3
No person shall be a Senator or Representative in Congress, or elector of President and Vice-President, or hold any office, civil or military, under the United States, or under any State, who, having previously taken an oath, as a member of Congress, or as an officer of the United States, or as a member of any State legislature, or as an executive or judicial officer of any State, to support the Constitution of the United States, shall have engaged in insurrection or rebellion against the same, or given aid or comfort to the enemies thereof. But Congress may by a vote of two-thirds of each House, remove such disability."
Bolding mine.
When do we decide the social contract has been broken?
It has been. The question is when the left takes up arms against the armed and marching right
Oh look another illegal power grab by the supreme dipshits. 14th amendment section 3 states only Congress may remove an insurrectionist's inability to hold office, not SCOTUS.
Unfortunately not a new power grab, they’ve long held that their judicial review is sacrosanct, and they get to pick and choose not just the cases they hear, but also what issues within that case they feel like legislating reviewing. Same again here, the RNC asked three questions and they left most of it wellll alone:
The Questions Presented are:
- Whether the President falls within the list of officials subject to the disqualification provision of Section Three of the Fourteenth Amendment?
- Whether Section Three of the Fourteenth Amendment is self-executing to the extent of allowing states to remove candidates from the ballot in the absence of any Congressional action authorizing such process?
- Whether the denial to a political party of its ability to choose the candidate of its choice in a presidential primary and general election violates that party's First Amendment Right of Association?
#1 & 3 were completely ignored because they’re only willing to craft big legislation opinions on conservative/originalist topics, but “show respect for the lower courts” when it’s convenient for SCotUS
They focused in on the state w/o congress aspect of #2, because it’s the weakest part of the Colorado case unfortunately, and allowed this fig-leaf opt out on disqualification being kicked back to Congress
That's not how the opinion works. The Supremes said states can't remove candidates from the federal ballot under the insurrection clause. They can remove state candidates. It doesn't rule on anything else.
SCOTUS rules the Constitution unconstitutional.
These.Mother.Fuckers...
Trump is never held accountable for his own actions and things will only get worse.
amazing how quickly those states rights arguments evaporate when its not to the republicans benefits, huh
Where them "states' rights" advocates at?
Not advantagous right now. It'll rear it's ugly head again once it becomes politically advantagous to do so.
“I would expect that a goodly number of states will say whoever the Democratic candidate is, you’re off the ballot, and others, for the Republican candidate, you’re off the ballot. It will come down to just a handful of states that are going to decide the presidential election. That’s a pretty daunting consequence,” the chief justice, John Roberts, said during oral argument. (https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/mar/04/trump-scotus-colorado-ruling)
Damn inconsistent of them, being concerned about consequences after the current court's previous rulings.
"If we do the right thing now, Republicans will act in bad faith to do the wrong thing later" is such a bullshit cop-out but it happens all the fucking time.
Democracy is already broken, the popular vote winner doesn't get to be president if they are Democrat, unless the margin is very large.
It comes down to just a handful of states anyway
They won't, but Colorado should still keep him off the ballot. The ruling was clearly made in fear of chaos instead of what was correct, so they deserve chaos irregardless.
Or at least make a show about it, like all those states did when Texas was told to let the fed agents cut the razor wire.
Colorado should still keep him off the ballot.
The final vote is tomorrow. It's far too late to put him back on the ballot.
Even then, I suspect he'll win on write in alone. This contest is functionally over as soon as he's got a majority of the primary delegates, and that's likely to happen a few states after Super Tuesday, given current trends.
So the decision is moot from a "Will Trump be the nominee" perspective.
That is admittedly why I also said "or make a show about it"...
I'm actually not sure if Texas actually did stop the Feds from cutting the razor wire. I actually checked and it seems like the entire story just disappeared from all news after they made a lot of noise on it.
The supreme court is anything but. They are traitors to the USA.
This should be a surprise to nobody; the courts have been largely bending over backwards to accommodate Trump.
The supreme court just ruled that either the 14th amendment requires an act of Congress, despite no such requirement listed in the constitution.
Then you have Cannon, who has gone out of her way to rule in Trump's favor, up to and including the implication that Trump actually is above the law, and has shown she is hellbent on continuing to do so.
The supreme Court is also throwing Trump another bone by delaying his dc trial by 2 months, essentially giving Trump the win by running out the clock instead of ruling on presidential immunity.
The stormy Daniels case is of little legal and even less political consequence, as the case is weak already and Trump is not considered at significant risk.
The GA case is likely to get derailed because Willis couldn't keep her personal and professional life separate, and her handling of the affair puts her credibility in doubt.
At least we have the civil judgement. At least, until Trump finds another judge willing to throw that out too.
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I don't like trump but if you read the wording it says Congress must act to remove him so that's why he is allowed on the states are trying to remove him when only Congress has the authority so a act of Congress could remove him but unlikely to happen sadly.
It does not clearly say only Congress has the power to disqualify. It does clearly state that Congress can remove a disqualification of this type with a 2/3 vote.
The court here has ruled that because of that Congress must act in order to disqualify someone in the first place. Which makes sense to me, I suppose. It's certainly better than the alternative argument that the presidency is not an officer of the United States. The court seems mostly concerned with the balance of power between the states and federal government in the ruling.
But most importantly, it's making it clear that this is not self-executing or self-evident in the same way the constitutional qualifications for the office are (eg age).
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It was unanimous. Against constitutional precedent from the people who wrote the Amendment, btw.
So much for Originalism.
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Keg stands for everyone!
The Roberts court is illegitimate.
More proof.
Eh. There are way more obvious examples of illegitimacy. The fact that it's unanimous speaks volumes for that. There's sound logic here in this ruling. Read the concurring opinion by the three liberal justices and you can see why I think this is mostly the correct answer.
The real illegitimate thing here were all the articles by legal experts saying this was all self-executing and that the status of "having engaged in insurrection or rebellion" is as self-evident as a candidate's age.
Next obvious steps for Colorado should be;
Do nothing
Point finger at Texas
Just the latest reminder that the 3rd Clause of the 14th Amendment isn't worth the paper it's written on.
Edit: Important from the Court's three liberal justices:
"The American people have the power to vote for and elect candidates for national office, and that is a great and glorious thing. The men who drafted and ratified the Fourteenth Amendment, however, had witnessed an 'insurrection [and] rebellion' to defend slavery. They wanted to ensure that those who had participated in that insurrection, and in possible future insurrections, could not return to prominent roles. Today, the majority goes beyond the necessities of this case to limit how Section 3 can bar an oathbreaking insurrectionist from becoming President. Although we agree that Colorado cannot enforce Section 3, we protest the majority's effort to use this case to define the limits of federal enforcement of that provision. Because we would decide only the issue before us, we concur only in the judgment."
surprising absolutely no-one
As much as I hate Trump, I think it sets a dangerous precedent to allow a state to remove a candidate from the ballot pre-conviction. I hope he does get convicted and thus removed from the ballot however
Unfortunately the ruling here means the only method through which he can be disqualified is by Congress. A conviction, even of insurrection, will do nothing to prevent someone taking office.
Edit: actually I'm slightly wrong. If he were charged with insurrection under 18 U.S.C. § 2383 and convicted he would be disqualified because the statute specifies it. He hasn't been charged with that, however.
On the brightside many cynics are enjoying being proven correct once more.
No we’re very sick of being right someone please stop us.
this thing was doomed from the start and the unanimous vote of the Supreme Court shows that. Y'all are overlooking the fact that this keeps red states from taking Biden off the ballot too.
It seems like someone should be eligible for all states or no states when it comes to this question. But a federal court, not only congress, should have authority to convict on these charges and thereby rule the candidate ineligible.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Supreme Court on Monday restored Donald Trump to 2024 presidential primary ballots, rejecting state attempts to hold the Republican former president accountable for the Capitol riot.
The justices ruled a day before the Super Tuesday primaries that states, without action from Congress first, cannot invoke a post-Civil War constitutional provision to keep presidential candidates from appearing on ballots.
The outcome ends efforts in Colorado, Illinois, Maine and elsewhere to kick Trump, the front-runner for his party’s nomination, off the ballot because of his attempts to undo his loss in the 2020 election to Democrat Joe Biden, culminating in the Jan. 6, 2021, attack on the Capitol.
Trump’s case was the first at the Supreme Court dealing with a provision of the 14th Amendment that was adopted after the Civil War to prevent former officeholders who “engaged in insurrection” from holding office again.
Trump had been kicked off the ballots in Colorado, Maine and Illinois, but all three rulings were on hold awaiting the Supreme Court’s decision.
They have considered many Trump-related cases in recent years, declining to embrace his bogus claims of fraud in the 2020 election and refusing to shield tax records from Congress and prosecutors in New York.
The original article contains 845 words, the summary contains 204 words. Saved 76%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
Someone should photoshop 2 pound weights into his tiny hands.
Yeah this was very predictable. It's a presidential election, of course the federal court can override state courts. And the 14th amendment argument always hinged on the question of whether or not Trump engaged in insurrection, and that exact question is already being explored in the same court. And he has not yet been found guilty, so as far as the law is concerned, he hasn't engaged in insurrection.
Everyone's upset because this hasn't gone the way it's supposed to, the DoJ should have charged Trump years ago so things can go in the correct order, Trump gets tried for insurrection, and then cant run for office if found guilty.
I don’t like the guy, but I like even less the government deciding to take candidates off the ballot.
The opinion: https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf
We conclude that States may disqualify persons holding or attempting to hold state office. But States have no power under the Constitution to enforce Section 3 with respect to federal offices, especially the Presidency.
Then I'm sure you like the fact that this ruling means AOC and Schwarzenegger can run this year.
I told everyone for months that sec 5 clearly says ONLY Congress can remove him. I wish I had bookmarked everyone that old me I was a bot or Russian that doesn't know what they are talking about.
Please point out the word "only" in Section 5 to me. I must be blind: "The Congress shall have power to enforce, by appropriate legislation, the provisions of this article."
I guess that must’ve been on your other account then?
On Reddit
