The HDMI Forum rejected AMD's open source HDMI 2.1 implementation

Sounds like hdmi Forum are a bunch of twats. Time for a new format.
- DisplayPort already exists
  
  We cannot have two standards, that's ridiculous! We need to develop one universal standard that covers everyone's use cases.
  
  Hard to find on non-pc gear, but that’s a fair point
  
  And also USB c
- More people should try DP.
  
  I thought I had NSFW turned off... 🤣
- As already mentioned, DisplayPort exists. The problem is adoption. Even getting DisplayPort adopted as the de facto standard for PC monitors hasn't done anything to get it built into TVs.
  
  also there's still no alternative to hdmi-cec

DisplayPort for life!
- Is there a reason or way to prevent display port from having so many connection issues specifically on port replicators (docking stations)?
  In corporate environments I find so many times that you plug them up over and over, unplug over and over and check the connection a million times before turning everything off one final time, holding the power button on everything (kind of like an smc reset) and then booting up everything like you originally did and they come up. Is this a result of the devices trying to remember a previous setup or is their an easy way to avoid it?
  I've hooked up dozens of them and still ran into issues when a family member brought a setup home to work when they were sick last week.
  
  We use Dell WD-19 docks. Not sure if you use similar. Updated dock firmware and laptop drivers made a difference for us with connection issues. Sometimes you gotta perform a reset on them to make them behave (disconnect dock power and USB-C and hold power button for just over 15 sec). Sometimes the laptop NVRAM needs to be reset instead (for Dell, disconnect all devices and power while off and hold button for just over 30 sec). Overall, though, no huge issues with DP specifically if the dock and laptop firmwares are up to date. Third-party docks/replicators definitely have way more issues, though.
- DP for life!
  ftfy
- That doesn’t do audio too though right?
  
  It does since version 1.0 it seems?
  https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/DisplayPort#Features

This is really frustrating. This is the only thing holding Linux gaming back for me, as someone who games with a AMD GPU and an OLED TV. On Windows 4k120 works fine, but on Linux I can only get 4k60. I've been trying to use an adapter, but it crashes a lot.
AMD seemed to be really trying to bring this feature to Linux, too. Really tragic that they were trying to support us, and some anti-open source goons shot them down.
- ive found that the issue in my experience is that X11 only supports a max of 4k60, but Wayland supports 4k120 and beyond. I dont think the cable matters as the same cable im using works on windows with 4k160.
  
  It's a matter of cable bandwidth. 4k120 4:4:4 requires more bandwidth than hdmi 2.0 can provide. You can drop down to 4:2:0, but that's a pretty bad experience and ruins the image quality.
  I've been using an adapter cable, but it's really flaky, I don't know if it's a bad cable or what. But a normal hdmi cable just plain works on Windows, since the windows amd driver supports hdmi 2.1.
- are you unable to use display port?
  
  The OLED TV probably only has HDMI. TVs don’t normally have DisplayPort
- I'm a bit confused by your comment. I have a 120Hz Monitor and use an AMD GPU on linux without issues. Connected via the display port on my GPU to the HDMI Port on my monitor (because samsung does not enable DDC on the display port for some reason).
  
  I'm using an LG C2 Oled TV that doesnt have displayport.

Should… should we sic EU on them?
- They won't change...
  
  Apple didn't want to change either hehe

This sucks as all new TVs use HDMI2.1 for modern features and modern games consoles rely on those for 4k 60Hz HDR, etc.
So now Valve can't just make their own home console with Steam OS for TVs directly (and support high-end features at least).
- I believe this is specifically for FRL. Other features should still work afaik.

So why is it rejected?
Just because they're still trying to use HDMI to prevent piracy? Who in fuck's name is using HDMI capture for piracy? On a 24fps movie, that's 237MB of data to process every second just for the video. A 2 hour movie would be 1.6TB. Plus the audio would likely be over 2TB.
I've got a Jellyfin server packed with 4K Blu-ray rips that suggest there are easier ways to get at that data.
- The CEO's of the media companies are all fucking dinosaurs who still think VCRs should have been made illegal. You will never convince them that built in copy protection is a dumb idea and a waste of time.
  
  Where are they finding dinosaurs to fuck that know what a VCR is?
- HDMI Splitter + capture card.
  No video put on a streaming service produced in the next 40 years will need HDMI 2.1 to display.
- Can't you compress what the HDMI outputs in real time so that it would have a normal size?
  
  Sure. But why bother when you can rip it right from the disc in higher quality than you could ever hope to capture in real time?
- Even despite that HDMI capture is simply an awful way of obtaining that data, it's even more pathetic when that "protection" can be defeated by a $30 capture card on Amazon...
- The profiles HDMI 2.1 enables are even worse - 4k@120fps type stuff. Not exactly something needed for a movie.
- Most people don't pirate 4K media due to file size and internet speed constraints. Most people pirate 1080p video. There's also the prospect of people pirating live television, which HDMI capture would be perfect for.
  
  The raw images are that big, but they're compressed (even losslessly) to a fraction of the size.
  
  Then most people need get a better ISP. My crappy $60/mo fixed 5G can download an entire 4K film in under 10 minutes or start streaming it within a second. Y'all should see if there are any options beyond cable and DSL in your town. You might be pleasantly surprised what's available these days.
- Any good sources on those rips? You can pm of it helps
  
  I just use the trusty old Radarr stack to find them. Pulls from https://1337x.to/ https://thepiratebay.org/ and https://therarbg.to/ on my set up.
  You have to get there early to have much chance of getting a full 60GB+ 4K Blu-ray rip in a timely manner, but the ~15GB x265 rips are indistinguishable to me.
- You can pirate media that uses that new blu ray drm by plugging a capture card into the overpriced compatible DVD player and recording the video. Also, it's a way to transfer saved content from a dvr as their hard drives are always encrypted (do those still exist). The video stream on all this stuff is encrypted with hdcp to prevent this but there exist hdcp strippers. It seems to still be possible to buy them even on Amazon. Stock up before they get banned. Frankly I'm surprised they aren't banned already.

What's the over/under that this was about preventing people getting around HDCP using a modified driver?
- FRL != HDCP. I think HDCP works on Linux already?
- DisplayPort supports HDCP as well though?

Alright, from now on I will never again buy any electronics with HDMI.

No disrespect meant towards GamingOnLinux, but this article from Tom's Hardware has a much better description of what's going on, including quotes.

This is the best summary I could come up with:
If you were hoping at some point to see HDMI 2.1+ on Linux with AMD + Mesa, you're out of luck right now as it's simply not going to be happening.
There's been a bug report on the Mesa GitLab of "4k@120hz unavailable via HDMI 2.1" that's been open for a few years now, with lots of comments and chatter about the issue.
In an update on the bug report, AMD engineer Alex Deucher commented: "The HDMI Forum has rejected our proposal unfortunately.
So if you're on Linux, it's going to continue to be best to buy hardware that uses DisplayPort.
On the NVIDIA side though, it seems like it may not be an issue, as developer Karol Herbst wrote on Mastodon: "Even though AMD might not be able to add support for HDMI 2.1, nouveau certainly will as Nvidia's open source driver also supports HDMI 2.1 so there is no reason to believe that at least some drivers can't support HDMI 2.1
It's quite backwards, but apparently having all the logic inside firmware (like Nvidia does) will probably help us implementing support for HDMI 2.1"
The original article contains 244 words, the summary contains 183 words. Saved 25%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

Boo! Get off the stage HDMI Forum!

Eli5, what are the security risks of my HDMI cable?
- Piracy being easier is the only risk. Once again ruining the experience of legitimate customers to try and stop a thing that they have had no success at even slowing down.
  
  Even further, it made it more expensive to buy products from all the dumb licensing fees that all the middlemen try to shoehorn in.
- The security of mega Corp IP.
- HDMI 2.1cspecs are closed source.
- Having to use systems that swing to more closed solutions is going to degrade security in more places.
- First thing I could think of is taking advantage of the ARC to spy on you.

Always thought that display port is better anyways lol. Anything that HDMI does or have that display port doesnt?
- Support on low end devices
- Audio? Forgive my ignorance, It is out of actual ignorance or rather lack of knowledge
  
  Naah, DisplayPort carries everything from audio, USB, displays, etc. Version 1.2 even allows daisy chaining displays, so you don't have to have number of cables going to your PC. When it comes to audio, version 1.4 supports 1536 kHz maximum sample rate at 24bits and supports 32 individual audio channels. Scary good! Overall it's significantly better protocol.
  
  DisplayPort supports audio.
  
  I'm more recent implantations of DP have audio
- I guess HDMI-CEC and some DRM.
  
  DisplayPort supports CEC and HDCP DRM.
  I have yet to see a reason why HDMI is better than DP other than what port is available on your device.
- Protocol level DRM?

VESA or bust

bastards

If we had to relay exclusively on non-proprietary protocols, I doubt that GNU/Linux would have gone anywhere beyond the Commodore 64
- Linux never ran on the Commodore 64 (1984). That was way before Linux was released by Linus Torvalds (1991).
  I'd also like to point out that we do all rely on non-proprietary protocols. Examples you used today: TCP and HTTP.
  If we didn't have free and open source protocols we'd all still be using Prodigy and AOL. "Smart" devices couldn't talk to each other, and the world of software would be 100-10,000x more expensive and we'd probably have about 1/1,000,000th of what we have available today.
  Every little thing we rely on every day from computers to the Internet to cars to planes only works because they're not relying on exclusive, proprietary protocols. Weird shit like HDMI is the exception, not the rule.
  History demonstrates that proprietary protocols and connectors like HDMI only stick around as long as they're convenient, easy, and cheap. As soon as they lose one of those properties a competitor will spring up and eventually it will replace the proprietary nonsense. It's only a matter of time. This news about HDMI being rejected is just another shove, moving the world away from that protocol.
  There actually is a way for proprietary bullshit to persist even when it's the worst: When it's mandated by government.
  
  AV1 is a good example of a non-proprietary protocol replacing proprietary protocols (h.264, h.265, ...)
  
  DRM is mandatory in any spec you expect content owners to support. We don’t have to like it, but it’s absolutely not going away.
- Why? Most software wasn't proprietary before companies realized they could make more money at your expense (not all the profit is going into making a better product).
  If given the choice of an uncomfortable dormitory or a comfortable jail, at least the residents can improve the living areas in the former.
  
  Parent is right though. Unix being proprietary is why the GNU project was started, and why the Linux kernel and BSDs rose above.