This is genocide by the book. After almost 2 decades of being kept poor & isolated, comes in an ultra modern army to do exactly what?
I'm German and anti Hamas.
Where's the fight against Hamas taking place, btw? There should be footage of destroyed Hamas stuff or some dead Hamas Soldiers to be seen, or am i missing something?
How would you be able to tell the difference between a dead hamas soldier and a dead civilian? They don't carry weapons all the time, you know, and terrorist organizations don't exactly wear uniforms.
I think fighting terrorism and warning citizens before bombing is not genocide. Telling citizens they are, in fact, should not run (hamas does that), is closer to genocide.
Actual process of getting rid of terrorists is not exactly something anyone should require to trust someone, but you can check a lot of videos they publish of destroying specific buildings in Gaza.
Be sure to also check the videos of Palestinians killing innocents left and right in Israel. They recorded those themselves.
Bear with me a bit, if you will. There's a sharp point, at least I think so.
If you've never lived on the ground for a disaster like a hurricane or tornado, it's worse than any picture or video can depict. I wept in the street, on my knees, the morning after Hurricane Ivan. It was 10AM, a cool, leafless autumn morning, but it had been summer 12-hours earlier. 10 of those hours was darkness and that nonstop goddamned freight train sound.
"My god, what happened to my new city?" Had no notion of the blast radius, all I could see was what I could see. Watched the blue fireworks of exploding transformers all night. Still didn't hit me. Thinking I was on my own, I wept a bit when the Guard rolled in. "We're getting help?!
What? Why? How?"
After living though Ivan, I cried my eyes out seeing what happened to my neighbors in southern Mississippi after Katrina. And then I went and saw for myself. My poor words cannot do justice.
My father-in-law, after picking up a pair of Bronze Stars in Iraq, came home and fought his way through to save those people. They sawed fucking houses in half to open the roads. This old white man was so fond of his memories, showing us pictures of the little black kids they gave salvaged Walmart bikes to. He looked like a proud papa. And then he disintegrated.
He was fine after Iraq, held it together. His Katrina PTSD led him to leave his wife of 32-years and ignore his only child, blew his family apart.
And here's the tip of the spear:
This is an order of magnitude worse. This isn't some blameless natural disaster. These aren't first-world country folks, cranking up the gennies, sharing what they got with anyone in need, pulling together in the face of tragedy. This is a modern nation state purposefully and with malice aforethought conducting genocide on a weaker neighbor. National Guard ain't rolling in for these folks. They're truly on their own.
I took it to be them anchoring in their own experiences and trying to use those experiences as a way to help others understand even 1/10 of what the Gazans are going through. Felt like it was coming from a place of support and empathy. I can see your interpretation too, though.
Can someone give me the straight talk on why western countries, who usually at least try to look like they have the moral high ground, are falling all over themselves in support of Israel?
What is the non-conspiracy nutter reason why the US feels the need to provide billions of dollars in support to Israel?
Clearly actions on both sides are reprehensible, some more-so than others. There's no goodies and baddies here. There's aggressors, innocents, and victims on all sides.
Because Israel is ultimately a problem created by western nations like the UK and US, have more similar culture to the west and are their strategic partner for the area whereas the arab nations are traditionally backed by Russia. So they basically HAVE to give them unconditional support to Israel or lose their influence on the region.
War is about resources. USA and Britain don't give a shit about giving the land (that they stole from Palestinians) to Jewish people. Israel and Saudi Arabia are their only ways to project power in the region to have leverage against countries with more oil.
There's the historic precedent that people have already discussed here.
There's the very effective Israeli lobby, which has integrated itself into many different governments.
There's the fact that Israel is pro-western, in the Middle East, so they serve Western interests. They can be the foil for Western influence in the Middle East, without directly implicating the West. Need a weapon site bombed in Iran? Israel will do it. This is probably the biggest reason.
The country of Israel has integrated itself into the Western global intelligence Network, especially in terms of special operations, and special intelligence gathering tools, and a weapon supplier for missile defense, drone defense etc. For all intents and purposes their military ally for the west.
The West has a bias against Muslims, and Islam. Not necessarily a deliberate bias, but there is a bias. There is a reluctance for full trust. Israel is a religious country, based on Judaism, which makes them more palatable for Western people to think about.
All that being said, is Western support guaranteed? No. At the international level real politic is extremely fickle, you have to continue to be useful. If another country with better trade-off showed up in the region, it's very likely they would also receive this Western appreciation.
Hamas are terrorists and Western governments support combatting them. Hamas hides behind civilians who tragically are the victims of the war Hamas started this time
That's not really an answer though - obviously there's a question of degree.
If there were 20,000 terrorists with access to advanced weaponry then a few hundred civilian casualties is probably acceptable. If there's 100 terrorists with access to some home made rockets then a few thousand civilian casualties probably isn't acceptable.
Is the present campaign against Gaza with the mode of engagement by Israel really the surest path to peace with the least civilian casualties? Hard to believe given that there was a stale mate just a few weeks ago.
Besides which, you can't kill all the terrorists, that's not how extremism works.
You said it. Actions of one side are more reprehensible than of the other. In fact, much more reprehensible from what I see.
One side: "We understand you have terrorists, but it's not our responsibility to help you with it because we value lives of our people. We are going to help you with basic supplies like water, electricity, internet etc., and protect ourselves with the iron dome. It all costs a lot but lives are really what matters."
Another side: "Our objective will not be completed until your country and citizens stop existing. We were elected having this objective by our people. We will teach our children that this is also their objective. We will build rockets. We will launch them at you even if some of them may not reach your territory. We will launch them from civillian buildings because we know you care about lives of civillians. You will think twice before launching anything back, and when you do, you will be blamed by the world for killing innocents. We will kill as many of your civilians as we can, by our hands. We will brake their limbs and hold them hostages, even if they are the citizens of other countries. And when you retaliate, the world will blame you for what you have done. The world must understand that by killing your people we fight for our future, and give us everything we need. This will be glorious, and you will die, and we will prosper, and the world will forget we are the killers, and remember you as killers. We will throw every resource we have for that to happen, be it the money we got as a humanitarian aid for our citizens or baby dolls that should be indistinguishable from dead children with some mosaic. Oops we forgot the mosaic. You didnt see it. You are the killers."
Ignoring Jewish settlers in the West Bank, Gaza quite literally being a ghetto full of people forced off their land, the military checkpoints, the complete imbalance of deaths and suffering between the two sides.
As reprehensible as the violence is on both sides, Israel/Palestine is an apartheid state and Palestinians suffer far more than just from the effects of violence.
"War isn't Hell. War is war, and Hell is Hell. And of the two, war is a lot worse. There are no innocent bystanders in Hell. War is chock full of them - little kids, cripples, old ladies. In fact, except for some of the brass, almost everybody involved is an innocent bystander." -- MAS*H
If Israel's genocidal campaign is actually halted (likely temporarily), the lingering effects of this bombing campaign will continue to claim lives. There will be an increase in premature deaths, at least until Israel decides to complete its final solution. Weapons manufacturers and those who use their products aren't known for "green" initiatives.
I would imagine because in the west there is a ton of pressure to side with Israel no matter what, to the point people are losing their jobs for showing any support for Palestine or being critical of Israels actions.
Thanks for the information. I know this conflict has been one of the most controversial and politically confusing wars ever. I guess it's hard for people at large news sites to write about it.
And I've noticed their before and after photos show a before of the suburbs and any after photos showing the city. Cheap tricks. Not that I doubt the main message, but it cheapens the integrity.
In the article linked here. There is one before after and it's a slider. It's the same area. The photos taken from maybe one or two degrees of a different angle so things don't line up perfectly but they line up 99%.
If you're going to criticize them, criticize them for what they've done, or at least link to their disingenuous photos. It's not in this article
We shouldn't take any single news source at face value, every new source has biases, including the political environment it publishes in. The more traditional newer sources like the BBC and Reuters and AP, have the Western bias, and the West is aligned with Israel. So it's difficult for those organizations to talk about the human toll inside of Gaza.
Al Jazeera is based in Qatar, and funded by the Qatari government. They've demonstrated themselves to be excellent reporters, but they have the biases of their environment as well. And some of that bias includes pro Palestinian sentiment.
Net net, the Arab language reporters are more likely to get data directly from Arab sources, Al Jazeera is more likely to have reporters inside of Palestine, and Al Jazeera has the appetite to show the human toll inside of the Gaza strip.
I can't speak for the non-English version, but the English version of Al Jazeera is biased in what they cover, but when they do speak of things I have not noticed any blatant lies.
To the credit of the Western reporters, they're not denying that there's a human tragedy in Gaza, they're just not talking about it. Are they lying? No. But they are demonstrating a massive bias.
I personally consider Al Jazeera a credible source, but a single source, and I still take my news as the aggregate of AP, the economist, Reuters, the BBC, the guardian, Al Jazeera. We can't rely on any single organization to provide us objectivity, cuz everybody has biases. We have to synthesize an approximation of truth by what is said and not said by the various reporters
Paying to knock them down or refurbish them for Israeli settlers once they're done and shrunk Gaza. This is all the long game of Israel finally paying off. The constant stick pokes finally got a response they could use to justify the genocide they've always wanted.
Even more disgusting is so much of the world is doing fuck all AGAIN. So many times we've seen similar circumstances play out to the same end and every time those we could do something don't.