3d ago

Is Fast Charging Killing the Battery? A 2-Year Test on 40 Phones

TLDW; No

Basically the video is testing phones with varying charging speeds and how much battery degrades after 500 charging cycles. Also, the affects on performance after battery degradation at 5:37

Timestamps of some tests:

Test results for different charging speeds at 3:06
Storing batteries at 1%, 50%, 100% at 3:43
Battery performance at 4:42

After 6 mins he talks about why the tests took 2yrs and how they did it 3 times.

Comments

limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
Summary:
When your phone's battery health drops to about 85%, battery life shortens noticeably.
When your phone's battery health falls to around 80%, a battery replacement is recommended.
When your phone's battery health is above 80%, performance is basically unaffected.
- limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
  Not related to the video. But, this guy only has 37 videos yet somehow has 1.5Million subscribers. He also knows geekerwan. Wonder if there's anything sus..
  
  DaPorkchop_ @lemmy.ml 3d ago
  Apparently this is a well-established channel in China, and they've just recently started translating their backlog of videos to English for YouTube.
  
  vodka @feddit.org 3d ago
  If you hit it right with shorts that's not that weird, shorts are huge for driving up subscriber numbers.
  Considering the views of some of that channels shorts, it's probably it.
  
  Fmstrat @lemmy.world 2d ago
  The channel has great, well made content. I think it launched from Shorts and TikTok where there was also a large Chinese population following.
- artyom @piefed.social 3d ago
  Was there nothing about how fast charging impacted how quickly it reached 80% SoH?
  
  limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
  He only checked battery health loss. Not the speed of capacity loss until 80%.
  The end result, it does not matter. Use and charge your phone how you would like to. A few percentage for keeping the battery at 20-80% only to have a reduced capacity from the very start does not make sense.
  
  limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
  SoH?
- mysticpickle @lemmy.ca 3d ago
  Thank you for the summary!
- lightnsfw @reddthat.com 3d ago
  When your phone’s battery health falls to around 80%, a battery replacement is recommended.
  Yeah, just get right on that, it's basically a trivial process.
- bluesheep @sh.itjust.works 3d ago
  Welp fuck me I guess
  
  limerod @reddthat.com 2d ago
  
  75% is not bad. You can still use the phone with some performance loss. How old is the phone? If its been 2-4yrs. A battery replacement is not a bad option.
- quick_snail @feddit.nl 3d ago
  That just sounds like a problem of expectations
Zak @lemmy.world 3d ago
The amount of time the battery spends at higher voltage definitely affects its capacity over time. There's plenty of research on Li-ion battery service life characteristics done with greater scientific rigor than is possible with batteries installed in phones.
It can take longer than the few months these tests required to see the effect. A phone that's usually stored at 60% will eventually show a big capacity advantage over one that's stored at 100%. That's probably mostly true at 80% as well.
For some anecdata, my Pixel 4a has spent most of the past five years limited to 60%. It reports 1152 cycles and 91% capacity.
- rbn @sopuli.xyz 3d ago
  But is there an advantage on artificially limiting your battery to 60% rather than charging to 100% and having 40% degradation at the end of the lifetime? In the second scenario I start at 100% capacity that slowly gets lower and lower whereas in the first scenario I have only 60% from the start and still some (although much less) degradation.
  
  Zak @lemmy.world 3d ago
  The advantage is that I can occasionally charge it to 80% or 100% if the situation demands it.
  
  frongt @lemmy.zip 3d ago
  Yes, but given how the battery charge controllers already manage it, I don't think you'll see a meaningful difference. You'll probably replace it for other reasons before then.
MalReynolds @slrpnk.net 3d ago
What do people think of the chargie ?
The elephant in the room here is charging a battery when it is hot kills it fast. I live in a hot country and my (GrapheneOS) Pixel7 was spicy pillow in 18 months, happily charging away at 50+C at times (I leave it in a wireless charging stand 90+% of the time). Replaced the battery with a iFixit kit and got a chargie, which lets you set a cutoff charge temperature which I set to 33C (and 80% charge). Often in summer it charges only at night. Another year odd later gOS reports 100% health FWIW. Any phones out there that allow limiting charge by temperature natively? These devices all get developed in cool climates and aircon it seems...
- limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
  You can use software to do what you use hardware and software.
  I imagine a tasker or macrodroid profile to limit battery charging based on heat.
  
  MalReynolds @slrpnk.net 3d ago
  Tasker and gOS don't play very well together, you'll need to run (sandboxed) GPlay etc (Tasker is pretty overzealous with DRM, PowerAmp, MoonReader for example let you just authorize it once and then you can rip out GPlay and it's fine, I don't mind paying for good software, I just don't want google) which I don't on my main profile, but I suspect you're right. These days I don't program on my phone (save for a bit of python in Termux), I'd rather VPN to my home network and code on a real computer. If it gets me even two years extra battery life it'll pay for itself.
  Does Tasker literally have charge control these days (I'll assume it has the sensor)? If so it'd make a good, more versatile solution for tinkerers (but probably at least 30% the cost or more give the module buying monetization craziness compared to a set and forget chargie).
mesa @piefed.social 3d ago
Not that its a bad study or anything, but where are the data points? Did they happen to publish their numbers somewhere?
Quite a few components have extensive detail on their specs. IC chips/resisters/etc...etc...
Also android artificially reduces capacity as it gets older. Most of the pixel phones for example will use number of cycles + time to determine the "max" capacity. So it can be artificially worse depending on the model. No idea what iphone does.
- unexposedhazard @discuss.tchncs.de 3d ago
  Its not the best test imo. He only did 500 charge cycles which is more like 1.5 years worth of charge cycles. But even having data for 2 years isnt very useful. If you replace your phone after 2 years then there is no need to care about battery life at all. This whole thing of preserving battery life is something for people that want to use a phone for 5+ years without needing a new battery.
  In the first place, people have already done professional studies to analyze all kinds of lithium battery capacity degradation over many cycles and thats where the 30-80% number comes from. The whole introduction to his video is "there is a saying", so all he had to do was actually look at the research where that "saying" came from. Then he could have still run his little experiment in an attempt to replicate parts of the study. Instead he basically told the viewers "if you throw away your phone after 2 years, then you dont need to care about charging limits" which is very useless information.
  After 1500 cycles the difference between the 5-100% and 30-80% system would be so drastic that you wouldnt be able to really use the first one, while the other one would still work decently well.
  
  amorpheus @lemmy.world 3d ago
  This whole thing of preserving battery life is something for people that want to use a phone for 5+ years without needing a new battery.
  That's a narrow point of view. It's also reducing the ecological impact if a device's battery isn't trashed after two years, someone else would likely use it.
  
  XiELEd @piefed.social 1d ago
  
  But even having data for 2 years isnt very useful. If you replace your phone after 2 years then there is no need to care about battery life at all.
  When I was younger my mother would scold me for needing a replacement phone every 2 or 3 years because of how much they cost. Aside from gaming I was also working on schoolwork or reading stuff on my phone because I had no computer, and I often charged my phone to 100% while doing those things causing it to overheat and charged it by 20% so that wasn't doing wonders for its lifespan. Man if only I knew. So it grinds my gears when I see someone dismiss battery lifespan concerns by assuming you'll want to buy a new phone in 2 years. My mother's phone has been with her for upwards of 5 years and she's perfectly content with it. And because I invest my time in only one game (the same one for years) there is no need for performance upgrades. So what's the point of buying a new phone every two years?
- quick_snail @feddit.nl 3d ago
  It's a bad study
- limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
  Not that its a bad study or anything, but where are the data points? Did they happen to publish their numbers somewhere?
  Atleast cannot see anything in this video. Maybe, on weibo?
  Also android artificially reduces capacity as it gets older. Most of the pixel phones for example will use number of cycles + time to determine the "max" capacity.
  About android. Is there any report about android in general or just pixel?
  Also, Good point about pixel. The forced capacity reduction cannot be stopped by the user.
  Iphones reduced Soc performance in the past. Now, they do when detecting low voltage on your ageing battery and provide a bypass.
  
  mesa @piefed.social 3d ago
  About android. Is there any report about android in general or just pixel?
  Im only aware of pixel ATM. Thats a good point. Im not sure if google only made this change on pixel or with other phones somewhere in the blobs they distribute. According to the video above, it sure seemed like it as not reducing capacity if the reading was correct.
  Not familiar with weibo. Ill take a look, thanks.
Kairos @lemmy.today 3d ago
Charging the battery kills the battery yes
violentfart @lemmy.world 3d ago
The message is correct as modern phones are able to take care of their batteries.
The experiments themselves were very flawed.
Avid Amoeba @lemmy.ca 3d ago
- limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
  Avid Amoeba @lemmy.ca 3d ago
fuckwit_mcbumcrumble @lemmy.dbzer0.com 3d ago
I want someone to make a slow charger with PPS to compare them. My phone on a "slow charger" gets about as hot as when I use a fast charger with PPS. But a fast charger without PPS and it gets extremely hot and slows down charging a lot. Especially when I leave it on my bed. That definitely is not good for it's health. They charged their phones in little stands which gets them plenty of airflow to keep them cool.
It looks like the iPhone 12 doesn't support PPS. Fast charging could be even better if they used a device that supports it.
- limerod @reddthat.com 3d ago
  The charging tech does make a difference on charge speeds and heat. But, PPS should not make much of a difference. especially against advanced chinese charging tech solutions.
  My phone gets hot when I use a slow charging. But, Phones using SuperVooc charging tech do not have heating issues when charged with them. Because they have most of the charging logic in the charger and not the phone.
  So, your phone can be pumped with 60-120w and you won't notice much heat at all.
Valmond @lemmy.world 3d ago
The 120w xiaomi 13 charging is insane, so I usually "only" uses the 67watt except for "emergency charging", because it heats a little.

55 Comments