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  • It was more attrition by age. New devs came in and didn't fully understand it. The XFree86 vs Xorg war only made that problem worse. Those who came later didn't understand it well enough to continue supporting it. Now you've got young devs not understanding why things are important to its design, and of course, they want to rip it all up and start over. They haven't yet learned the lessons of what made the design choices important.

    • Don't you think that if NOBODY understands it and is willing to support it... maybe it's just fucked?

      There are no actual issues going on with wayland development, you're just being a crybaby about network transparency. It's not even not there, you just don't like that it was implemented later...

      • No, I think the young upstarts didn't bother to learn. They wanted their own toy. Damn right I don't like it was added later. It should have been the first thing! Period! Faster boot times, games, and other toys don't matter. FULL backwards compatibility, stability are all that matters. Pretty doesn't matter.

        • You are a very confident person who knows very little about what they're talking about. All the people who do know what they're talking about, as evidenced by the fact that they used to MAINTAIN X11, say you're wrong. Good luck convincing them. Good luck convincing anybody, why don't you maintain X11?

          • Of course they do not want to admit they were defeated by something better than they could ever produce themselves, as evidenced by their product, Wayland. They inherited the X11 code from their betters and didn't know what to do with it. They not only didn't know how to maintain it, they didn't understand the WHY behind it doing all that it does. So they went out and decided to make the same roomba like mistakes that were made ages ago all over again, ignoring all the lessons learned by their betters. As for me being it's maintainer, I know my limits. They didn't, got in a tiff, and started over and made ... that terribly incomplete thing.

            • ...they started over, and then they made a completely functional thing that could actually be improved, that you don't like because... waypipe wasn't implemented first?

              What exactly is your problem with wayland?

              • It's not X12, and not even half of what X11 was. It was made by people with all the wrong agendas and it still took them over 10 years to come up with something not even half of what X11 was. It (Wayland)... needs... to... die... So that proper resources can be dedicated to making of X12. And if possible, make it forever impossible for any games that aren't Linux native, or just no games at all, which is even better. So many hours wasted on making that wayland and the same for games, resources that should have always been spent on making a real X12.

                • You live in imagination land.

                  Nobody devs x11 because they all hate it, and you think you know better than EVERYBODY who has actually touched the code.

                  Wayland is currently fine, why not take your own advice and make it work better rather than improve something that is so fundamentally broken that literally nobody who has tried thinks it's even possible to fix.

                  You know significantly less than the x11 devs, yet you confidently assert that you have a better solution. Do you honestly think nobody tried to work on x11? Everybody did, and they all gave up, because it's an unworkable mess.

                  • Nothing wrong with a re-write. Just make it backwards compatible and use the same protocols... and most certainly, do not drop core features.

                    • The protocols were fundamentally broken, that's the problem.

                      They destroyed security, they made multiple displays with mixed refreshrates and DPI's impossible, and many other fundamental issues.

                  • If I were ever to contribute code to wayland it would be to try to extinguish it. Still want me to dev on it?

                    • Uh... okay. There's a reason nobody who knows what they're talking about agrees with you, you're a very confident person who knows very little.

124 comments