No, people tune out vegans because they want their treats. Meat is a luxury, and suffering people crave luxury, and so anyone who correctly observes "your luxury is soaked with blood" is going to make enemies. We have so few luxuries under capitalism that people will defend their treats to the death, there's no way to actually convince people to give up meat. I sympathize.
But I'm not going to coddle their commodity fetishism, either. You can’t exist under modern capitalism without having some blood on your hands, but some commodities are more blood soaked than others. They should at least understand what they're eating and think about the system of exploitation they're engaged with.
Besides, giving up the most exploitative commodities is just good sense. I'm certainly not going to demand every cadre be a perfect vegan, it certainly isn't the primary contradiction, but if a discussion about meat comes up I'm going to be honest.
That doesn't touch the underlying and inescapable fact: industrial meat is impossible without hurting and killing workers. Any fully socialist society will move away from meat simply for the fact that the logistics of making it safe make it unsuitable for mass production. We would either ration meat severely so no worker had to mutilate their mind and body to harvest meat for billions of people, or we'd need fully-automated slaughter and meat processing facilities. The simple logistics of meat are a problem when we consider the workers behind it.
That's why I stopped eating meat, because I know I'll have to give it up eventually anyway. Why not start now? It's easy.
You impose your beliefs onto the people that are forced to kill your meat for you. The only way for meat to be a readily available commodity in a world of billions of consumers requires working conditions that lead to early death in slaughterhouses and meat packing plants. Eating meat is social murder.
I really don't care if someone hunts or traps, but if you buy meat at the store there's human blood in your mouth.
If the problem is with the system, then it doesn't matter if an individual person is good or bad. Good people working within horrible systems still do horrible things. They can't do honorable work because that literally is not their job.
They understand, correctly, that no one other than the genocide coalition will support Ukraine.
They don't examine that fact any further, obviously, or else they'd have to ask themselves "Why is it that the only nations that support Ukraine are also nations that support Israel's genocide? What do those things have in common?" They don't have a holistic worldview, they just examine every world historical event in isolation from everything else so they don't have to confront empire.
Democrats use it as an excuse to court centrists and move to the right. So if every loss pushes Democrats to the right, not the left, how exactly do you expect to push them left by costing them elections? In what way does that not make sense? What is the real conclusion? Where did ideas of electoral defeatism originate, and what purpose do they serve?
Can you demonstrate this with data or something? I know that DSA members have been getting elected all over the place since Democrats started losing to Trump with 90% of all DSA members being elected since 2019. I also know that taking money from AIPAC is increasingly seen as politically toxic and elected Democrats are condemning Israel's genocide.
No, people tune out vegans because they want their treats. Meat is a luxury, and suffering people crave luxury, and so anyone who correctly observes "your luxury is soaked with blood" is going to make enemies. We have so few luxuries under capitalism that people will defend their treats to the death, there's no way to actually convince people to give up meat. I sympathize.
But I'm not going to coddle their commodity fetishism, either. You can’t exist under modern capitalism without having some blood on your hands, but some commodities are more blood soaked than others. They should at least understand what they're eating and think about the system of exploitation they're engaged with.
Besides, giving up the most exploitative commodities is just good sense. I'm certainly not going to demand every cadre be a perfect vegan, it certainly isn't the primary contradiction, but if a discussion about meat comes up I'm going to be honest.
That doesn't touch the underlying and inescapable fact: industrial meat is impossible without hurting and killing workers. Any fully socialist society will move away from meat simply for the fact that the logistics of making it safe make it unsuitable for mass production. We would either ration meat severely so no worker had to mutilate their mind and body to harvest meat for billions of people, or we'd need fully-automated slaughter and meat processing facilities. The simple logistics of meat are a problem when we consider the workers behind it.
That's why I stopped eating meat, because I know I'll have to give it up eventually anyway. Why not start now? It's easy.