2mo ago

Is this how plausible deniablity works in XMR?

say someone asked you to open your wallet and asked you where your funds came from, can you just say that you mined it? since XMR cant be trace afaik

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17 comments

I would say depending on who is asking you...
If you have there some xmr valued many hundreds of euros, it is pretty unlikely you actually mined it unless you have some very powerful setup.
If I am the government, then I will ask you: Show me this mining setup. Prove to me that you at least owned or had access to this setup.
I think when we talk about plausible deniability it's not in the context or "Where did this money come from", but more along the lines of "I cannot prove it was actually you who bought this item".
Imagine you buy an item that is restricted or sanctioned in your area, plausible deniability makes it so it is very difficult for me to prove in a court it was you who bought it, and very easy for you to evade these accusations.
If someone forces you to open your wallet, you can just have a second hidden wallet where you keep your stash, and then just open another wallet with, let's say, 5 or 10 euros worth or XMR that you can actually mine in a reasonable amount of time with some old machines.
- I would like to add that if you actually have XMR in a wallet that you got from mining, and you never moved those funds before, you CAN confirm that those funds came from mining. In fact, the GUI wallet will show a symbol indicating that it came from mining (what's called a "coinbase" transaction).
  However you could just say that you moved the funds from the mining wallet to this other wallet, but then I will ask again: Show me the mining wallet that got those mining transactions.
  
  if i do that, pretend i move the mined XMR to my now NEW wallet and you ask " Show me the mining wallet that got those mining transactions.", can i Just say i dont have the mining wallet anymore coz my computer got infected so i move all my xmr to new wallet and forget the old one alltogether?> Show me the mining wallet that got those mining transactions.
  
  Yes you can just say that.
  If someone knows for a fact that you have Monero and they know the exact amount, and want to know where it came from:
  Move them to a new wallet
  I mined these coins a very long time ago, I do not have the mining equipment anymore
  Also the wallet I used to mine them was on an old computer that got infected so I moved all to this new wallet
  
  If someone suspects that you have Monero but does NOT know how much:
  Imagine you own $10k in Monero
  Move a small amount to a wallet ($200??)
  If authorities ask you how much you have, show them the wallet with $200.
  Go back to scenario 1 (I got those 200 from mining a long time ago etc etc)
  
  If no one suspects that you have Monero, and for now you are "in the clear":
  Follow good opsec
  Do not tell anyone that you have Monero
  Do not exchange that Monero for fiat using KYC services. Always use something like Haveno, or use the Monero to buy prepaid cards anonymously to use in shops
  If someone starts suspecting that you might be using Monero but does not know how much, revert to scenario 2
  
  Of course it is better if you avoid anyone knowing you have Monero altogether.
  Remember that you always have the option of moving them to a new wallet, say you got hacked and have no access to it.
  Of course all this depends on your country and how authorities are there. If you live in a very authoritarian area where authorities do not care about evidence and they only care that "you look guilty", nothing will save you. If you live in a country where you must go to court and be proven guilty, I think with Monero its pretty easy to do any of those steps and cover your ass.
  But as always, try to not be discovered using Monero in the first place
  
  Man you are such a genius! it mades clear to me just how anonymous monero is compared to bitcoin.. people say if you mined monero theres some mark on it that its a mined monero like uXTO or some shi like that, but if you move it to new wallet it will immediately clear all those history.. and what you say makes perfectly sense, those $200 new wallet trick is brutal also thanks bruv
  
  thats actually genius, you can just say that your computer got infected before, and move all the funds to new wallet and burned the old one just to be all safe then it cant be track anymore? is that what you trying to say?
  
  Yes that is exactly it.
  That is why you should always make sure to lose all your XMR on a boating accident right after acquiring them 😉
  
  I think im getting what the boating accident mems
- what if I say that I mine it when monero is at low value, then it just get appreciated overtime and become high value... and when they ask me to see the setup, just say that you dont have it anymore coz it was long time ago? is that still work? > me the mining wallet that got those mining transactions.
  
  Yeah you could say that, but as said in another comment, just transfer them to another wallet and claim you lost them in a hack or accident 😄

17 comments