2d ago

What If

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I just want to take a moment to apologize to women for all the bullshit you’ve had to endure, like being treated as interchangeable, objectified, talked down to. None of that is okay, and no one deserves it.
- Apology not accepted. If you personally never did any of the above, then an apology is not needed. Nor is it fair to ask of men to apologize on behalf of other men who did. Women don't want apologies from men who aren't at fault. They just want men to stand up for them.
  I get the sentiment, but wording matters because this is the kind of rhetoric the manosphere loves to take out of context to claim that men have to apologize for just being men.
  
  Sadly your view is not the norm.
  
  It is. And no, I'm not one of the good ones.
  Women are tired of 'man guilt' the same way PoC are tired of white guilt. At best, it's self-depracating. At worse, it's performative. Women want empathy and to be heard, not to hear an empty gesture that then gets weaponized by anti-feminists.
  
  In Vietnamese there's no phrase for "thank you." It's more important to have a thankful attitude. I think we could take a lesson on the situation you're talking about there.
  They use the literal words "thank you", or it's equivalent, for visitors, but that's different.
  
  That's a fair sentiment individually, but it's not just an individual problem.
  Men don't just need to be not part of the problem, they need to actively be part of the solution.
  
  I agree that men should actively be part of the solution, but there is a healthy way of doing it without involving guilt and self-depracation.
  Men's mental health is a critical part of feminism. This is because when men's issues are accepted and destigmatized, it helps destigmatize it for women too. Encouraging mental health support among men means reducing women's role in providing emotional labor.
- What a hero. Line up, ladies, we got an ally over here
- Would be cool if i could smile or show kindness around men without tge near certainty that ill be treated like a piece of meat.
  Instead i need to take joy in denying them that.
- Would you accept an apology from someone who has hit you in the face and is going to hit you again?
  Make it stop first.
  
  Why would someone who has never hit you in the face need to apologize?
  We do not control others actions.
  
  That's why we can't apologize for them. Rachelhazideas @lemmy.world's comment says it better.
  
  Fair point. Accountability > performance. I’ll sit with that.

132 comments