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LG is rolling out a new terms of use and privacy policy agreement. Looking pretty ugly over here with my "Smart TV". What can I do?

It seems to be related to some advertising push from a partner named Alfonso that is gathering information cross-platform anything that appears on your screen and pushing advertising to you during playback.

Hopefully not, but that's what it looks like from early reading.

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82 comments

  • I have my LGs connected, but logged out.

    It's a hassle in that it requires to log in and then back out for mandatory updates of some apps (others will update without a logout, for some reason), but at least it removes the need to agree to a whole bunch of their garbage and add it to an identifying account.

    I would keep it offline and use a set-top box, but I have family members that aren't tech savvy and won't want more hassle than pressing the "Netlfix" button on the remote.

    I'll say that even they are increasingly annoyed at the constant cookie prompts during live TV watching. Honestly broadcast TV is an absolute hellscape these days.

    • Honestly broadcast TV is an absolute hellscape these days.

      As a former broadcaster, I just want to point out that actual broadcast TV is the one place you won’t get this. Plug an antenna into the back of your TV and you’ll get the signals from your local station with none of the tracking. It’s a one-way street; the transmitter antenna pumps the signal out from however many miles away and gets nothing back from you. Your local station probably prefers that you watch that way or on a traditional cable box (cable companies usually have to pay the local stations); they don’t really get much from you watching a streaming service. The streaming services like Peacock or Paramount+ let the networks largely bypass the local stations.

      • No, you absolutely get this.

        Maybe because cookie warnings are mandatory here, I am PAINFULLY aware of when the layer of TV malware is pulling info to go along with the TV broadcast. I dismiss advertising cookie warnings in three separate TVs on a daily basis. Once per channel, even. It's incredibly obnoxious.

        For the record, the data mining is not happening over the broadcast. It's the TV software that is pulling watch data and then repackaging along with the broadcaster and selling it to advertisers. I know because they are mandated to disclose it, so they make me read about it a dozen times a day.

        • Maybe because cookie warnings are mandatory here, I am PAINFULLY aware of when the layer of TV malware is pulling info to go along with the TV broadcast.

          Is this because you have internet connected TVs when you're watching OTA?

          • Sometimes the TV, sometimes the settop cable box that also handles broadcast TV (and data mines it). Because, as I said elsewhere, family members are not tech-savvy and want the ability to watch streaming services from their remote without having to switch back and forth to multiple devices depending on what they want to watch.

            But to be clear, this is with the TVs logged off from first party services. The data gathering is just baked into the TV's OS.

            • But to be clear, this is with the TVs logged off from first party services. The data gathering is just baked into the TV’s OS.

              I think we're in agreement that its baked into the TV, so the solution (in most people's cases) is to not connect the TV directly to the internet so irrespective of what the OS may want to do it wouldn't have the ability to. I understand in your case you have folks in your household that are requiring that direct connection.

              Perhaps a strategy in the future for you would be to buy a replacement TV without Smart built in so that there wouldn't even be the option to attach it to the internet.

              • Yeah, but then what? I mean, at least one of the TVs isn't using the TV OS, it's using the cable box. And guess what? the exact same malware is baked into the cable box's OS.

                And of course the same data tracking is baked into the apps themselves, and it's baked into the Apple, Google and Amazon mainstream versions of add-on support. And on the Microsoft and Sony consoles that will do the same service for some streaming tools.

                So yeah, if you're tech-savvy you can either block ads upstream or set up a dedicated media device built from the ground up for non-shittified streaming while keeping legacy old-school non-cable broadcast running like it's the 20th century but in the real world that's a protest action, not a functional service.

                • Yeah, but then what? I mean, at least one of the TVs isn’t using the TV OS, it’s using the cable box. And guess what? the exact same malware is baked into the cable box’s OS.

                  Perhaps I misunderstood what problem you're trying to solve.

                  My understanding of the problem you're trying to solve was ads being offered up directly on your TV because they were injected on top of the content you're displaying. This could be in the form of idle time ads where you pause TV and the TV knows this and displays ads over top of your paused content. Or even some of the most insidious ones that overlay ads on top of your content in motion. Even OTA isn't fully immune. ATSC 3.0 has this kind of tracking and response built into it if you allow it by hooking it up to the internet. All of the statements I've made are to remove this type of ad interaction.

                  With your recent statements I think you're talking about is simply ad tracking in the sense of data collected on your TV is then used by advertisers to serve you ads on your computer, phone, and tablet interactions. Is that right? If so, the only answer there is consumption of TV content completely offline (DVD/Bluray) or OTA TV on a device not connected to the internet.

                  • Oh, no, that's not it. Or not entirely. They definitely do inject ads sometimes, often for proprietary services more than sold products.

                    The real issue is that they are also doing on-device display analysis for statistic data mining. Effectively snooping on your usage behavior to sell the data for advertising.

                    I don't even mind that much, but the problem is with the current local regulations that means they have to pop up cookie acceptance prompts. And if you don't accept them they keep trying. Constantly. The prompts are way more intrusive than the ads, but I'm also not inclined to reward their very deliberate dark patterns with a blank check to mine my data. At least in the old days of audience meters they'd pay you some or at least send you a gift basket or something.

                    • I don’t even mind that much, but the problem is with the current local regulations that means they have to pop up cookie acceptance prompts. And if you don’t accept them they keep trying. Constantly. The prompts are way more intrusive than the ads, but I’m also not inclined to reward their very deliberate dark patterns with a blank check to mine my data. At least in the old days of audience meters they’d pay you some or at least send you a gift basket or something.

                      Okay so my assumption was correct that you're talking about required unwanted interaction/intrusion on your TV. I'll go back to my point before then of "get a TV that doesn't have Smart features, so it can't be connected to the internet".

                      And you said:

                      Yeah, but then what? I mean, at least one of the TVs isn’t using the TV OS, it’s using the cable box. And guess what? the exact same malware is baked into the cable box’s OS.

                      My response is: Get rid of the cable box, then if its an avenue where they're popping up stuff in the middle of your TV you don't want.

                      We're an OTA (ATSC 1.0), streaming, and offline (DVD/Bluray usually from the Public Library) content household only with no TVs connected directly to the internet. We get none of what you're describing with pop-ups or interference with watching TV.

                      • And we are back to my original objection: That is a restriction based on activism, not practicality. I can do that for myself, but not for every family member. It's not reasonable to tell someone that they won't be watching this or that show, despite being bundled in our cable, which is in turn bundled with our internet package, because I'm annoyed at privacy pop-ups. It's not reasonably to tell everybody in the house that we're cancelling all of our streaming services, which are routed through the offending hardware, because we're a Bluray-only household now, I've decided.

                        Both the structure of the service and the implementation are now industry standard. You can go "off the grid" with some effort and enduring some restrictions, but you can't choose to keep the same level of service and not use the mandatory cable box your cable provided installs if you still want to have access to cable channels.

                        I didn't even have OTA TV last time I was living alone. All I really need is a disc player, a tablet and a computer. Now I'm not living alone I don't get to be fussy on principle because I don't like having to click "opt out of cookies" every time I want to watch the news. It's already a stretch to insist on rejecting all the cookie prompts instead of accepting the intrusion for convenience.

                        So very happy about how high your horse is in your unabomber media setup, but that's not practical for me or in general.

    • What else would you use to watch? I used to have my TV offline and watch through a Firestick and airplay, but now the Firestick is worse than the TV apps. I need a new media streamer, but even Roku has enshittified. At this point my only hope is Apple but Apple TV hasn’t been updated in three years

      …. Or I might just give up, since Netflix decided my TV is not part of my household so I need a 2fa every time I want to watch.

82 comments